Poll: ALPA vs Teamsters...Which is better for Colgan?

[Velocipede]

I love all this B.S. about stapling.

Have you ever wondered why F/As ROUTINELY accept DoH SLIs?

Because, in the end, it doesn't really matter and you've all got to work together eventually.

 

[SteveC]

How's about you guys tone it down a little, eh?

:bandit:

(edit to add: was directed back a couple of posts, not directly at you Velo. I missed this page when replying...)

 

[Seggy]

Let me settle all of this. The PNCL ALPA MEC chair DOES NOT want us stapled to their list. ALPA doesn't want it either. Think about it, they organize a group, then have us stapled?!?!?! Why would they spend the money to organize us, put the time into it, to potentially have us file a massive lawsuit against them for unfair representation. A staple job with ALPA is not going to happen.

End of story, no argument there.

We got a freebie last year by not voting ALPA in. I doubt we will this year. I completely understand why the PNCL pilots are pissed. Not at us here at Colgan, but at management. They want what is fair to them and that is an industry leading contract.

To be honest though, there is a lot of support for the IBT here. For no good reason as far as I am concerned. We had a former CHQ guy on the jumpseat yesterday. To prove a point to myself, I asked him about the Teamsters. Even though he did a lot of work with them (hotel committee chair, etc.) he said flat out that they 'suck'. If you don't believe me ask USMC-SGT. He was there.

ALPA has a big fight ahead of them. Let us all stay on track and educate why we need ALPA. There are a lot of lurkers on her from Colgan and I don't want to start pissing matches.

To the guys at Colgan. Get educated to make the best choice. Any questions don't hesitate to PM or call me.

 

[USMC-SSGT]

The gospel truth. In fact, I think his exact words were something to the effect of "I wouldnt wish teamsters on my worst enemy."

 

[surreal1221]

The gospel truth. In fact, I think his exact words were something to the effect of "I wouldnt wish teamsters on my worst enemy."

Nobody would. . .:bandit:

 

[higney85]

if you truly want to work together than stop with the "vote alpa or else..." language. And where does allegheny-mohawk protocol play into a seniority integration. what does "fair and equitable" mean to you?

there will be no staple.

Whether you vote ALPA or not you need to re-read the allegheny-mohawk in addition to read the ARBITRATION award.... I am not sitting here claiming "ALPA is great", what I am saying as your brother under PNCL corp is "joining the team" cannot hurt. I will not sit here and give a sales pitch, but I am one who deals with facts- reread the "protocol" and the scope arbitration before you make a decision. I am not wanting your Q's, I am not worried about seniority, but I am worried about the future between our pilot groups if we are pinned against each other instead of being "family" in this business world.

 

[sherpa]

Whether you vote ALPA or not you need to re-read the allegheny-mohawk in addition to read the ARBITRATION award.... I am not sitting here claiming "ALPA is great", what I am saying as your brother under PNCL corp is "joining the team" cannot hurt. I will not sit here and give a sales pitch, but I am one who deals with facts- reread the "protocol" and the scope arbitration before you make a decision. I am not wanting your Q's, I am not worried about seniority, but I am worried about the future between our pilot groups if we are pinned against each other instead of being "family" in this business world.

I have been doing some research on the allegheny-mohawk protocol and keep coming up with fair and equitable section 3 and binding arbitration section 13. I can't seem to find the equivalent to staple anywhere. Can you send me some info about how a staple could occur in light of allegheny mohawk?

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Simple. Allegheny-Mohawk is a three step process if taken to completion, but agreement can be reached at any given step. If a company has no union, then management is designated as your bargaining representative. Step one of the ALG-Mohawk LPPs is direct negotiations between the two parties. In this case, that would be ALPA and management, since the CJC pilots have no union to negotiate for them. If management decided that going to arbitration was too costly and too risky, then they could simply settle with ALPA for a staple-job of the CJC group. The CJC pilots would have no say in the matter, because management is your only representative under the LPPs without a union. Since agreement was reached at step 1, you don't proceed to arbitration (step 3, which comes after mediated talks) where the "fair and equitable" clause would be used as the standard.

Disclaimer: this is only a hypothetical, as PCL ALPA has absolutely no desire at present time to staple the CJC group.

