Regional Airlines Lower Bar for Pilots

Seggy

Well-Known Member
http://www.star-telegram.com/news/story/322928.html

Full article

Regional airlines lower bar for pilots


By TREBOR BANSTETTER
Star-Telegram staff writer


If you've flown on a regional airline like American Eagle or Atlantic Southeast Airlines with any regularity, you may have noticed that the pilots seem a bit younger.

It's not your imagination. Regional carriers, which operate flights for major airlines like American, Delta and United, have been slashing their minimum hiring requirements in recent years as they grapple with a growing shortage of pilots. The carriers have reduced required flight hours for job applicants by as much as two-thirds, and in a few cases have hired pilots with the minimum experience required by the Federal Aviation Administration for a pilot's license.
Airline executives say recruiting less experienced pilots is necessary because the pool of applicants is shrinking while demand for pilots grows. And many have increased training for new hires and assigned them more time flying with veteran co-pilots.
Pilot union officials, while not citing specific incidents, say they're worried that the trend could make the skies less safe.
"The rush to push pilots through training and into the cockpits raises obvious safety concerns," said John Prater, a veteran Continental Airlines pilot and president of the Air Line Pilots Association.
Prater addressed the issue of less-experienced pilots in a recent speech at a forum on aviation safety and security.
"New pilots today are going straight into the [co-pilot's] seat, and moving into the [captain's] seat in a hurry," he said. "And they're doing it in airplanes that are great machines but can be unforgiving."
Airline executives counter that safety isn't an issue. They say they've augmented training for new hires and have increased the time junior pilots are monitored by veterans in the cockpit.
"Anyone who raises safety as an issue has some other agenda," said Roger Cohen, president of the Regional Airline Association. "The airlines are spending a boatload of money on training and recruiting."
And Andrea Huguely, a spokeswoman for American Eagle, said the airline's new hires are competent and talented pilots.
"We have the best pilots out there," she said. "You can't just walk in from the street and say you want to be a pilot."
The issue has emerged as regional carriers account for an increasing portion of the country's airline traffic. Half the flights nationwide are operated by regional airlines, Cohen said.
Regional airlines include carriers like Pinnacle Airlines, which flies for Northwest; Atlantic Southeast, which transports passengers for Delta; and Republic Airways, which operates flights for United. The largest regional carrier is Fort Worth-based American Eagle, which flies for American Airlines; both are owned by AMR Corp.
Passengers book their flights through the larger carrier, and many don't realize that their flight is being operated by a different airline. The major carriers have substantially increased their use of regional airlines in part because their flight crews are paid less.
Traditionally, many pilots began their careers at lower-paying regional airlines with the hope of moving to a major carrier, and a bigger salary, in a few years. Most regional carriers used to require 1,500 total flight hours before an aspiring pilot could apply for a job. A portion of those hours -- usually about 500 -- had to be flown in a multiengine airplane; the rest could be in a single-engine aircraft like a small Cessna 172.
In the past, young pilots typically built up their hours by renting airplanes or by working as instructors for flight schools. Many would spend years adding to their flight hours before accumulating enough to apply as a commercial pilot.
But the pool of new pilots began to dry up several years ago. Regionals have been competing with fast-growing corporate aviation firms, discount airlines, cargo shippers and foreign airlines for talented young pilots. These rivals often have better pay and benefits and more stable work schedules.
The flow of pilots coming from the military has also slowed, said Paul Rice, a captain for United Airlines who is first vice president for the Air Line Pilots Association. And some young people who are interested in aviation are choosing other professions.
Cohen said pay cuts, airline bankruptcies and other industry problems have "taken a lot of the glamour out of being an airline pilot."
"There are just fewer young people who want to make a career out of this," he said.
For example, a starting pilot at Trans States, a regional airline that flies for American under the name American Connection, earns $22 a flight hour, with 74 hours guaranteed a month, according to AirlinePilotCentral.com, which tracks pilot salaries. That translates to an annual starting salary of $19,500. A pilot flying 1,000 hours a year -- the most allowed under federal rules -- would earn about $22,000.

