Regional pilots are overworked, industry critics say

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This is the entitlement generation at work right here. Don't like it? Just quit.

As Homer said, "Lisa, if you don't like your job you don't strike. You just go in every day, and do it really half-assed. That's the American way."

Why don't you get a few years under your belt and a family and realize that quitting isn't exactly easy potatoes when you don't have mommy and daddy to pay your bills for you.
You all are demanding more money and better schedules and acting like what you do is brain surgery and everyone should have to pay through the nose for the privileged of sitting on your airplane and you are calling me the entitlement generation.

It was your choice to be a pilot. Did you not know about furloughs and pilot schedules? Do you blame your managers because you have bills? Is it their fault?
 
Is that guy really a pro pilot? I really hope it's just flaming....


The issue isn't that "if you don't like it, just quit." Some of us try to make a difference and are there trying to make a means to an end (get hired at a legacy or the like).

Additionally, if you cut everything to the wire- to the bare min. That wire WILL break. It's already broke on CJC3407, FLG3701, COM191, and will continue to break more and more.

You pay low wages and treat your employees like crap, and you will attract lower and lower quality pros to the industry. Guys with records like the colgan captain and the pinnacle 3701 (they were great guys....just didn't belong in their current position- esp not with the terrible training they got, but hey- it was up to standards!) are a growing population in the airlines.

Why is it necessary to not treat your employees like humans just to save a penny? I'm technically a mgmt pilot over here and the last thing we do is nickle and dime numbers unless we're dealing with the stupid bean counters. Instead the key is the big picture.


Set the bar low enough and you'll always be impressed, right?
 
What kind of workrules should airlines run, Killtron? The bare minimum to keep the crews just alert enough to hopefully recover an airplane in an emergency?

How long would you say an appropriate duty day is? an appropriate rest period?

What about crew pay? 12000 a year fine for you? Less? You'll probably find a few people to fly for that.
 
What kind of workrules should airlines run, Killtron? The bare minimum to keep the crews just alert enough to hopefully recover an airplane in an emergency?

How long would you say an appropriate duty day is? an appropriate rest period?

What about crew pay? 12000 a year fine for you? Less? You'll probably find a few people to fly for that.

No no no.... the solution is if you don't like the pay you just quit. Because we all know that you can take your skills and experience and automatically get paid better wherever you go.... oh wait, you can't.
 
If you are so smart why don't you tell me how I'm wrong. By the way a misspelled word or typo doesn't refute my point in case you were going to go there.


I never claimed to be smart.. I simply think you have a lot to learn..

I simply think you are wrong and make quite a few assumptions..

To that end..

I'll tell you how you are wrong, in just the previous post..

Assumption 1. That I am smart..
Assumption 2. That I was going to play grammar nazi on you.. While I do think the inability to spell correctly and punctuate properly shows not only ignorance but laziness. A word here or there is one thing.. A post full of them, says something about the one posting the text. This is text medium we communicate in and if you can't take the time to do it properly - you are lazy or ignorant.. Having that said, I haven't paid enough attention to your posts to see where you might or might not be screwing up in that regard, thus I wasn't going to point those errors out..

So.. There.. I've proven you wrong twice..

Not sure why, but after reading your previous post and replying to it, I feel the urge to say..

Nee-ner, nee-ner, neeeee-ner!!
 
I've just bolded here the points I find inane.

-You would find people.
-You're right, corporations couldn't possibly put a gun to someone's head. I mean a government is run by people, whereas a corporation is run by people. I see the difference:sarcasm:
-I'm not. I think you are trying to make a point with someone else. I'm fine taking risks... turns out I'm a pilot and all... anyhow the grown ups have decided what constitutes a risk the traveling public can expect. Someday we'll let you in.
-Since I didn't, you assumed it (I hope) or you are having conversations with yourself (worried here). I don't know how to respond to this. I sped a little on the way home and bought taco bell for myself on the way there. Would you like to see my gun and pocket knife collection? Are you having a conversation with me or with someone else? What you've done goes so far past simple assumptions. You are in some sort of strange world... come back.
-I think it's funny you put a number value on it. So does the FAA. It's how we determine reliability during the cert process.
-No one is going to risk their lives or others when they deal with an expensive piece of machinery? No one at all? (Hint: Pinnacle...) You can't think of one example? You do live on earth right? I mean I know the interweb is big, I'm just trying to nail down the basics. Are you trying to say the value of the airplane is what is important? That can't be, because along that line of reasoning someone would happily take a POS Cherokee 6 out for split-s with passengers onboard. Since that really can't be your line of reasoning I wonder why you bring it up. Leads me to believe you are just rambling.

You have to understand. When I read this reply to my earlier posts I didn't know what do to. Obviously you read something somewhere that convinced you I said some things I didn't. How do I respond to someone that has such obvious reading comprehension problems? I think to myself... maybe when I said people take extraordinary risks for little reward he somehow interpretted it to mean that I don't think anyone should take risks ever. Then I think... no don't assume he's brain dead, he must mean something else. Then I go back and forth and back and forth and a fuse blows. I realize, that there is no way to talk to you, because you can't read and comprehend. Maybe I should just let you keep rambling?? But no... no you ask for more. What am I to do?

I'm sorry, I really can't help you. There is a problem with children at young ages. You show them a 3-D model of a mountain with different landscape and colors for each side, and them you turn one side away from them and ask them to draw the side of the mountain you are looking at. Instead, they only draw the side they can see. Until the child develops, months or years later, they can not comprehend the question because their brains cannot make those connections yet. I fear, somehow, you are still younger than this all important age.

I hope you are just drunk.
You missed it entirely.

So you would have a problem if someone volunteered for some kind dangerous mission?

