Shouldn't this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

Cherokee_Cruiser

Well-Known Member
Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

This part:

Back to my checkride, and out Herb's window I look for the emergency landing spot, but before I have a chance to say anything, he lowers the nose and points out a spot. Obviously he has my emergency all planned out. Wouldn't it be nice if it were always that way?

Ahead there is a long, grass airstrip snuggled into the trees. Ok, I'm fine with this. I check the indications to see why the engine quit, ignoring the glaring indication of his hand on the pulled-out throttle. Gas is on, mixture is rich, carb heat is on, key is on both, and master is on. Danged if I know why the engine quit, except for that hand-on-the-throttle thing.

I tell him I would dial in 121.5 and declare an emergency. Squawk 7700. Open the doors in case of a hard landing that could buckle the airframe. I tell him I'd shut the fuel off to avoid fire.

I say this all as I am descending and lining up on a downwind-type entry for this field. Here is my next error. I didn't circle the approach end. I flew it down as if I had power and was going to come in for a "normal" landing. Every other emergency landing has been spiraling down to a nice field. I didn't see a "field" here, I saw a runway. Runway habits are hard to break, and I ran out of energy before I ran into a good spot to land. Herb is yelling, "What are you doing? We're dead. You're taking us into the trees. You're going to kill us." Nothing like a little peace and quiet-contentment on an FAA private pilot checkride.

He takes the plane, climbs us out, and shows me what I should have done.

I'm thinking, "That's it. I've failed. I have to go back, tail tucked, and face the failure music."

Then he gives me the plane and has me climb to 1,500, whereupon we move into another maneuver.

Right into another maneuver? If I'd failed, he'd have to tell me, right? I'm brightening. I'm feeling pretty good here.



taken from: HERE!!!
 

hammer

New Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

Not necessarily, in my opinion. One part of the PTS says "consistently exceeding tolderances stated in the objectives" are grounds for failure. When I did my Comm-SE, I landed the 180 power off landing close to 100 feet short of my designated touch down point (PTS is +200/-0 feet). I thought it was over but was reminded at the end that I only exceeded the PTS on that one maneuver and therefore had passed.

Of course, the DE has a lot of authority in deciding who to pass and who to fail. I could certainly share stories of people who have failed and didn't deserve it.
 

I_Money

Moderator
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

Checkrides are lessons too - if you operate the aircraft safely, and within PTS you will get the paper - if you learn something during it good for you!

I do not see where this guy busted PTS, or was unsafe, the examinar just taught him a few things.
 

pilatus028

New Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

I did something like that too, except before I could even attempt to lower that nose the examiner asked me what I was doing...I told him without missing a beat, I'm going to land on that runway (which was the main idea). He came to realize I am still a student who probably wasn't familiar with all the options and instructed me to try a 360...low and behold, it worked out perfect. From my understanding alot of the examiners find that the PPL is a learning liscense. When you step it up to Commercial and Flight Instructor the ball game goes from the minors to the majors. It gets alot less fun and alot more stressful. I can't imagine taking a checkride every 6 months and even on the spot in some cases.

my 2 cents

Clem
 

Brandon

New Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

Exceeding PTS tolerances is one thing, but failing the entire objective of the exercise is another. That guy probably should have been handed a pink slip.
 

Eagle

New Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

I am not conviced that it was a failure, after all not every engine out lands with the crew intact....right? Besides it shows that the pilot made all the right choices eg: memory items, just blew the last 200ft or so. Does the PTS say you have to land successfully? he picked a good landingspot, just didn't make the distance.
 

250blue

New Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

The PTS states "Analyzes the situation and selects an appropriate course of action" and "Plans and follows a flight pattern to the selected landing area considering altitude, wind, terrain, and obstructions". Since they wouldn't have made it to the landing area that's a failure. Where I teach, this would be an automatic failure for the examiners. Also for us, short on a power off 180 is an automatic failure. The examiners argue that "consistently exceeding tolerances" means that you correct immediately on that particular maneuver and do not exceed again and that on some maneuvers such as a power off 180, if you are short, there is no way to get that maneuver back into tolerances.
 

