Southwest pilot arrested in SAV

Richman said:
At some point adults started to express the gene for lactase, something that was typically lost a few years after birth and thus were able to gain nutrition from milk. From what I read, that happened in a blink from an evolutionary standpoint.
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I take (and agree with) your larger point, but this would be (in my dumbass parlance) a "low-cost" evolutionary adjustment. A snip here, a snip there, hell you could drink the stuff when you were 2, and it's highly nutritious (and probably more importantly, calorie-rich). And hey, look, we have these cows right over here...
 
Boris Badenov said:
I take (and agree with) your larger point, but this would be (in my dumbass parlance) a "low-cost" evolutionary adjustment. A snip here, a snip there, hell you could drink the stuff when you were 2, and it's highly nutritious (and probably more importantly, calorie-rich).
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By the same token I doubt our ape ancestors got the runs every time they drank water that wasn’t filtered.
 
Roger Roger said:
By the same token I doubt our ape ancestors got the runs every time they drank water that wasn’t filtered.
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Of course. But I think that's at the "cheapest" level of evolution. Probably not even correct to call it evolution. The machinery to be (somewhat) resistant to various microbes in poop-water is probably still there, but it hasn't been hitting the gym.
 
Roger Roger said:
By the same token I doubt our ape ancestors got the runs every time they drank water that wasn’t filtered.
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That's vastly more likely to be adaptive than evolutionary.

Evolution isn't even close to the entire expressive picture; there are many non-genetic adaptive factors and even spontaneous mutation.

It's really better to think of a human organism as an adaptive colony, shaped by its distant past but responsive to its environment, even multigenerationally. Just as a little pocket example, we all live with staphylococcus all over our skin, and very often colonizing our noses. When things are in balance, a bacterial diversity and healthy immune response leads to the inability of any one particular bacterium to create a systemic problem. In fact, we have some "good" bacteria such as c. difficile that serve a normal function in the gut that will overcolonize without the environmental pressure of other bacteria and cause significant or even severe health outcomes.

Ultimately, even things like vector-borne illnesses from mosquitos, ticks and parasites can act as environmental or evolutionary imperatives to trigger adaptation or pressures that lead to selection.

Pop-culture "natural selection" assumes a spherical universe in a vacuum; it's an excellent starting point for mapping the relationship between a species and related or ancestral species, but once humans evolved to a societal level, different pressures applied. You actually can observe that in non-human contexts, as well.
 
CoffeeIcePapers said:
I think their situation is a little more complicated than genetics.
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Of course. Wildly more complicated, and none of the other factors speak well of modernity. But the prevalence is *so* high and the history of the availability of alcohol so settled that it's very difficult to dismiss the probability of genetic influences, imho.
 
FlyingAccountant said:
Where do you ride at, Derglas?

I hit up Hawes pretty often as I live about 10 minutes away from it. I need to diversify a bit.
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We have some technical single-track around the neighborhood (it’s a pretty cool neighborhood with a lean toward hiking and biking), McDowell Moutain Ranch Park on the other side of the Mountains with low techinicals but super flowy. But Tom’s Thumb and the Lost Dog trail are nearby favorites.
 
Boris Badenov said:
If one has ever flown Medevac on the Rez, I confidently predict that one will not be skeptical of the "genetic component" theory of alcoholism.
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CoffeeIcePapers said:
I think their situation is a little more complicated than genetics.
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We get a lot of native kids, from the local rez here in Phoenix for behavioral health, becausethere are no services where they live. We get them as far away as Farmington and Shiprock NM. Whenever we get a native kid in they're almost feral.

They're always dealing with systemic trauma of almost every spectrum. Neglect, emotional, physical, attachment disorders and especially sexual trauma. The rez is a • hellscape.

Even the local rez of Phoenix with the Salt River tribe and the Gila River tribe. Both local tribes have casinos and their people get money. Like $4k and up. But I hear stories a lot from the kids, that they're parents steal their casino money from them. Extort, threaten violence and actually physically assault them for their monthly casino money.

The rez kids are drug addicts, alcoholics and survivors of child rape and multiple suicide attempts. Because of all the trauma that they've had to endure their entire lives at the hands of both family, friends, strangers and associates.

The Navajo tribe up in Northern AZ. about three years ago, finally got electricity for the entire rez. Get that through your head.
 
🦈💜 said:
That's vastly more likely to be adaptive than evolutionary.

Evolution isn't even close to the entire expressive picture; there are many non-genetic adaptive factors and even spontaneous mutation.

It's really better to think of a human organism as an adaptive colony, shaped by its distant past but responsive to its environment, even multigenerationally. Just as a little pocket example, we all live with staphylococcus all over our skin, and very often colonizing our noses. When things are in balance, a bacterial diversity and healthy immune response leads to the inability of any one particular bacterium to create a systemic problem. In fact, we have some "good" bacteria such as c. difficile that serve a normal function in the gut that will overcolonize without the environmental pressure of other bacteria and cause significant or even severe health outcomes.

Ultimately, even things like vector-borne illnesses from mosquitos, ticks and parasites can act as environmental or evolutionary imperatives to trigger adaptation or pressures that lead to selection.

Pop-culture "natural selection" assumes a spherical universe in a vacuum; it's an excellent starting point for mapping the relationship between a species and related or ancestral species, but once humans evolved to a societal level, different pressures applied. You actually can observe that in non-human contexts, as well.
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Well said.

My son couldn't read house numbers from the street when he was 4, and quickly got glasses. His brother had glasses at about that age, too. Genes came from his mom's side. I'm 42 with near perfect vision.

Thanks to modern society, there's no evolutionary advantage to having good vision, and due to modern medicine, we can easily correct poor vision in most cases. Thus, more people with bad eye sight pass along their genes. Natural selection for good vision is absent.
 
arkavgal said:
Well said.

My son couldn't read house numbers from the street when he was 4, and quickly got glasses. His brother had glasses at about that age, too. Genes came from his mom's side. I'm 42 with near perfect vision.

Thanks to modern society, there's no evolutionary advantage to having good vision, and due to modern medicine, we can easily correct poor vision in most cases. Thus, more people with bad eye sight pass along their genes. Natural selection for good vision is absent.
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I can pass for 20/20, all squinty, but wear glasses for comfort when I read.
 
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