Corporations don't have police forces with authority anywhere but on their own property. Unlike the police they can't force me to do anything I don't want to do.

The whole discussion is about pilot fatigue and its impact on safety and of course this being a unionized industry blame immediately went to management and your consensus seems to be that the FAA should do something. So I brought up what I thought was the fairly obvious point that you have a private company offering a service to private citizens who can make their own decisions about their own safety. So why do we need tighter regulations? I went further to try and make the point that imposing that on people is actually wrong.

I never meant to imply you don't take any risks, infact I said if somebody only accepted 0 risk they would never get out of bed. I don't know how you turned that into an accusation against you. If you assume a non 0 amount of risk than you have assumed at least some risk and any arguement you make can only be for what you see as an acceptable level of risk anything you come up with is going to be arbitrary so why not let the market decide.

What I meant is an airline has a definite interest in not crashing their airplanes. Planes aren't going to be crashing left and right if you allow them to operate how they want. That would hurt their bottom line.

You say that you don't understand what I said so that must mean the problem is with me. I don't care if you get it or not I'm only interested in if somebody can come up with a good reason why I'm wrong. I was hoping Jtrain would comment.
 
I never claimed to be smart.. I simply think you have a lot to learn..

I simply think you are wrong and make quite a few assumptions..

To that end..

I'll tell you how you are wrong, in just the previous post..

Assumption 1. That I am smart..
Assumption 2. That I was going to play grammar nazi on you.. While I do think the inability to spell correctly and punctuate properly shows not only ignorance but laziness. A word here or there is one thing.. A post full of them, says something about the one posting the text. This is text medium we communicate in and if you can't take the time to do it properly - you are lazy or ignorant.. Having that said, I haven't paid enough attention to your posts to see where you might or might not be screwing up in that regard, thus I wasn't going to point those errors out..

So.. There.. I've proven you wrong twice..

Not sure why, but after reading your previous post and replying to it, I feel the urge to say..

Nee-ner, nee-ner, neeeee-ner!!
You called me an idiot so you must think you're smarter then me.

In my experience when somebody doesn't have a real point to make about the topic and that have called someones intelligence into question they usually turn to grammar and spelling corrections. I thought that might be where you would take it.
 
This is not some heroic suicide mission, Killtron. It's a job with deadly consequences and a whole lot of money on the line if we screw up.

You seem to want to rely on the unrestricted free market to work it out- or something of the sort.

The issue is, there has to be regulation and there has to be decent minimums set. I'm very much a republican/libertarian myself, but i've got common sense.

When money is used to set minimums, the general good will never prevail. Money works itself to rediculous brittle minimums. You find yourself in a reactionary stance rather than a proactive stance.... not a good place to be in.
 
No no no.... the solution is if you don't like the pay you just quit. Because we all know that you can take your skills and experience and automatically get paid better wherever you go.... oh wait, you can't.
Maybe you can't but that's a personal problem and not managements fault. You feel like the world owes you something because you can fly a plane?
 
You all are demanding more money and better schedules and acting like what you do is brain surgery and everyone should have to pay through the nose for the privileged of sitting on your airplane and you are calling me the entitlement generation.

A brain surgeon messes up, 1 person dies... or is maimed. Just sayin
(an important gig yes, but it's not like they have even come close to the safety levels of airline pilots. We are as a whole, less likely to kill you even though we have many, many more shots at it)

if i were to wipe out your entire family in one fell swoop, wouldn't you be pissed to learn that I only had 4 hours rest because I couldn't afford to live in the base that my company forced me to relocate to?

either way, i bet frank Lorenzo has a few internship spots open if the money is right. last I heard they were going at 35k
 
[modhat]If you guys can't knock off the name calling, then this thread will go the way of the Lav......and some might even go on vacation for a while. Clean it up.[/modhat]
 
You called me an idiot so you must think you're smarter then me.

More assumptions.. I have no idea how intelligent you are.. You can be very intelligent and be an idiot.. The two do not go hand in hand..

You speak of things you do not understand and yet, try to appear well informed of these things..

"You can just up and quit.." etc, etc, etc..

Life is a little more complex than that..

At 22, I didn't understand that fully.. I doubt you do either..


In my experience when somebody doesn't have a real point to make about the topic and that have called someones intelligence into question they usually turn to grammar and spelling corrections.

Or, when they see someone make a woefully ignorant comment, they make a comment in kind.. I take it back, Killtron.. You are not an idiot.. You are ignorant..

I thought that might be where you would take it.

You obviously thought wrong, didn't you?
 
[modhat]If you guys can't knock off the name calling, then this thread will go the way of the Lav......and some might even go on vacation for a while. Clean it up.[/modhat]

Wow.. As if the "Administrator" under the mods name isn't enough, you guys get a bright flashy box too..

Spiffy..
 
Maybe you can't but that's a personal problem and not managements fault. You feel like the world owes you something because you can fly a plane?



Cant reply to my post, Killtron? Feel like the regionals owe you a job? Only replying to the regional guys on here?

And yes, the world does owe us something because we can fly a plane day in day out, nearly all weather, with whatever mechanical malfunctions and other crap is thrown our way- and the general public barely even notices except when they are running a bit late.

40,000+ dollars of licenses, goodness knows how much spent on a college degree...

That right there deserves a descent wage.



If you would prefer to cheapen yourself and your profession to that of a bus driver (who makes more than Pinnacle FOs), go right ahead. You're doing a fine job and well deserving of whatever terrible crap run of a job that brings you to.
 
Wow.. As if the "Administrator" under the mods name isn't enough, you guys get a bright flashy box too..

Spiffy..

Just keep it clean. You guys are mucking up Doug's living room enough already with some of the content of this thread. The conversation can be had without the name calling. I realize it's a hot topic, but still.
 
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