Starliner Test Flight

Pilot Fighter said:
With a couple of exceptions, like the dark matter project, there’s not a lot of significant research going on up there.

Most of the research involves how humans react to living in space environments. Our bodies hate space and deep space travel is a whimsical dream.
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Well, not if we make the really-big, sci-fi-film, rotation-around-an-axis-artificial-gravitational-field space ship. Just think of the economic benefits (to the contractors) of such a behemoth!

Then again, that would assume that all those "-nauts" were awake and walking around exercising their "natural" antigravity skeletal and muscular systems... And awake, then they'd have, what? If they started young, another 40-60 years useful life to make a minimum 1000 light-year journey? Yeah, good luck with your ongoing Federal expenditure suck! You're certainly earning it!
 
Realistically, if we make some kind of physical contact with other star-systems, it will be via mechanical means. We're not packing these pathetic meat-sacks in to radiation-shielding for 1000 years (best case) and then pooping them back out again, good as new.

That said, the 60s sci-fi novels aren't as dumb as a lot of them seemed, in retrospect. Even within the bounds of currently-understood Physics (which I think are almost certainly the real Physics with which we will be dealing for the foreseeable future), one can *certainly* send AI-capable computers out there. It might just be a thin simulacrum of organic life, but the message carries. It's the only circumstance I can imagine in which the message is heard. And potentially returned. But I think it's a relatively high-order-of-probability shot.
 
Boris Badenov said:
… We're not packing these pathetic meat-sacks in to radiation-shielding for 1000 years (best case) and then pooping them back out again, good as new….
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The other tactic for interstellar travel, generational ships, when you look at it, fails from an ethical standpoint. Even if we had the tech, and could convince enough people to go that there would be a viable population size, consider what generation 2.0 is confronted with. You would have a whole generation of people who would be born, live, and die aboard that ship, without ever having the chance to freely consent to being a part of the mission. They can’t leave, and quite a few generations face the same thing. You can argue that colonists here on earth subjected their children to the same thing, but at least they could leave, or try to anyhow.

Not going to be an issue in my timeline I suppose, but at some point we might also have to confront that Mars ain’t the kinda place to raise a kid…
 
invadertim said:
Not going to be an issue in my timeline I suppose, but at some point we might also have to confront that Mars ain’t the kinda place to raise a kid…
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It's not a realistic prospect, imho. Only because other ways of, eh, "reaching out" will become available rather rapidly. Now, whether it's reasonable to be "reaching out" is a separate question, but, imho, if the universe really is a Dark Forest, we've already screwed ourselves, so. Make the best of it.
 
form810 said:
Yeah, Edison did exemplary wanker=work keeping "tossers" and "parasites" like Tesla "at bay".

Dude? Really?

IDK, me? I would very seldom have even the inclination to call ANYONE with whom I didn't have personal interactions a "wanker". But, I guess, that's just me. Another part of me is NOT to make ridiculous, uninformed statements regarding history about which I have no knowledge other than a few non-vetted, non-peer-reviewed videos on the toobs.
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Sorry. If I’m going to engage in conversation with a machine, its going to be to ask my toaster oven how it gets my bagels that perfect mix of crunchy and chewy.
 
invadertim said:
The other tactic for interstellar travel, generational ships, when you look at it, fails from an ethical standpoint. Even if we had the tech, and could convince enough people to go that there would be a viable population size, consider what generation 2.0 is confronted with. You would have a whole generation of people who would be born, live, and die aboard that ship, without ever having the chance to freely consent to being a part of the mission. They can’t leave, and quite a few generations face the same thing. You can argue that colonists here on earth subjected their children to the same thing, but at least they could leave, or try to anyhow.

Not going to be an issue in my timeline I suppose, but at some point we might also have to confront that Mars ain’t the kinda place to raise a kid…
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Counterpoint; what are the ethical implications to not send a generational ship if we could? Fully believe Carl Sagan et al were correct that we need to get off planet (and further afield) for our species’ ultimate survival so if there comes a point where we’ve identified a potential habitable planet within reach of a generational ship…why shouldn’t we?