 

[jynxyjoe]

Disclaimer: this is only a hypothetical, as PCL ALPA has absolutely no desire at present time to staple the CJC group.

Right, but the PCL MEC isn't gonna fork over the money to keep the process going once the company says, "just staple them"?

Question, could the two at step one just say "Date of hire with 24 month fences on current equipment"?

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Right, but the PCL MEC isn't gonna fork over the money to keep the process going once the company says, "just staple them"?

I doubt any money would be necessary. Under those circumstances, the company would just be looking for the quickest and cheapest way to get it over with. If the MEC offered something more favorable to the CJC guys (ratio, for example), then there's no reason the company would refuse. The point is simple: the PCL MEC has no desire to staple the CJC pilots.

Question, could the two at step one just say "Date of hire with 24 month fences on current equipment"?

As long as the CJC group is non-union, management and ALPA can reach any agreement imaginable with no say whatsoever from the CJC pilots.

 

[jynxyjoe]

I doubt any money would be necessary. Under those circumstances, the company would just be looking for the quickest and cheapest way to get it over with. If the MEC offered something more favorable to the CJC guys (ratio, for example), then there's no reason the company would refuse. The point is simple: the PCL MEC has no desire to staple the CJC pilots.



As long as the CJC group is non-union, management and ALPA can reach any agreement imaginable with no say whatsoever from the CJC pilots.

Well, sounds like the CJC guys are gonna get the deal of a lifetime. I keep hoping to hear some news on a conclusion to the contract soon from the MEM guys. Guy I talked to about 2 days ago made it sounds like date of hire with 24 month fences was already done (which is good news for all). PCL guys in large seem positive.

 

[sherpa]

so as long as the people representing the cjc pilots does not agree to a staple it won't happen per AMP. I did understand it then.

The pncl mec should encourage pncl pilots to not talk stapler when speaking to their colgan friends. It creates much anti pncl alpa sentiment among the ranks.

 

[higney85]

The pncl mec should encourage pncl pilots to not talk stapler when speaking to their colgan friends. It creates much anti pncl alpa sentiment among the ranks.

I have yet to see any PNCL pilot on this board or APC mention a "Staplejob". I have a poll up on the company board and the majority wants fences, others simply vote to approach this with "open arms" so the Colgan folks should know the 9E guys are only here in positive support of solidarity towards mgmt, instead of colgan being a possible "pawn". If you have Pncl pilot calling for a "staplejob" off this board send me a PM and I will see what bug has crawled up their rear, they may be one of the 6 pilots that were not part of our 99.39%.

 

[sherpa]

I have yet to see any PNCL pilot on this board or APC mention a "Staplejob". I have a poll up on the company board and the majority wants fences, others simply vote to approach this with "open arms" so the Colgan folks should know the 9E guys are only here in positive support of solidarity towards mgmt, instead of colgan being a possible "pawn". If you have Pncl pilot calling for a "staplejob" off this board send me a PM and I will see what bug has crawled up their rear, they may be one of the 6 pilots that were not part of our 99.39%.

sounds good.

 

[jynxyjoe]

I have yet to see any PNCL pilot on this board or APC mention a "Staplejob". I have a poll up on the company board and the majority wants fences, others simply vote to approach this with "open arms" so the Colgan folks should know the 9E guys are only here in positive support of solidarity towards mgmt, instead of colgan being a possible "pawn". If you have Pncl pilot calling for a "staplejob" off this board send me a PM and I will see what bug has crawled up their rear, they may be one of the 6 pilots that were not part of our 99.39%.

Dropped off a PCL capt yesterday in MLU (bringing him home) and got a chance to talk to him. He thinks it absolutely stupid anyone would want to staple. He actually used to words "open arms". The myth of real life pinnacle pilots wanting to staple CJC'ers continues.

 

[kellwolf]

Dropped off a PCL capt yesterday in MLU (bringing him home) and got a chance to talk to him. He thinks it absolutely stupid anyone would want to staple. He actually used to words "open arms". The myth of real life pinnacle pilots wanting to staple CJC'ers continues.

I can almost guarantee I know that guy. We've got 3 that commute from MLU-MEM, and I've flown with all three of 'em.

 

[jynxyjoe]

I can almost guarantee I know that guy. We've got 3 that commute from MLU-MEM, and I've flown with all three of 'em.

Seemed like a pretty cool cat to me.