OK to continue taxi after clearing?

kiloalpha

Well-Known Member
After landing I usually take the taxiway closest to my hanger so I don't have to taxi for a long time. Usually they (Tower Contollers) will either tell me "Off at Delta, Ground point niner." or "Delta Foxtrot Delta to hanger eight with me."

When it's really busy, tower won't even bother handing me off and I'll just go over to ground without being told (Don't try that at CPS, they get pretty angry) but when it's really slow, and after I clear the runway I don't get the handoff or taxi instructions, so I just continue my taxi in. They know where I'm going since we are based there.

I'm just wondering if I should continue to taxi if I don't hear anything or if I should CYA and stop and ask?
 

MikeFavinger

Hubschrauber Flieger
You probably already know this, but AIM 4-3-20 says:

4-3-20. Exiting the Runway After Landing
The following procedures must be followed after landing and reaching taxi speed.
a. Exit the runway without delay at the first available taxiway or on a taxiway as instructed by ATC. Pilots shall not exit the landing runway onto another runway unless authorized by ATC. At airports with an operating control tower, pilots should not stop or reverse course on the runway without first obtaining ATC approval.
b. Taxi clear of the runway unless otherwise directed by ATC. An aircraft is considered clear of the runway when all parts of the aircraft are past the runway edge and there are no restrictions to its continued movement beyond the runway holding position markings. In the absence of ATC instructions, the pilot is expected to taxi clear of the landing runway by taxiing beyond the runway holding position markings associated with the landing runway, even if that requires the aircraft to protrude into or cross another taxiway or ramp area. Once all parts of the aircraft have crossed the runway holding position markings, the pilot must hold unless further instructions have been issued by ATC.
NOTE-
1. The tower will issue the pilot instructions which will permit the aircraft to enter another taxiway, runway, or ramp area when required.
2. Guidance contained in subparagraphs a and b above is considered an integral part of the landing clearance and satisfies the requirement of 14 CFR Section 91.129.
c. Immediately change to ground control frequency when advised by the tower and obtain a taxi clearance.
NOTE-
1. The tower will issue instructions required to resolve any potential conflictions with other ground traffic prior to advising the pilot to contact ground control.
2. A clearance from ATC to taxi to the ramp authorizes the aircraft to cross all runways and taxiway intersections. Pilots not familiar with the taxi route should request specific taxi instructions from ATC.
 

ppragman

FLIPY FLAPS!
After landing I usually take the taxiway closest to my hanger so I don't have to taxi for a long time. Usually they (Tower Contollers) will either tell me "Off at Delta, Ground point niner." or "Delta Foxtrot Delta to hanger eight with me."

When it's really busy, tower won't even bother handing me off and I'll just go over to ground without being told (Don't try that at CPS, they get pretty angry) but when it's really slow, and after I clear the runway I don't get the handoff or taxi instructions, so I just continue my taxi in. They know where I'm going since we are based there.

I'm just wondering if I should continue to taxi if I don't hear anything or if I should CYA and stop and ask?
I wouldn't switch over, the AIM expressedly forbids it (see above) just sit tight, and if you don't get any lovin' from tower say "Commander 123ABC, Taxi to park?" And they'll switch ya, or send ya. We have guys here who won't wait to taxi, and I'm waiting for the only A-hole controller at MRI to get pissy (there's only one here, and now there seems to be a campaign from one of the local flight schools to get the guy fired, he is an ass though).
 

SpiceWeasel

Tre Kronor
I wouldn't switch over, the AIM expressedly forbids it (see above) just sit tight, and if you don't get any lovin' from tower say "Commander 123ABC, Taxi to park?" And they'll switch ya, or send ya. We have guys here who won't wait to taxi, and I'm waiting for the only A-hole controller at MRI to get pissy (there's only one here, and now there seems to be a campaign from one of the local flight schools to get the guy fired, he is an ass though).
Boy it sure is different flying in the regionals. I don't think I've stopped once exiting the runway.
 

kiloalpha

Well-Known Member
Yeah, I guess I'll have to sit tight. I would like to keep my record clean and especially with the feds starting the ride-along program with us this week. I wish they would tell us to expect to roll out to a further taxiway, I'll usually grab the brakes pretty hard to make the first exit, but the flight school there shares that taxiway, so I would have to keep rolling. Ehh, guess you can't win at everything.
 