Less experience necessary

The dearth of pilots has led airlines to lower hiring requirements in order to maintain flight schedules.In just the past year, 14 of the 21 regional and commuter airlines tracked by the consulting firm Air Inc. have reduced the hours of experience a pilot must have at the controls of any type of airplane. Trans States briefly lowered its requirement to 250 total hours last summer before raising it to 500, said Kit Darby, the firm's president.
American Eagle has cut its minimum flight hours to 500.
"If you have just a few hundred hours and don't have any jet experience, you're looking at quite a learning hurdle," Rice said.
James Magee, an Eagle pilot and union spokesman, had 2,000 hours of flight time when he was hired in 1999.
"Our new pilots are exceptionally good pilots," Magee said. "But they're flying in very challenging environments, and there's really no replacement for experience."
Magee added that many regional airlines fly into smaller airports that often lack the sophisticated technology of major airports. Many of Eagle's destinations are in the Caribbean, so pilots also have to juggle the aviation requirements of different countries and deal with difficult tropical weather.
He said more experienced Eagle captains "are having to do a lot more teaching in the cockpit than they had to do in the past."
Airlines are aggressively recruiting on college campuses and offering signing bonuses to new hires who complete their training.
In Europe, some airlines hire aspiring pilots with no experience and train them in exchange for a commitment to spend a certain number of years flying for the carrier, Rice said. But there doesn't appear to be any indication that U.S. airlines will replicate that training method, which can be a costly way to acquire pilots.
Union leaders say improved compensation and benefits would help more than signing bonuses and lesser requirements for new hires.
"We have to offer them a career path, with pay and work rules, that is going to be attractive," Magee said.
Regardless, airlines and labor officials agree that the pilot shortage isn't likely to improve soon. Eagle has had to cut flights from its winter schedule because pilots aren't available to fly them.
"It's one of several reasons, but that does play into it," Eagle's Huguely said. "The pilots are crucial, and without them, the planes don't fly."
 
Holy crap. Im at a measly 270TT, but I have been perusing these boards since I was in middle school. I have already been flying for almost 5 years since my first solo. It is really starting to hit me how different things are now that they were just when I got in to aviation. I remember dreaming when I was a freshman in high school about being a CFI for 2 years or so. In fact I expected so much that I would have to instruct for multiple YEARS before going to the airlines, that I pretty much started preparing myself to teach all the way PPL-CMEL, where I am at now.

The culture of entry-level pilot jobs sure seems to be on the starting brink of a HUGE change. For as much as everyone rags on low-timers, a fresh, 19-20 year old CMEL with 260-300 hours these days really face much harder dillemas than any have before. In years past, there was no question about what to do next. You either instructed, flew pipelines, traffic, joyrides, or the such until at least 1500 hours. It's just what you had to do. Now, you can just take a CRJ course right after your commercial and you're flying a jet, assuming you pass the interview. I will openly admit that I had a friend (a Pinnacle captain) walk my resume in to Pinnacle last week. It was mostly just for kciks and giggles, but guess what: they called. I couldn't beleive it. But, then they told me that all I have to do is take an RJ course and I was in.

So, someone in my shoes with a fresh commercial-multi gets word that all they have to do is take a course and they have the job that they thought it would take 2 years out of college to get. Yes, we all know the arguments about pay, work rules, etc. But, you can see the dillema that many more than just me are put in. Would people who were in my shoes turn down the opportunity?

I guess that I'm just saying that I'm glad I got the education I've recieved here. And, we need to make sure to keep EDUCATING new aviators about the risks of being a low-time hire. Not only safety risks, but career risks. I don't have an exceptional amount of flight time, but by golly, even if I do become a "low-time wonder" I at least will have the right attitude and education to make me appreciate what has happened, and how I need to step up to the huge plate in front of me. The airlines aren't going to bring their training standards down to me, I have to go up to them, meet them, and exceed them. If I were to go to an airline as a low timer, I would do my damndest to make sure I am a sponge for learning and shaping my judgement and being safe and competent for those people in the back who trust me, not just sitting idle enjoying the view because I think I am better than my captain because I got to my job with 300 hours and it took him 2000.

Okay, these are just my rambling thoughts as a fresh CMEL. I am going to try to use my education from here to do the best thing, but I am just asking everyone who bashes low-timers to instead educate and understand that they are facing dillemmas, too. It's not an easy decision, guys.

