scooter2525
Very well Member
You are more Ted Stevens at this point.
Paying your dues???
- Thread starter Maximilian_Jenius
- Start date
Maximilian_Jenius
Super User
No, Ted Nugent!
scooter2525
Very well Member
I was going for a ANC reference. But Boris with a flavor saver would be a funny sight.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
I'm slightly self promoting here but, I actually just posted something yesterday about the joys of paying one's dues while flight instructing.
True story.
True story.
thehobbit
Well-Known Member
The lack of housing caused by the oil business. i spent more time than i cared to in midland a couple of summers ago doing aerial survey.
Stone Cold
Well-Known Member
Haha. That's! Awesome!
Oh god, he‘s like the Michael Jordan of the block.
We don’t kink shame around here.
knot4u
Repeat Offender
WacoFan
Bigly
"The right".
This isn't the thread, but "the right" doesn't seem "right" or "Conservative" or "sane" anymore.
But I'm a Demonrat voting libural who hate America now and such.
Well, sadly, their mantra is “Democracy? Yuck, we can’t have everyone voting” while simultaneously fondling the bones of the founding fathers, ”Houston, we have a problem”.
ozziecat35
4 out of 5 great lakes prefer Michigan.
@Maximilian_Jenius ,ultimately, you'll figure out what's "worth it" enough for your requirements. I was in a similar bind like you a while back, older dude, family requirements / etc. Whereas I got really lucky with finding a low time survey job with 250 hrs thanks to JC, even once I had more hours I still had to be really careful what I could and couldn't do to keep food on the table but while also continuing to build time and expand the aviation resume....Anything I qualified for didn't pay enough to be able to leave my 75k IT career, and I was always just a little short of hours for the jobs that made it doable. I got stupidly lucky. I also didn't want to CFI. I tried the American Flyers CFI course, and quit after doing the first flight from the right seat, I hated it that much, so I had to find other ways...the drawback here, and it's one you're well aware of, is that it's doable without CFI'ing, it's just a much less direct pathway.
All that said, with stuff picking back up with airline hiring, you should start seeing more survey gigs with openings. The guys who put you into a 172 and send you out across the country for months at a time are where it's at from a time building perspective. Dropping jumpers is a good one, but I know in the valley the only big outfit is all multi stuff down in Eloy and you're still working on that rating, so no real help there. To answer your original question directly, no, I don't think right seat in a Caravan is worthwhile, especially at those rates. You're about as well networked as anyone I've ever met, so it's just a matter of time. Wasn't there a guy here on JC who did all his survey hiring through JC just a season or 2 ago?
Keep your head up man, it's gonna happen.
All that said, with stuff picking back up with airline hiring, you should start seeing more survey gigs with openings. The guys who put you into a 172 and send you out across the country for months at a time are where it's at from a time building perspective. Dropping jumpers is a good one, but I know in the valley the only big outfit is all multi stuff down in Eloy and you're still working on that rating, so no real help there. To answer your original question directly, no, I don't think right seat in a Caravan is worthwhile, especially at those rates. You're about as well networked as anyone I've ever met, so it's just a matter of time. Wasn't there a guy here on JC who did all his survey hiring through JC just a season or 2 ago?
Keep your head up man, it's gonna happen.
Screaming_Emu
Well-Known Member
Two thoughts.
1) IF it’s possible to instruct, that’s what he should do. But I get that shelling out more money for yet another cert might not be in the plans.
2) There’s gotta be someone on JC that’s in a position to help. That’s what this place is about and Max is one of the good ones here.
ozziecat35
4 out of 5 great lakes prefer Michigan.
I respectfully disagree to point 1. I can teach a lot of things...I can teach people how to ride horses, I can teach people basic IT troubleshooting, how to change a tire / etc...I am not a good flight instructor. It's not where my brain excels when flying planes. I think we need people to realize that. Otherwise we perpetuate the CFI's who do it because they have to, not because they want to, and the person who suffers is the student. I had good and bad CFI's coming up. It was easy to tell who was doing it because they also liked it, and who was there for the hours.
Used to be three traffic planes over PHX for three radio stations, morning and evening. I believe those all went to traffic cameras now on the freeways and major intersections.
