Reality check

I don’t have kids and, well, I got into the business to fly big jets far places.

Otherwise I’d have followed the other track to engineering or medicine. Both, at least at the time, meant I could have owned a private airplane and fly anyway! :)

I’ve got way more Bourdain in my blood than I do Ralph Kramden, but that’s just me.
 
L-16B said:
Do they still have Bennigans there? They all disappeared in Texas. Man I want a Monte Cristo right now!!!
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I literally have no idea.

But I’m kind of an outlier. When my copilot starts complaining that Southwest has these 1/2/3 or 3/4/5 deals at layover hotels for discounts, I’m generally like “I don’t have any interest in eating and drinking at the layover hotel” as I’ll literally walk in a driving snow storm just to eat and drink something more local than sitting around with a bunch of mustachioed pilots bitching about the yellow safety vest! :)
 
Derg said:
than sitting around with a bunch of mustachioed pilots bitching about the yellow safety vest! :)
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Oh Lordy! Talk about a gnash cluster! You’d think that guys were having to sacrifice their first born over the safety vest. Just wear the damn thing.
 
Cptnchia said:
Oh Lordy! Talk about a gnash cluster! You’d think that guys were having to sacrifice their first born over the safety vest. Just wear the damn thing.
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Right? I told another guy in the Detroit pilot lounge that was literally treating it like “Kony 2012” showed up to kidnap his teenage daughter: “You do know this is fairly standard outside the US, right?” then I regretted opening my mouth because I realized that he pretty much went from the -9 to the 320 and that’s about it for the last 30 years.
 
I had one tell me that it may be standard on international flights, but he didn’t bid international for a reason and he wasn’t about to kowtow to European laws.
 
Box hauler said:
Is it possible that you might never be happy? Being a captain at AK and be willing to toss that down the drain to become the very last person on the list at AA seems you would rather chase a great career than actually have one.
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I love the job, flying is great, door close to open is very fun. It's the rest of the industry crap. I've already gone through 2 mergers. They all suck to some degree but this one particularly sucks with a base closure and the next base being 2,000nm away. And remember, I bypassed upgrade to stay in base as a NY FO versus CA on the west coast. If I start right now at AA and get New York, the job itself won't be much different than what I was literally already doing just a couple months ago = NY FO. Obviously I prioritized location close to family. Once the base closed I pulled the trigger for the upgrade.


@ATN_Pilot remember our SLI isn't done yet. Currently I'm 54% on my list. On the VX proposal I'm about 57% and the AS proposal about 63%. If you assume the arbitrators meet the middle ground, maybe I'm 60% overall. In the next 10 yrs we retire 620ish pilots out of 3k. So assuming (unrealistic, but for simple math) no growth and we are a 3k pilot group, I'd go from 60% to 39% overall on the list. At AA, starting as active pilot #14,800 today in 10 yrs (also assume no growth for simple math) they retire 8,300 so that would be 44% overall on the list in 10 yrs. Even if you throw in growth and assume AS is 4k pilots and AA ends up 16k pilots, it's still extremely close. AA's retirement graphs are shocking to see visually! At DL and UA, it isn't as dramatic. The benefit to DL is their retirement spree happens in the next 6 yrs, especially 2020-2024. So if one is looking for a NY spot at Delta, they'll do well. UA has the least amount of retirements for the next 10 yrs, their main spree takes off in the later part of the 2020 decade. If I got UA, I'd hang out 75/76 out of EWR and just chill until upgrade.

The good news is I haven't yet been spoiled by the pay raise, along with the fact I still have over 3 decades to go. Don't get me wrong, I'm not completely crazy. I would not leave my job for anything except the big 3 already listed. But you are also correct: move. With 2 young kids and no desire to transcon commute for decades, I will have to move depending on how this plays out. We get 2 yrs to use the moving benefits and 2 yrs sounds like the limit of my commute desire. I'm just hoping to get a call in the next 2 yrs and if so, bail out and if not then we move out west in base. I realize I have first world problems and shouldn't complain about anything but it sorta sucks not to know what my living situation may be in the next 12 months.
 
bLizZuE said:
It’s all hilarious until a ramper runs your ass over and you don’t get any LTD because you chose not to wear your safety vest.
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As of 13Aug, it is a Coty of Atlanta ordinance that safety vests will be worn by all personnel on the ramp at KATL. Atlanta PD will be ticketing all violators.
 
Box hauler said:
Is it possible that you might never be happy? Being a captain at AK and be willing to toss that down the drain to become the very last person on the list at AA seems you would rather chase a great career than actually have one.
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Cherokee_Cruiser said:
I love the job, flying is great, door close to open is very fun. It's the rest of the industry crap. I've already gone through 2 mergers. They all suck to some degree but this one particularly sucks with a base closure and the next base being 2,000nm away. And remember, I bypassed upgrade to stay in base as a NY FO versus CA on the west coast. If I start right now at AA and get New York, the job itself won't be much different than what I was literally already doing just a couple months ago = NY FO. Obviously I prioritized location close to family. Once the base closed I pulled the trigger for the upgrade.