This post is in absolutely now way spoken to any single person, its just some thoughts that I had that I wanted to jot down, and this thread seemed to be a good place to put them.
 
Unfortunately, Aunt Bessie and Uncle Bob don't give a damn as long as they save $10 on their airfare.

All you have to do to understand that the typical American customer will deal with being crapped on if he can save a few percentage points on what he's buying is go to Wal-Mart. So many of the employees are a Carlos Mencia dream because he can milk it for an entire season but people deal with that crap because they save a nickel on their toothpaste.
 
Even though aircraft and the ATC system is arguably safer now than it has ever been, there's only one outcome to this situation. We're going to start to see bent aluminum. It's also going to be the only thing that stops the regionals from hiring lower and lower time pilots. If enough aircraft crash the FAA will step in and require Part 135ish hour minimums. One thing that history has proven is that the American public will not stand for flying airlines with very public crashes (Valu-Jet anyone....)
 
Great article.

It's interesting to see the RAA and AE management minimize the problem and ALPA take the opposite stance. Guess which organization is more pro-pilot career? Which one cares about the interest of pilots? It ain't the RAA or airline management, I'll tell you that. Never will be...

As far as taking the job as a low time pilot. I don't suppose I'd have not taken it, so who am I to critize the individual? I blame the system that allows for the bar to be lowered too far with airline pilot experience levels, all for the sake not having to raise the bar to attract a properly qualified candidate.
 
If you've flown on a regional airline like American Eagle or Atlantic Southeast Airlines with any regularity, you may have noticed that the pilots seem a bit younger.

Another excuse for me to wear my hat.
 
I am still waiting for this deluge of airplanes to start falling out of the sky soley because of the experience level in the cockpit. Time in the seat cannot teach common sense and judgement AND a conservative attitude.

If things go as far south as all the bandwagon jumpers here say, I will be the first one in line demanding tighter experience rules for 121/135 FOs and such, honestly I don't see it happening (the impending doom of accident after accident that is).
 
Traditionally, many pilots began their careers at lower-paying regional airlines with the hope of moving to a major carrier, and a bigger salary, in a few years. Most regional carriers used to require 1,500 total flight hours before an aspiring pilot could apply for a job. A portion of those hours -- usually about 500 -- had to be flown in a multiengine airplane; the rest could be in a single-engine aircraft like a small Cessna 172.
In the past, young pilots typically built up their hours by renting airplanes or by working as instructors for flight schools. Many would spend years adding to their flight hours before accumulating enough to apply as a commercial pilot.

I realize that a lot of media people don't understand the distinction, but this annoys the crap out of me - they seem to think that "commercial" means "121 airline." Call it a pet peeve.

"Are you going to get your commercial license, Billy?"

"Yes. I'd like to instruct and maybe do some pipeline patrol or something before doing freight some day. Maybe. I don't know yet."

Puzzled face. "But why do that? You're commercial - fly a jet!"

:banghead:

I know. I preach patient understanding to the ignorant in many things, not just flying, and I always patiently explain the distinction. But it's annoying all the same.
 
I am still waiting for this deluge of airplanes to start falling out of the sky soley because of the experience level in the cockpit. Time in the seat cannot teach common sense and judgement AND a conservative attitude.

I agree with you to an extent, but remember- you cannot make sound judgements without prior experience.
 
I agree with you to an extent, but remember- you cannot make sound judgements without prior experience.


I totally agree, BUT, we do operate in a "field" where a good chunk of the time simple application of basic airmanship and some common sense is all it really takes to do this job. Sure there are extreme examples of needing hours of experience to survive (Sioux City IA), but honestly the chances of something like that happening again or even happening to a crew who doesn't measure up are, IMO, on the low enough side that it really isn't a risk.
 
"Anyone who raises safety as an issue has some other agenda," said Roger Cohen, president of the Regional Airline Association. "The airlines are spending a boatload of money on training and recruiting."
And Andrea Huguely, a spokeswoman for American Eagle, said the airline's new hires are competent and talented pilots.

