Picking an airline because of their bases
- Thread starter Seggy
- Start date
Seggy
Well-Known Member
Let me refine this to say that if you are looking to go to a major, there is a better chance that the base structure will be similar over the years. Like others have said, Delta at DFW, Continental at GSO, United with the international flying out of NYC are all examples off the top of my head of majors changing their bases
That is EXACTLY it. Guys applying today are spending days upon days of there time worrying about upgrade time, what airline have aircraft orders, bases, pay, when back in the day, guys would just be happy when they got a call by a commuter/regional.
No one has a crystal ball, who know what will happen tomorrow on the contract feeder carriers. Be flexible
There are a lot of people that go to the first place that hires them, happy they have a chance to fly for an airline, go there and see what will happen.
And how many bases west of IAH did your company have two years ago
.
I would just hate to see guys and gals limit themselves out there because of todays bases at the regional level!
That is EXACTLY it. Guys applying today are spending days upon days of there time worrying about upgrade time, what airline have aircraft orders, bases, pay, when back in the day, guys would just be happy when they got a call by a commuter/regional.
No one has a crystal ball, who know what will happen tomorrow on the contract feeder carriers. Be flexible
There are a lot of people that go to the first place that hires them, happy they have a chance to fly for an airline, go there and see what will happen.
And how many bases west of IAH did your company have two years ago
.I would just hate to see guys and gals limit themselves out there because of todays bases at the regional level!
mtsu_av8er
Well-Known Member
I say go to whatever airline makes you happy. If it's because of a base, so be it. If it's because of pay, so be it. If it's because you're always dreamed of flying a particular airplane, so be it.
As long as you can deal with changes and whatever consequences your choice may bring you, just go and have fun!
As long as you can deal with changes and whatever consequences your choice may bring you, just go and have fun!
Screaming_Emu
Well-Known Member
Stop it Lloyd, you're making too much sense!
mtsu_av8er
Well-Known Member
I know - stupid me. My time might be better spent comparing my schedule to the contract looking for something to grieve.
jtrain609
Antisocial Monster
I'm a U number over at Express. Know what the U stands for? "U better hope branded flying works!" Because if it doesn't, then I'm hosed, Ontario is gone as a base and a bunch of guys that came to Express are going to be PISSED OFF they didn't go to Skywest.
As somebody said, unless you're talking about living in Atlanta and going to Delta or something similar, DO NOT pick a regional based on bases. Sure I'm doing the commute from hell going from SLC-EWR right now, and soon it'll be an easy SLC-LAX commute, but for all I know I'll be driving to work next year.
As somebody said, unless you're talking about living in Atlanta and going to Delta or something similar, DO NOT pick a regional based on bases. Sure I'm doing the commute from hell going from SLC-EWR right now, and soon it'll be an easy SLC-LAX commute, but for all I know I'll be driving to work next year.
LoadMasterC141
Well-Known Member
Is ONT going to be closed, or just not an option because of how senior it has gone??
Chewie von Nubbins
New Member
http://www.willflyforfood.cc
http://www.airlinepilotcentral.com
Gives pay rates, HQ, bases, etc... Not sure about listing where training occurs.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
I don't see anything wrong with running the numbers on those things. It makes you better informed when applying to airlines, in fact. If you someone wants TPIC and picks a regional with closing bases, no aircraft orders and expiring contracts, then they'll be in for a rude awakening not long after they start flying for said airline. And you know what I would have said? "Do your research." There's nothing wrong with researching airlines. Personally, I wouldn't apply to United right now b/c they have no growth or aircraft orders. To me, that means it's stagnant and begging to be merged with someone.
Now you can pick and choose your regionals pretty much, so there's no excuse for getting caught off guard when something happens. Okay, so Colgan getting bought by Pinnacle was totally out of the blue, but you have to be able to roll with the punches in this industry. It caught the Colgan guys off guard b/c the corporate culture there totally did a 180, and it caught us off guard b/c now managment has a very real airline in their pocket with the potential to whipsaw us against. I don't stay up at night worrying about it, and I don't plan on taking my ball and going home until something solid happens (like some of our planes start going to Colgan). But information is power.
Seggy
Well-Known Member
I will need to disagree with you here buddy. Look how bleak it was at Mesaba a year ago. A month ago upgrades went from eight years to eight hours.
I agree do your research, but like you say you MUST roll with the punches in this industry. What you research on the regional level probably won't matter in a few years anyway. Who would have thought Colgan would be opening an EWR base two years ago? Or XJT would be opening bases west of IAH. Or Comair would have closed their MCO base. Or (the list can go on and on at the contract feed carrier level).
Hopefully you guys get a good contract, with good scope and everything works itself out for both pilot groups on both sides of our holding company!
SmitteyB
Well-Known Member
Personally- I think this is great. The ball isn't in the airline's court anymore. It's in each pilot's court, respectively.