@ATN_Pilot remember our SLI isn't done yet. Currently I'm 54% on my list. On the VX proposal I'm about 57% and the AS proposal about 63%. If you assume the arbitrators meet the middle ground, maybe I'm 60% overall. In the next 10 yrs we retire 620ish pilots out of 3k. So assuming (unrealistic, but for simple math) no growth and we are a 3k pilot group, I'd go from 60% to 39% overall on the list. At AA, starting as active pilot #14,800 today in 10 yrs (also assume no growth for simple math) they retire 8,300 so that would be 44% overall on the list in 10 yrs. Even if you throw in growth and assume AS is 4k pilots and AA ends up 16k pilots, it's still extremely close. AA's retirement graphs are shocking to see visually! At DL and UA, it isn't as dramatic. The benefit to DL is their retirement spree happens in the next 6 yrs, especially 2020-2024. So if one is looking for a NY spot at Delta, they'll do well. UA has the least amount of retirements for the next 10 yrs, their main spree takes off in the later part of the 2020 decade. If I got UA, I'd hang out 75/76 out of EWR and just chill until upgrade.

The good news is I haven't yet been spoiled by the pay raise, along with the fact I still have over 3 decades to go. Don't get me wrong, I'm not completely crazy. I would not leave my job for anything except the big 3 already listed. But you are also correct: move. With 2 young kids and no desire to transcon commute for decades, I will have to move depending on how this plays out. We get 2 yrs to use the moving benefits and 2 yrs sounds like the limit of my commute desire. I'm just hoping to get a call in the next 2 yrs and if so, bail out and if not then we move out west in base. I realize I have first world problems and shouldn't complain about anything but it sorta sucks not to know what my living situation may be in the next 12 months.
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Yeah with a transcon commute like you have I guess I would leave too. That's a special kind of hell to be stuck in for years to come.
 
jtrain609 said:
I don't care where the overnight is because I don't go out. My goal with this job isn't to see awesome places and do awesome things. My goal with this job is to be at home as much as possible, fly airplanes, and make lots and lots of money. On an average overnight, I get to the hotel room, slam click, eat something out of my cooler, and sleep 12 hours (because the kids don't let me sleep at home).

I understand that this isn't the reason you or Derg do this job.I don't begrudge you guys wanting to see the world, but I've found that the world isn't worth seeing if I'm not doing it with my family.

The three of us live completely different lives, and that's a-ok.
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One of the things I really learned doing SAPA (especially the PBS part) was that there is something for everyone and that what one pilot can’t stand is what another pilot loves. The motivations for scheduling/etc. are wildly different.

But we can at least agree that staying in a festering poop-hole, like the Sleep Inn in Minot, ND, sucks donkey balls.
 
1. They cant legally ask you
2. Don’t volunteer the information..orders can change at any point. Until those orders are actually certified for execution they aren’t official.
 
Derg said:
If the apex of my career was what I’m doing right now, seeing what I’ve seen, I wouldn’t be satisfied.

Flying jets is fun, but I miss waking up from my arrival nap and heading out solo in some strange city I know nothing about that speaks a language I don’t have a handle on.

Sitting at Bennigans with a bunch of crew members in Kansas City doesn’t measure up to a stick of specious meat, Japanese beer and choking on charcoal smoke at an Izakaya in Tokyo.
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We are very different people. :)

My goal was always to be walking back into my house less than 10 hours from the time I walked out the door to head to the airport, working no more than three days a week. Managed to pull that off for several years. It was glorious. I make a ton more money now, but that was truly living the dream. Bastards at Southwest ruined it all, but it was awesome while it lasted.

The idea of ten day trips to Europe or Asia make me cringe. My dream was to upgrade on the 717 and stay in that seat until they retired it. Then I’d have probably retired, too.

Cherokee_Cruiser said:
@ATN_Pilot remember our SLI isn't done yet.
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I actually wasn’t aware of that. I try to keep up with what’s going on, but I’m a bit out of the loop nowadays. :) I still think you’d be nuts to leave, because I lived through the post-9/11 lost decade. But hey, throw caution to the wind.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
We are very different people. :)

My goal was always to be walking back into my house less than 10 hours from the time I walked out the door to head to the airport, working no more than three days a week. Managed to pull that off for several years. It was glorious. I make a ton more money now, but that was truly living the dream. Bastards at Southwest ruined it all, but it was awesome while it lasted.

The idea of ten day trips to Europe or Asia make me cringe. My dream was to upgrade on the 717 and stay in that seat until they retired it. Then I’d have probably retired, too.
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Sounds like Allegiant would have been your dream job!
 
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