Uh.....what? Which airlines have re-done their training to accomodate the low time guys? Which ones are spending more money on the training? If anything the APPLICANTS are spending money on the RJ courses b/c the airlines won't hire them without it. But, I don't see airlines spending any more money. If that were the case, why not pay more and get better pilots?

Spending money on recruiting I'll buy. It's tough to find people out there now, but I don't buy the whole spending more money on training. They might be extending OE for guys b/c they couldn't pass in the normal amount of time, but that's not really even spending more money considering it's a revenue flight that would require an FO anyway. At best a reserve pilot gets a breather for the day since they've got the FO that was bought off from that flight to use instead, but they would probably be paying that reserve guy the guarantee anyway.

I'd love to see the RAA back that statement up with figures, but I'm not gonna hold my breathe on that one.
 
Uh.....what? Which airlines have re-done their training to accomodate the low time guys? Which ones are spending more money on the training? If anything the APPLICANTS are spending money on the RJ courses b/c the airlines won't hire them without it. But, I don't see airlines spending any more money. If that were the case, why not pay more and get better pilots?

They did at my airline. They added two weeks to the initial training. Got us in the sim several times before actual ground school started. They also changed the way they do the checkrides. My checkride was simply a LOFT scenario in the RJ. Of course before we also had to pass a maneuvers validation." That included all the single engine approaches, V1 cuts, etc.
 
Uh.....what? Which airlines have re-done their training to accomodate the low time guys? Which ones are spending more money on the training?

I think they all are spending more on training, but not in an official "let's restructure our training program" way; more of a "Damn these kids $#!%$ suck, I guess we are going to have to give them 16 sim sessions and 70 hours of OE instead of what we used to give."
 
Raise the freaking pay and there won't be such a shortage!!!! I can't even begin to count the number of low time former regional pilots I've met who got called for somewhere like Mesa, flew for a year or so and got deeply disgusted over the pay and left the profession completely.
 
There is a belief held within the industry that pilots, irrespective of the cuts in wages and benefits taken to date are still grossly overpaid. The draconian cuts from post 911 bankruptcies were just the beginning. From this point forward look for modest gains that do not keep pace with inflation to continue the reduction of pilot labor costs. 10-15 years out look for pilot compensation to be something that resembles this:

(MAX pay in 2007 dollars)

Wide body CA 125K/yr
Narrow CA 75K
RJ CA 50K
Turboprop CA 35K

Wide FO 75K
Narrow FO 50K
RJ FO 30K
Turboprop FO 25K

www.aircon.org
 
There is a belief held within the industry that pilots, irrespective of the cuts in wages and benefits taken to date are still grossly overpaid. The draconian cuts from post 911 bankruptcies were just the beginning. From this point forward look for modest gains that do not keep pace with inflation to continue the reduction of pilot labor costs. 10-15 years out look for pilot compensation to be something that resembles this:

(MAX pay in 2007 dollars)

Wide body CA 125K/yr
Narrow CA 75K
RJ CA 50K
Turboprop CA 35K

Wide FO 75K
Narrow FO 50K
RJ FO 30K
Turboprop FO 25K

www.aircon.org
Good luck on getting pilots for that amount of money. I'll leave the profession before that happens with me...I like flying, not at the expense of my earning potential, though.
 
I am still waiting for this deluge of airplanes to start falling out of the sky soley because of the experience level in the cockpit.
Maybe only a few have "fallen," but there have been 3100 ASR reports filed in the last 5 years involving CRJ/ERJ crews. Interesting reading.
 
Does that mean i have no expereince since im young and work at a regional. even though ive worked there for 4+ years? I must be one of those 250TT guys.
 
Good luck on getting pilots for that amount of money. I'll leave the profession before that happens with me...I like flying, not at the expense of my earning potential, though.

Luck has nothing to do with it. Every one of those wage rates are paid today. The goal is to bring all carriers in-line with the lowest common denominator. It's understood and accepted that many pilots currently in the industry will leave. That's fine. MPL on the way. Nothing personal. Just business, and not unique to the airline industry. This scenario has played out many times before in other careers.

"Market Rate" is defined as: "The lowest cost labor management can find to perform a task". In this case the task of piloting a commercial airliner.

www.aircon.org
 
Back
Top