Also, kids never get consent anyway right?
 
bike21 said:
Counterpoint; what are the ethical implications to not send a generational ship if we could? Fully believe Carl Sagan et al were correct that we need to get off planet (and further afield) for our species’ ultimate survival so if there comes a point where we’ve identified a potential habitable planet within reach of a generational ship…why shouldn’t we?

Also, kids never get consent anyway right?
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Well, consider what gen 2.0 is going to have for a life; your living in a high tech prison, limited/no ability to change your conditions, and really only there to maintain the ship & conceive the next generation. It will be the same for dozens of generations. And while Sagan & etc might be right, you’re drafting thousands just to keep our breed of meatbag around, maybe.

As for kids and consent, I suppose the difference is the kids on the ship have no ability to change their fate. It’s kind of a form of heredity indentured servitude.
 
invadertim said:
Well, consider what gen 2.0 is going to have for a life; your living in a high tech prison, limited/no ability to change your conditions, and really only there to maintain the ship & conceive the next generation. It will be the same for dozens of generations. And while Sagan & etc might be right, you’re drafting thousands just to keep our breed of meatbag around, maybe.

As for kids and consent, I suppose the difference is the kids on the ship have no ability to change their fate. It’s kind of a form of heredity indentured servitude.
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I don’t disagree, but providing context that if we don’t make those decisions is it more/less ethical than dooming us to extinction? Assuming that’s a possible outcome of not sending such a ship? It’ll be many generations from us that’ll have to answer that of course, and I hope they have the opportunity to ask such a question from a technological standpoint.
 
invadertim said:
Well, consider what gen 2.0 is going to have for a life; your living in a high tech prison, limited/no ability to change your conditions, and really only there to maintain the ship & conceive the next generation. It will be the same for dozens of generations. And while Sagan & etc might be right, you’re drafting thousands just to keep our breed of meatbag around, maybe.

As for kids and consent, I suppose the difference is the kids on the ship have no ability to change their fate. It’s kind of a form of heredity indentured servitude.
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So you're talking about modern society, right? ;p
 
bike21 said:
I don’t disagree, but providing context that if we don’t make those decisions is it more/less ethical than dooming us to extinction? Assuming that’s a possible outcome of not sending such a ship? It’ll be many generations from us that’ll have to answer that of course, and I hope they have the opportunity to ask such a question from a technological standpoint.
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I think we should let natural selection work. If we pollute ourselves into extinction, we shouldn't be able to find another planet to just do it all over again.
 
I write science fiction. It's something I'm passionate about, and I love it.

But there's currently one (1) planet that we know of that can support life. It is, in fact, absolutely ideal for your species, with big blue oceans, lush green hills, snowy mountains and wide fields of grain.

If you can't get your • together and live here, what chance do you possibly have of living anywhere else?
 
tlove482 said:
I think we should let natural selection work. If we pollute ourselves into extinction, we shouldn't be able to find another planet to just do it all over again.
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It isn’t about just that though, I’m one of the biggest tree huggers here and of course feel we don’t do nearly enough to protect this planet. But rather the potential of a larger cataclysmic event out of our hands. I mean, if we’re lucky enough to stick around until the sun swallows the Earth there’s that. But hopefully we are interstellar space faring long, long, looooong before that.

As the only conscious beings we know of, we can’t stick our heads in the cosmic sand.
 
🦈💜 said:
I write science fiction. It's something I'm passionate about, and I love it.

But there's currently one (1) planet that we know of that can support life. It is, in fact, absolutely ideal for your species, with big blue oceans, lush green hills, snowy mountains and wide fields of grain.

If you can't get your • together and live here, what chance do you possibly have of living anywhere else?
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Sure, how does one achieve those things?
 
Boris Badenov said:
Meanwhile Boeing can't get the thing that does the same thing as SpaceX's thing to work. Wouldn't it be hilarious if the crew had to come back on a Dragon?

I think we're safe from having to make the tough calls on crewing a generation ship anytime soon.
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Boeing gonna Boeing.
 
bike21 said:
Sure, how does one achieve those things?
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Burn the patriarchy, overthrow capitalism*, and come together as a species to recognize that your level of technological advancement has exceeded your capabilities to integrate with your atavistic urges. Cast out the would-be dictators, autocrats, and populists—violently, if necessary. Accept that technological advancement in industrialization and militarization won't fix the world by itself, and accept, as a species, a lower standard of living with a higher quality of life. End reliance on natural resource exploitation and fossil fuels by reverting to agrarianism by incentivizing the restoration of the natural environment.