The times are different now and we all as pilots have the option to chose where we want to be. I don't think we should have to wait by the phone...now the airlines are waiting by the phone, waiting for OUR call. Which is EXACTLY how it should be.
I chose Colgan because of the base. And it seems to really bother people here that I like the current base structure. Airdale hates it because it doesn't work for him. Seggy hates it for a number of reasons. I do NOT think it's the most efficient way to run and I think it will change (although it's amazing 100% of the captains I've flown with say it wont change).
With that being said- I completely understood the consequences of chosing an airline on their bases. If it should end, it ends. You wont see tears from me.
SmitteyB
Well-Known Member
I really don't think PNCL Corp. really has any intention of whipsawing your pilot group against Colgan- do you? I know things come out of the blue, but there has been ZERO talk about any of that. And doesn't your scope say that any new jet flying must to go Pinnacle Airlines, Inc.?
Colgan is having a hard time staffing the Saab, let alone the Q400- no way Trenary would give your flying to Manassas and tell them to staff it. I'm young and naive, but from a business standpoint, I don't see how they could do it, honestly.
Like Seggy, I'll echo- I hope you guys get a fair and deserving contract and I hope our pilot group can grow and become respected as card carrying members next summer.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
Smittey, the elements for a whipsaw are already in place, you just haven't seen the effects of it yet. Having two seniority lists is by nature a whipsaw. And just because you haven't seen it yet and it doesn't make LONG TERM business sense doesn't mean it won't happen. Unfortunately, since deregulation this industry has been about getting the most out of your work groups to make money for the shareholders. Nowhere are the stakeholders even considered.
That's great outstation basing works for you. Are you prepared to be the number 1 FO and have your base close? Will you be willing to go start over somewhere else. Somewhere else where you have to commute? Ask Tram how going with the unsure thing turned out for him.
I guess my point is, don't ever assume management won't do something because they haven't done it yet or it doesn't make sense for them to do it. Sure, it may not happen (I think it will) but assuming that only sets you up for failure if it does happen. If you are prepared for it or are fighting to prevent the conditions from even being in place for something like that even to happen, then you don't have to worry so much about it.
That's great outstation basing works for you. Are you prepared to be the number 1 FO and have your base close? Will you be willing to go start over somewhere else. Somewhere else where you have to commute? Ask Tram how going with the unsure thing turned out for him.
I guess my point is, don't ever assume management won't do something because they haven't done it yet or it doesn't make sense for them to do it. Sure, it may not happen (I think it will) but assuming that only sets you up for failure if it does happen. If you are prepared for it or are fighting to prevent the conditions from even being in place for something like that even to happen, then you don't have to worry so much about it.
jtrain609
Antisocial Monster
ONT ain't closing! Don't believe the hype that they're sellin' ya! San Antonio is still the most senior base, followed by Houston.
skydog
New Member
Obviously there are certain carriers where that is valid advice: Great Lakes, Colgan, etc
But it seems very unlikely at the moment that companies like American Eagle and XJET will pull out of bases like DFW and IAH (respectively). Of course they're are the exceptions like Air Wisconsin, but changing bases wasn't their idea.
Folks, at the end of the day, an airline is just like any other company, in that from time to time, the work shifts and people have to move if they want to keep their job.
But it seems very unlikely at the moment that companies like American Eagle and XJET will pull out of bases like DFW and IAH (respectively). Of course they're are the exceptions like Air Wisconsin, but changing bases wasn't their idea.
Folks, at the end of the day, an airline is just like any other company, in that from time to time, the work shifts and people have to move if they want to keep their job.
:yeahthat:
Tell all those pissed off guys to think back to their pre-interview when they basically told them stuff like that could happen. Or, log on to the internets and do some research.
I'm not gonna lie - I'd be pissed if I suddenly had to move. But I'd be pissed at the situation, not the company. The company has to move where the work is. 168 flying 30 lbs to BOS 4 days a week wasn't paying the bills, I gather.
And you know what - I tried to bid that guy's run here - he beat me out by a day. No he's gone and I'm still here. Go figure!
FlyChicaga
Vintage Restoration
Personally, I look at airlines based on their corporate culture and the other employees that work there. I ask myself, "Can I see myself being happy working for this company based on their operating philosophy?" Also, "Can I work with the guys and gals I have met from this company?" There are a few companies out there that aren't really on my radar, simply because of their corporate culture. I do not want to work for a company that does not align itself with the values I hold strong. I also shy away from companies that historically have had very militant relationships between management and labor. Of course, leadership could change, but it would take many years of hard work to re-establish the trust that was destroyed by the past management team.
I don't care much about what I fly, where I fly, or what base they have. Those are considerations, but secondary considerations. First and foremost, I'd like to find a place that continues to make me happy to go to work. I've been blessed to have worked at two airlines so far that had a culture that aligned itself with my values.
Just my two cents.