There used to be a 135 operator that I mentioned earlier down at P19 that flew PA32 and 32Rs as well as 206s and 207s, hauling cargo all around AZ and into western NM. Even would hire VFR-only guys and stick them on the P19-NYL run until they built time. Had a PA31 you could then move up into. Would’ve been perfect fit for Max.
PM Air used to be out of PHX, flying PA31s for UPS and Airborne, and Caravans for FedEx. Scenic Air Cargo took over the UPS runs and Empire took the FedEx runs after PM had a few fatal accidents in ‘88, ‘90, and ‘93. Scenic was cool as one was a Skywest employee working for them at the time.
There used to be a 135 operator that I mentioned earlier down at P19 that flew PA32 and 32Rs as well as 206s and 207s, hauling cargo all around AZ and into western NM. Even would hire VFR-only guys and stick them on the P19-NYL run until they built time. Had a PA31 you could then move up into. Would’ve been perfect fit for Max.
PM Air used to be out of PHX, flying PA31s for UPS and Airborne, and Caravans for FedEx. Scenic Air Cargo took over the UPS runs and Empire took the FedEx runs after PM had a few fatal accidents in ‘88, ‘90, and ‘93. Scenic was cool as one was a Skywest employee working for them at the time.
arkflyr
Well-Known Member
Same in Kansas City 20 years ago. I did both flight instruction and traffic watch as soon as I could while working for the FBO at MKC.
There were also several 135 check haulers with bases and two headquartered there. One of them, Safewing, had Lances and Aztecs and would hire VFR 135 pilots at 500tt.
Another Central Air Southwest, had a pay to play SIC program for like 10$/hr for SIC multi time in the AC-500. They got people from all over flying for them building time. The flight school the I ended up working for at had a deal with them in their PCATD sim to do initial training prior to them getting in the Commander. One of the deals they had was with American Trans Air when they retired their 727s to get their PFEs that wanted to transition to the 737 enough time for their ATP.
I agree with everyone here though, if you can find a way to instruct do that, if you can’t then try to find something that at least gets you out and making decisions and getting as broad of knowledge base as you can.
There were also several 135 check haulers with bases and two headquartered there. One of them, Safewing, had Lances and Aztecs and would hire VFR 135 pilots at 500tt.
Another Central Air Southwest, had a pay to play SIC program for like 10$/hr for SIC multi time in the AC-500. They got people from all over flying for them building time. The flight school the I ended up working for at had a deal with them in their PCATD sim to do initial training prior to them getting in the Commander. One of the deals they had was with American Trans Air when they retired their 727s to get their PFEs that wanted to transition to the 737 enough time for their ATP.
I agree with everyone here though, if you can find a way to instruct do that, if you can’t then try to find something that at least gets you out and making decisions and getting as broad of knowledge base as you can.
Screaming_Emu
Well-Known Member
I respectfully disagree with your respectful disagreement.
Just because you don’t LOVE instructing doesn’t mean you have to do a disservice to your students. You’re probably not thrilled to be back in the right seat (hopefully very temporary), but I’m sure you show up and fly like a professional.
Instructing exercises and strengthens the exact same skill set you need to work well in a multi crew environment. Not saying that’s the only way to do that, but it is likely the best, quickest, and easiest.
I was absolutely terrified of instructing at first. That’s a lot of pressure to put on a 250 hour pilot. But once I got into the groove of it and had enough experience to be comfortable I really enjoyed it. It might not be for everyone, but sometimes on the chart of “things I don’t want to do vs things I have to do to get where I want” the data points towards instructing.
Boris Badenov
Fortis Leader
There's a name I haven't heard for eons. They had a Lance that would fill in for our 210s when they broke. Not FIKI approved, but somehow it always got there. In December. In the Midwest. It seriously looked like someone lived in it, complete with chintzy, filthy 70s window-curtains. Basically a VW van with wings. I was always surprised when the dude opened the door and A) He was neither Cheech nor Chong, B) There was no cloud of pot smoke boiling out.
Boris Badenov
Fortis Leader
This is what I would have said less succinctly. Unless you want to make a career at Safewing, you're going to be flying with other people for the rest of your career. Instructing, in addition to all of the other, aforementioned virtues, introduces you to how to do that. Notice that of the people saying "some people just aren't cut out for instructing", very few (maybe zero, I didn't count) of them instructed.
Screaming_Emu
Well-Known Member
Are you rotting away in ANC yet?