* You can start this process by eliminating the liability shield of corporations, and holding the board of directors civilly and criminally liable for company misconduct.

You guys realize that the world is on a course of absolute madness, right? That colonizing mars is absolutely insane? Earth at its worst, with this awful course taken five hundred years into the future, will still be infinitely better than Mars can ever possibly be.
 
🦈💜 said:
Burn the patriarchy, overthrow capitalism*, and come together as a species to recognize that your level of technological advancement has exceeded your capabilities to integrate with your atavistic urges. Cast out the would-be dictators, autocrats, and populists—violently, if necessary. Accept that technological advancement in industrialization and militarization won't fix the world by itself, and accept, as a species, a lower standard of living with a higher quality of life. End reliance on natural resource exploitation and fossil fuels by reverting to agrarianism by incentivizing the restoration of the natural environment.

* You can start this process by eliminating the liability shield of corporations, and holding the board of directors civilly and criminally liable for company misconduct.

You guys realize that the world is on a course of absolute madness, right? That colonizing mars is absolutely insane? Earth at its worst, with this awful course taken five hundred years into the future, will still be infinitely better than Mars can ever possibly be.
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What role do you suppose you'd play in this future agrarian future? Are you assuming you'd be management or a worker bee? Agrarian societies historically and currently have used slavery because humans are naturally lazy and if given the opportunity will have someone else do their work for them. The reason technology has advanced to where it is now is based on that fact. Write a book by hand, if you want a lot of people to read your words write it by hand again a thousand times or invent a printing press. Move you and your family from the East Coast to the West Coast in a wagon or on foot or invent the steam locomotive. I understand your consternation with the modern world but there's no convincing the entirety of humanity to just stop advancing or even more unlikely purposefully regressing, the folks that agreed to do so would be immediately taken advantage of by other folks who can sniff out an easy target. If you want a current example of your Utopia look no further than Afghanistan, those folks have repelled the efforts of both superpowers and still throw rocks at each other, I wouldn't suggest you go there for a number of reasons.
 
🦈💜 said:
Burn the patriarchy, overthrow capitalism*, and come together as a species to recognize that your level of technological advancement has exceeded your capabilities to integrate with your atavistic urges. Cast out the would-be dictators, autocrats, and populists—violently, if necessary. Accept that technological advancement in industrialization and militarization won't fix the world by itself, and accept, as a species, a lower standard of living with a higher quality of life. End reliance on natural resource exploitation and fossil fuels by reverting to agrarianism by incentivizing the restoration of the natural environment.

* You can start this process by eliminating the liability shield of corporations, and holding the board of directors civilly and criminally liable for company misconduct.

You guys realize that the world is on a course of absolute madness, right? That colonizing mars is absolutely insane? Earth at its worst, with this awful course taken five hundred years into the future, will still be infinitely better than Mars can ever possibly be.
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This won't sit well with some.

Five hundred years in the future? I'm happy to pay my electric bill when it's due🤷‍♂️

According to the CDC, I've got 3.6 years left to hit "average." Gonna' do my damndest to increase that figure.

Everyone I know, from friends to kids to grandkids, will be long dead in five hundred years. Crap, likely in seventy or eighty.

Colonize space or wreck the planet upon which we live. The choice isn't mine or yours to make, although we can certainly plant the seeds for dreamers we will never know which will, maybe, one day come to fruition.
 
Bob Ridpath said:
This won't sit well with some.

Five hundred years in the future? I'm happy to pay my electric bill when it's due🤷‍♂️

According to the CDC, I've got 3.6 years left to hit "average." Gonna' do my damndest to increase that figure.

Everyone I know, from friends to kids to grandkids, will be long dead in five hundred years. Crap, likely in seventy or eighty.

Colonize space or wreck the planet upon which we live. The choice isn't mine or yours to make, although we can certainly plant the seeds for dreamers we will never know which will, maybe, one day come to fruition.
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I wonder how happy he'd be if a solar flare took us back to the 1800's.
 
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