R.I.P. "Jetlink". You will be missed.

So I have to ask myself..."self...is trolling the troll as bad as a trolling troll?"

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Autothrust Blue said:
Somewhere in all of the fracas, there's the truth. Usually somewhere in between.
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This. No one left the meeting early, nor did anyone leave with any amount of fireworks that some would find entertaining, sorry to disappoint.
 
CzechAirman said:
That's not a good sign for future growth. The XJT MEC should embrace change and not be afraid of it. Look what happened to Comair when they became unreasonable.
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How did Comair become to unreasonable?

CzechAirman said:
Why don't you guys one list with Skywest? If regionals owned by the same company can't merger seniority lists, then how in the world did Comair think they were going to merge seniority lists with Delta?
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Where did you hear Comair was going to merge list with Delta? Comair will never become one list, and if some Comair pilot is telling you that, they're living a pipe dream and you're dumb enough to even listen to them.
 
There was a time when Delta considered making Comair a part of the family (in the sense of seniority lists) if my memory serves. It's all a little fuzzy, though. I seem to remember being told some super senior Comair guys didn't want that, back in the day. (This is secondhand from an ex-Comair friend of mine, too.)

surreal1221 said:
This. No one left the meeting early, nor did anyone leave with any amount of fireworks that some would find entertaining, sorry to disappoint.
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Aw man, I was really looking for a repeat of the USAPA-comes-to-Phoenix YouTube videos...
 
CaptMaxPerformance said:
How did Comair become to unreasonable?


Where did you hear Comair was going to merge list with Delta? Comair will never become one list, and if some Comair pilot is telling you that, they're living a pipe dream and you're dumb enough to even listen to them.
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What rock did you just crawl out from to not know that Comair's strike was their death knell. They got too expensive with their contract (influenced heavily by the hoards of lifers there that didn't want to start over at the bottom of a major) trying to make it like a minor major's contract and not a regional contract which they still were.

Comair tried to implement a PID on Delta and force a DOH merger with Delta that would have immediately made the senior Comair lifers instant international widebody captains at Delta. Needless to say, that went over like a ton of bricks at Delta and led to the formation of the RJDC and the banning of Comair pilots being hired by Delta.
 
CzechAirman said:
What rock did you just crawl out from to not know that Comair's strike was their death knell. They got too expensive with their contract (influenced heavily by the hoards of lifers there that didn't want to start over at the bottom of a major) trying to make it like a minor major's contract and not a regional contract which they still were.
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Oh, unreasonable, you mean standing up for what you believe in, raising the bar and holding management to the contract that they agreed to and sign. Got it!
God forbid a "regional" airline who is doing the MAJORITY of flying for the mainline, and by making that mainline profitable, get paid their worth. So being a "regional" pilot one should make a welfare salary because they fly for a regional.
 
CaptMaxPerformance said:
Oh, unreasonable, you mean standing up for what you believe in, raising the bar and holding management to the contract that they agreed to and sign. Got it!
God forbid a "regional" airline who is doing the MAJORITY of flying for the mainline, and by making that mainline profitable, get paid their worth. So being a "regional" pilot one should make a welfare salary because they fly for a regional.
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A regional shouldn't be a career destination. That's what happens when regional contracts are too good, people there get comfy and too complacent to move on to better jobs. Regionals should never pay well enough that one is tempted to stay for the duration. Every regional pilot should aspire to move on to mainline. That's the natural order.
 
Trip7 said:
Our instructors are saying the XJT MEC is trying to sell them down the river. Don't know what that meant because I don't know the instructor section of the contract that well. As far as the negotiations, Im hearing XJT MEC is being very militant and unreasonable, especially when it comes to PBS
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Not my fight anymore but why some ASA guys are so quick to defend PBS is beyond me. The XJT vacation model was second to none.
 
Cav said:
Not my fight anymore but why some ASA guys are so quick to defend PBS is beyond me. The XJT vacation model was second to none.
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It has nothing to do with PBS - you could easily incorporate the same language into PBS. Have an 'ignore vacation' feature that allows the conflicting trips to be built into your schedule then automatically dropped with pay. Thing is, I doubt management will go for it and I doubt they'll allow the current ExpressJet vacation language to stand.

Not saying the ExpressJet vacation model is bad, but for my Jan 30- Feb 5 vacation I know for sure that I can get 30 days off and I might extend that to 34. The ExpressJet model can't match that. Unfortunately, I think this is another feature that is likely to go away.

BTW, while on furlough, I was livid when my pilot group voted in PBS. After several months using the system, I've changed my mind and think it would be a great tool combined with the scheduling work rules in the ExpressJet contract.
 
You've gotta understand that ExpressJet, being so closely tied with CAL, only knows PBS as the system and work rules that CAL's current concessionary contract have, which is to say, it's horrible.

When you try to explain the vacation low over two months deal to XJT pilots, most of us will lash out and tell you that it's impossible, and that PBS sucks.

But at the same time, Cav IS right, the vacation dropping system we have for line bidding IS second to none when you're comparing apples to apples. You can get 3 weeks off and credit 95 hours.
 
Cav said:
Not my fight anymore but why some ASA guys are so quick to defend PBS is beyond me. The XJT vacation model was second to none.
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That vacation model is second to none, but I only get vacation 2 weeks a year. The rest of the time im working. And in MY experience, my QOL has gone way up with our PBS system. I can only say what I've seen.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
That vacation model is second to none, but I only get vacation 2 weeks a year. The rest of the time im working. And in MY experience, my QOL has gone way up with our PBS system. I can only say what I've seen.
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It's really hard to compare the two systems, to be honest.

We've got WAY better soft time rules, so we can get 3 weeks off and credit our original line value.

You guys can get more days off with your system, but you don't get paid as much for it.

We pick up on top of vacation? It goes in as add pay. I know a guy that credited 200 hours by working over his vacation month.
 
Cav said:
Not my fight anymore but why some ASA guys are so quick to defend PBS is beyond me. The XJT vacation model was second to none.
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Our "vacation low" preference in PBS makes our vacation model just as good if not better than the XJT model when it comes to days off. I turned a week's vacation into 22 days off. Worked 8 days out of the first 10 days of the month then had the rest of the month off. Also had the 1st 5 days of the next month off because I was able to set a preference where I started my first 4 day of the next month as late as possible to still build me a schedule.

I like PBS because it gets my schedule right the first shot. I'm not interested in racing other pilots to the computer every month for some "improvement window" so I can swap, drop and pick up til Im satisfied.
 
jtrain609 said:
It's really hard to compare the two systems, to be honest.

We've got WAY better soft time rules, so we can get 3 weeks off and credit our original line value.

You guys can get more days off with your system, but you don't get paid as much for it.

We pick up on top of vacation? It goes in as add pay. I know a guy that credited 200 hours by working over his vacation month.
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That's a good point. You guys do get paid a lot more for your vacation. Normally we can't pick up on top of our vacation unless the company is offering vacation buyback which happens every....you guessed it...Summer!

While I would love to add your vacation pay scheme, I know there is no chance in hell. Company is already regretting the PBS vacation model(vacation low preference) they agreed to so there is pretty much zero chance they'll let us improve it.
 
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