Slipping a seminole...

Gbh1268

New Member
is it safe to slip a seminole...Most of the instructors around here say its not safe, but that's only cause thats "what I heard"...is it safe or not to slip a light twin, specifically a seminole....sorry if this is a bit incoherant i have had a few beverageges this evening.
 

kevmor99

Well-Known Member
Is this for landing? I'm not sure why you'd need to, even with no flaps you can pull back the power and get a really good descent rate going on.
 

Gbh1268

New Member
no reason in particular...oh i know the thing just drops out of the sky, just is it safe to do or not is the question?
 

tgrayson

New Member
is it safe or not to slip a light twin, specifically a seminole
Absolutely. I used to slip the Seneca all the time and had students do it. Kudos to you for intuiting that a twin is just an airplane.

If you're still uncomfortable, do it at altitude first, but realize that if you can't forward slip it, you can't sideslip it in a crosswind, either, because the aerodynamics are identical. It's the same maneuver.
 

ProudPilot

Aeronautics Geek
Of Course it's safe to slip a seminole. When you fly single-engine, you will usually fly it in a sideslip for training, until you grasp the zero-sideslip. We use the zero-sideslip for maximum performance with the remaining engine, not because a sideslip is dangerous.
 

ljg

Well-Known Member
I'm not trying to start a "purist" fight here but I believe you can very safely slip a Lear Jet to landing. FWIW - I used to slip a Seminole all the time.
 

sorrygottarunway

Well-Known Member
When I was going through my CFI stuff at ATP I always was yelled at for it. "You are not supposed to slip this aircraft!"

I asked why, or what POH had this, and no one could find any good reason other than, "you just aren't supposed to. Its sloppy." I don't think its sloppy at all!
 

Blip16

Well-Known Member
i am pretty sure the POH recommends against prolonged slips (greater than 2min) but i am not sure why you would do a forward slip for more than 2 minutes.
 

Sidious

Well-Known Member
Perhaps they were against forward slipping to landing? I know that is looked down on at my school because they say it is poor airmanship. I don't agree with that and I use them on power off 180s if I get to high because on that maneuver you have ways of reducing altitude but no way of getting it back.

Its a viable maneuver that the aircraft is capable of doing so why not use it? It is another tool to use to control the aircraft.
 

tgrayson

New Member
i am pretty sure the POH recommends against prolonged slips (greater than 2min) but i am not sure why you would do a forward slip for more than 2 minutes.
That's a fuel unporting issue, and the single engines have the same warning.
 

ILS37R

Well-Known Member
When I was going through my CFI stuff at ATP I always was yelled at for it. "You are not supposed to slip this aircraft!"

I asked why, or what POH had this, and no one could find any good reason other than, "you just aren't supposed to. Its sloppy." I don't think its sloppy at all!
Eh, I had an ATP guy swear up and down to me that a single-engine go-around was impossible in the Seminole and, in fact, there wasn't even a procedure for it. So I opened up the POH and showed it to him. Granted, eeking a viable go-around climb out of the PA-44 on a single-engine isn't something I'd ever want to do, but the procedure is in there.

Many large flight schools have very rigid procedures and, in my experience, instructors tend to get complacent in their knowledge and airmanship and simply accept those procedures as aircraft limitations when, in fact, they are not.

But back on topic--and I'm just echoing here--in single-engine ops you're configuring for the similar-feeling zero side-slip, and the forward slip is still a great way to lose excess altitude for a safe landing.
 

ILS37R

Well-Known Member
Eh? In single-engine ops, the goal is to avoid slips (as in zero sideslip).
Curses! Foiled by quick-typing word exclusion! Right, right, zero side-slipping.

::stealthily goes off to edit earlier post... nothing to see here::
 

nosehair

Well-Known Member
eeking a viable go-around climb out of the PA-44 on a single-engine
is exactly what we are supposed to do in training. The 'eeking' you speak of is precisely the skill that needs the practice.

This is an example of the mindset that has eroded training in aviation in general in the past 20 years: if it's hard to do, just don't do it. Make up all kind of excuses, like how dangerous it is, or how 'useless' it is, or how it shows how bad your judgement is because you shouldn't be there in the first place.

Practicing a single-engine go-around and finding that best actual indicated airspeed and zero-sideslip configuration to obtaning best ROC is one of the best things you can do in M. E. training.

But,...it's like the slips and spins (SE) that actually increase pilot performance (command of the machine), but since thay are not PTS tested, thay are not taught, and have not been for so long, they have become alien and 'dangerous'.

(Heavy Sigh)
 

Blip16

Well-Known Member
is exactly what we are supposed to do in training. The 'eeking' you speak of is precisely the skill that needs the practice.

This is an example of the mindset that has eroded training in aviation in general in the past 20 years: if it's hard to do, just don't do it. Make up all kind of excuses, like how dangerous it is, or how 'useless' it is, or how it shows how bad your judgement is because you shouldn't be there in the first place.

Practicing a single-engine go-around and finding that best actual indicated airspeed and zero-sideslip configuration to obtaning best ROC is one of the best things you can do in M. E. training.

But,...it's like the slips and spins (SE) that actually increase pilot performance (command of the machine), but since thay are not PTS tested, thay are not taught, and have not been for so long, they have become alien and 'dangerous'.

(Heavy Sigh)
i have only been flying since '02 and instructing since '06, but i completely agree with you.
 

The Gardener

Terrafirma Phobic
is exactly what we are supposed to do in training. The 'eeking' you speak of is precisely the skill that needs the practice.

This is an example of the mindset that has eroded training in aviation in general in the past 20 years: if it's hard to do, just don't do it. Make up all kind of excuses, like how dangerous it is, or how 'useless' it is, or how it shows how bad your judgement is because you shouldn't be there in the first place.

Practicing a single-engine go-around and finding that best actual indicated airspeed and zero-sideslip configuration to obtaning best ROC is one of the best things you can do in M. E. training.

But,...it's like the slips and spins (SE) that actually increase pilot performance (command of the machine), but since thay are not PTS tested, thay are not taught, and have not been for so long, they have become alien and 'dangerous'.

(Heavy Sigh)
Are you the guy that fails engines on a twin at 200'? I know it is hard, but I choose not to do it because it isn't a great way to extend my longevity. You CAN do lots of things in a plane, but I choose to NOT do a lot of them unless it is required. A full power climb by the tower with an engine out isn't on the top of my list of great things to do to extend my life. Sorry!
 

Crism

Thuper Member
Not a forward slip but I had an awesome CFI for my Private Multi and he made me do a go-around single-engine in a Twin Comanche...that's something you don't see every day. And yes, it was a pain the butt, but without a doubt, a learning experience.
 

CaptainChris87

New Member
During my training at ATP I was also told not to slip the Seminole. But as someone mentioned when you practice engine out you do put it in a light slip configuration "zero sideslip" for better aerodynamic performance during an engine out. I wouldnt think you would need to slip it in the first place you can just cut power and she drops, so airspeed during a faster than normal approach can be fairly reduced. I would think what they were thinking had something to do with elevator effectiveness?? Since it is a T tail. All I know is the possibility of getting nad being unable to recover in a deep stall, but with slipping it I honestly see no problem with it. Just of course pay attention to the possibility of Cross controll stalling it.
 
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