Cosmo1999

Well-Known Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

The examiner doesnt always have to tell you right when you failed... If you mess up a couple times on your altitude or dont quite make a nice pretty circle on your turns about a point then he will probably let it slide... Every end of course I have ever conducted the student makes some sort of error that could technically be a fail, its just a little thing usually... Its up to the examiner when "enough is enough"... The only time I knew of a examiner failing a student on the spot is when she screamed in terror on a landing.. other than that though our examiner usually waits and sees how the entire checkride goes before making a pass/fail decision... Checkrides are usually good learning opportunitys, you always learn something on a checkride. Most examiners say that if they feel you can fly the plane safely and they could trust you flying their family then your probably going to pass unless you make really big errors.... Sounds like this was a good learning experience. I bet if there ever is a real engine failure then what happened on the checkride probably wont happen again
 

sorrygottarunway

Well-Known Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

and the DE must also take into consideration that the candidate made it to the airport alive... I mean, it wasn't like she hopped into the plane at her home airport with the DE and did the checkride, she had to fly to the airport. If she wasn't already somewhat safe, then she probably wouldn't have gotten to the testng airport with her wings on straight...

-B
 

Cherokee_Cruiser

Well-Known Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

I thought it would be a failure mainly because of the 'any time if the DE has to take the airplane from you during a manuever, you've most likely failed.'
 

farwellbooth

Well-Known Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

I almost busted my private ride with the same manuever. I had an airport in sight with plenty of altitude and he cut the power. I showed up at the active runway way too high so I decided to enter a downwind to land coming the other way. The correct answer was to spiral down (according to my examiner). Coming in the other way I was still quite a bit high so I slipped. I was coming in hot and long, he told me to go around and I thought for sure I failed. He said yes you probably could have landed it but that's a much more agressive and risky move than is necessary. I asked to do it again while going around if it would make a difference and he said I did fine.
 

aloft

New Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

We've either all had the same on-crack DE or there's a disconnect in the system someplace. I almost busted my private ride for this very same thing, even though I did it like the pilot's flying handbook says to do it.
<FORM METHOD=POST ACTION="http://jetcareers.com/ubbthreads/dopoll.php"><INPUT TYPE=HIDDEN NAME="pollname" VALUE="1071168094aloft">


So which path below is correct?
<input type="radio" name="option" value="1" />Red
<input type="radio" name="option" value="2" />Blue
<INPUT TYPE=Submit NAME=Submit VALUE="Submit vote" class="buttons"></form>

 

Mr_Creepy

Well-Known Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

I don't think it's a bust. The pilot showed capability of dealing with emergency situations. I guarantee that in an actual emergency that plane would have landed somewhere
 

EatSleepFly

Well-Known Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

I don't think that theres really a "correct" or "incorrect" answer. It all depends on the situation.

That said, the blue route looks like what I generally teach to begin with, but then I always throw in unusual situations to make students think outside of the box (or in this case, pattern). The blue is also what goes along with the Steep Spiral for the Commercial.
 

aloft

New Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

In thinking about it, I think the blue path is supposed to look like this:



At least, that's what I *think* my DE was after.
 

pscraig

Well-Known Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

I've had examiners want a maneuver done a particular way, due to their interpretation of what the AFH says even if it contradicts what everyone else does. Reading the examiners' handbook, a DPE is supposed to inform you whenever a task does not meet the PTS, and then give you the option to continue the checkride or terminate it at that time. Either way you fail, but get the other tasks out of the way.
 

Mahesh

New Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

This maneuver was so easy during my check ride. My DE tode me that I was losing power when I was at 4000 flying to a VOR. There was a nice 5000 foot runway to my right within a couple of miles. I just had to go through the procedures but the flying itself was easy. I was a bit high when I turned final and had to do a forward slip.

She got me on the slow flight! I have never been in slow filght for so long as I did during the checkride.

Also the oral part was very difficult. I thought I had failed the checkride before we even flew!

Mahesh
 

EatSleepFly

Well-Known Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

[ QUOTE ]
In thinking about it, I think the blue path is supposed to look like this:



At least, that's what I *think* my DE was after.

[/ QUOTE ]

I like the original blue one better. In this one (the green one), you could potentially shortchange yourself on landing area by flying away from the runway to the east and then having to do a 270 degree turn to line up on final (assuming that is Rwy 18).

In the blue one, at least you were headed back in the general direction of the approach end of the landing area such that you wouldn't have to make a 270 degree turn to get lined up.

But, like I said before...theres definitely more than one way to get there and I don't think theres a right or a wrong (as long as you make it back). Wind conditions and terrain certainly play a part, if not dictate, the appropriate way to get to your field.
 

pkloop

New Member
Re: Shouldn\'t this be a FAILED checkride?!?!?!?

On my check-ride the DE pulled the power out in the middle of nowhere and made me chose, glide and damn near land in the middle of someones field. Must be nice to get a runway
 
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