Spirit Airlines Strike Update

lostplanetairman said:
You need to post this on the "other sites" where everyone is bashing it.
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I'm always hesitant to get into big debates about TAs for other pilot groups. The Spirit pilots should make their own decisions based on what is important for them without outside interference.

I've seen the ignorant comments posted on the other forums by both Spirit and non-Spirit pilots, and it's clear that these guys have no idea what the process is like and what is realistically achievable. But I wouldn't worry about it, because the loudmouth malcontents like that on the internets are usually a distinct minority. I predict that the TA will be ratified by at least a 2 to 1 margin.

Enjoy the new contract. You guys definitely earned it.
 
By the way, thanks for your help during the strike (as well as to everyone else). The hours dedicated were amazing and the people I met were amazing. Now I'm off to sleep for requal.
 
I should post what our management offered for an insurance package in front of the NMB yesterday. Might be better off just getting COBRA if we had agreed to it....
 
Mesa essentially doesn't have medical insurance anymore. Since 2006 all new hires only have the option of a plan with an annual maximum of 25,000 and a lifetime maximum of 100,000. Despite being illegal per our CBA the MEC wouldn't pursue the issue because OJ said if they did he would make it legal by yanking the good health insurance the pre-2006 hires had so we would all be equal.
 
SpiraMirabilis said:
Mesa essentially doesn't have medical insurance anymore. Since 2006 all new hires only have the option of a plan with an annual maximum of 25,000 and a lifetime maximum of 100,000. Despite being illegal per our CBA the MEC wouldn't pursue the issue because OJ said if they did he would make it legal by yanking the good health insurance the pre-2006 hires had so we would all be equal.
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Let this be a lesson to everyone involved in negotiations. Get your health insurance spelled out in the contract......
 
All the Mesa CBA says is that they have to offer to the pilots any insurance offered to any other employee. That seems good on the face until you realize what lengths OJ was willing to go.
 
SpiraMirabilis said:
All the Mesa CBA says is that they have to offer to the pilots any insurance offered to any other employee. That seems good on the face until you realize what lengths OJ was willing to go.
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That's.....crappy. I'm sure SOMEONE thought this was a good idea because they'd offer what management got. The wording, however, means all they have to offer is the ramper health care.
 
If management gets something better then the pilots have to get offered it too. Management doesn't have anything better, my belief is that OJ increased their salaries to compensate for crappy health insurance or something.
 
So the road shows start this week and voting is scheduled for 7/12-7/22.

It has been interesting to see the power of the internet. As soon as our union released the draft, someone posted it on the internet and everyone and anyone commented on it, not knowing what our group wants, what we have been through or what the NMB feels is reasonable (ie will they support us if we reject this that they consider to be the best proposal). I love the posts that instruct us to burn the company down.

There is so much mis-information about this contract and I hope those with a stake will attend the road shows. And I hope those without a stake will refrain from trying to sway opinions!
 
ATN_Pilot said:
...or have the radical fringe driven everyone to make a huge mistake?
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I think that's a little much isn't it Todd?

It's as simple as a Yes or No Vote. If the majority votes No then the process starts over again. I don't see how that is a huge mistake.
 
jhugz said:
I think that's a little much isn't it Todd?

It's as simple as a Yes or No Vote. If the majority votes No then the process starts over again. I don't see how that is a huge mistake.
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I think it's likely that the NMB would recommend to the President that he issue a PEB if the pilots were to reject the contract and try to go back on strike. A PEB would end the strike, and it's likely that the PEB would issue a recommendation very similar to the TA. If the pilots still refuse to accept it at that point, then Congress can legislate it for them.

It's unlikely that the White House is going to allow the same pilot group to go on strike twice in one summer.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
Based on what you're hearing on the line, do you think it will be ratified, or have the radical fringe driven everyone to make a huge mistake?
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I haven not run into any of the radical fringe. Everyone I've spoken with recognizes it for what it is. Prior to the strike, the company wanted $30MM in concessions. Then, at 3:30 AM on the 12th, they produced a cost neutral proposal which was rejected. When called back a few days later, they demanded that the pilots pay for the cost of the strike. The mediator made the proposals that were the basis for the TA which results in gains of $70MM to the pilots over 5 years.

And, as my wife pointed out, much of what they've done to the health insurance will be undone in January as the plan is no longer grandfathered and will then have to follow the time frame of health care reform.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
I think it's likely that the NMB would recommend to the President that he issue a PEB if the pilots were to reject the contract and try to go back on strike. A PEB would end the strike, and it's likely that the PEB would issue a recommendation very similar to the TA. If the pilots still refuse to accept it at that point, then Congress can legislate it for them.

It's unlikely that the White House is going to allow the same pilot group to go on strike twice in one summer.
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Jesus, I just can't support this system.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
Based on what you're hearing on the line, do you think it will be ratified, or have the radical fringe driven everyone to make a huge mistake?
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OK so there are two super senior 15 + year check airmen who are very radical and are trying to rally the junior pilots to support them!
 
ATN_Pilot said:
The system resulted in them getting a contract with $70 million in improvements when management was seeking $30 million in concessions. Seemed to work pretty good to me.
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This is also the same system that put 9E on ice after management slapped us across the face with a concession. Until I see some sort of positive changes out of this, I still say it's broken. Maybe we shot ourselves in the foot when some misguided people decided the pilot group deserve to "take a look" at TA1, but I don't think that's what this is about. Per this system, management is allowed to change any policy they want at will as long as it doesn't violate the current CBA. If WE change anything, it's violating status quo. They can apparently institute bonus programs, change attendance policies and intimidate the pilot group as much as they want with no repercussions.....and save money doing it. Then if we try to fight back, we get slapped down. I know the laws, and I know how the system works, but that doesn't mean I agree with it or like it. It's SERIOUSLY slanted in management's favor.
 
kellwolf said:
It's SERIOUSLY slanted in management's favor.
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Without a doubt. I have no doubt it my mind that the contract that Spirit is voting on now has nothing to do w/ NMB and everything to do w/ a workforce striking and a company going out of biz if they don't pull their crap together.
 
jhugz said:
I think that's a little much isn't it Todd?

It's as simple as a Yes or No Vote. If the majority votes No then the process starts over again. I don't see how that is a huge mistake.
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hugz, you are correct. You and the Spirit pilots have earned the right to listen, ask tough questions and make decisions based on what's best for YOUR fellow pilots and your families.

It's unfortunate that ATN's posts are coming directly from ALPA leadership who is trying to find out how you think, discredit anyone who may oppose the TA, and scare you into voting how they want.

Truth be told, ATN has NO INSIGHT whatsoever into what the NMB might decide if you chose to vote it down. There are many options, a PEB is but one. Both sides could also be ordered back to the table to fix certain sections to get it to pass. Or they could go to the other extreme and do nothing...highly doubtful.

MAKE YOUR OWN DECISIONS. No one on this board has a direct line to the NMB. And if they did, the NMB would not be out there influencing your vote anyway.

There's only self styled "expert" doing that. He's doing it for the one's that are pushing you to vote yes.

You guys are smarter and tougher than that. Don't be foolish, and at the same time, don't get suckered. Everyone here is proud of how you guys stood up. You'll figure it out on this one as well.
 
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