SpiceWeasel

Tre Kronor
Yeah, you're supposed to, though I think a lot of people don't.
Ok.... lemme rephrase that. The few times we *have* stopped because we couldn't get a word into ground, we got yelled at over the frequency for stopping. lol Once in DTW and once in ATL.
 

ppragman

FLIPY FLAPS!
Yeah, I guess I'll have to sit tight. I would like to keep my record clean and especially with the feds starting the ride-along program with us this week. I wish they would tell us to expect to roll out to a further taxiway, I'll usually grab the brakes pretty hard to make the first exit, but the flight school there shares that taxiway, so I would have to keep rolling. Ehh, guess you can't win at everything.
You don't have to mash the brakes, remember its "the first available taxiway," if that means you have to roll out extra, don't worry about it. Pull off, and if you get forgotten a quick "FreightGod Twelve Thirty Four, taxi to park?" will do.
 

ppragman

FLIPY FLAPS!
Ok.... lemme rephrase that. The few times we *have* stopped because we couldn't get a word into ground, we got yelled at over the frequency for stopping. lol Once in DTW and once in ATL.
I'd be like, "then get us a clearance. I'll bring a copy of the aim up to the tower when I get off."
 

Yank&BankmyRJ145

New Member
Ok.... lemme rephrase that. The few times we *have* stopped because we couldn't get a word into ground, we got yelled at over the frequency for stopping. lol Once in DTW and once in ATL.
You better contact ground in DFW and get that clearance. I heard them letting a local guy have it one day. If your local pilot they expect you to know the flow, if your not they spoon feed you and you get away with a lot. I have stopped more at DFW than anyother airport only bc ground is so busy(not lately).

ORD never stop keep moving or go to the BOX. They yell at you up there for stopping.:panic:

The best is "Mexicana is on taxiway B moving north everyone watchout, I dont know where he is going"-ORD ground:rotfl:
 

BajtheJino

I'm looking at you.
Boy it sure is different flying in the regionals. I don't think I've stopped once exiting the runway.
Freight is no different really. I can't remember the last time I stopped. Sometimes you know, its just not practical and only complicates the flow of traffic.
 

kiloalpha

Well-Known Member
I like making that taxi way, my courrier is always waiting and happy customers means happy paychecks. Plus I can get fully loaded Commander stopped in about 1,100 feet. Not to bad by medium twin standards. Probably won't be doing that with Mr. FAA sitting next to me though.
 

SoCalAprch

Well-Known Member
HAHA I love ORD. And I second the don't stop there. They get more upset at you for stopping than if you go the wrong way.
 

wheelsup

Well-Known Member
The AIM says to stop but I'd bet the majority of tower/ground controllers expect air carriers to taxi and call on the way in (within reason the exeption being Chicago). Also keep in mind if you stop and can't get a word in then there are other planes coming up behind you.

Think PHL at night, off on a high speed, not a good idea to sit there and wait while SWA is on your tail!
 

n9088d

New Member
ppragman has the right idea, guys. The cool thing about discussing [most] regulation-related topics is that there shouldn't be a debate. There is a right answer, and it's as simple as that. When people decide they have a better idea than the FARs or AIM (like when a tower/ground controller gets mad at you for stopping) and get upset when you don't share their same idea, that's their issue and they'll knock it off if they're good at what they do. There have been times that I've p'ssed controllers off for doing something the right way (stopping after exiting a busy runway is an excellent example), but I just shrug it off because I know I did it right and they did it wrong (meaning, they had the wrong mindset or idea of how things should happen). The FARs and AIM always have your back, and the stuff that's in there is in there for a reason.

If you exit the runway and taxi to parking without ever hearing a word from the tower then you've taxied without clearance. It's the exact same [almost] as starting up and taxiing to the runway without ever calling ground, then just calling the tower when ready for takeoff. You need a clearance to move about active taxiways, whether you're on your way to OR from a runway. And don't switch to ground without being instructed by the tower. Would you contact departure before the tower told you to? Even if you know it's coming, you must wait for them to give you the instruction. If it's a busy frequency and you can't get a word in (I've been there many times), sit and wait. It's as simple as that. Switching on your own is simply improper procedure.

Now, if I may throw in some personal opinion here on a NON-regulation-related topic... regarding slamming the brakes to make the first possible exit: Do what suits you best. Just remember you aren't required to! I personally prefer a slower/longer rollout because it saves money (in brake pad wear) and puts less stress on the struts, tires, and my body (and passengers if I have any). When you're cleared for the runway, it's yours and you should use it how you see fit as pilot in command. If there's a Citation crossing the threshold right after you touch down then it's ATC's problem for running their arrivals too tight. Don't be pressured into rushing.

Kilo Alfa... I know the controllers at Downtown (MKC) can be somewhat casual when it comes to taxi-in instructions. However, two wrongs don't make a right. Just because they're not doing a slam-dunk job of being controllers doesn't mean you should stop doing a slam-dunk job of being a pilot. Do the right thing whether controllers are or not.
 

BrewMaster

Well-Known Member
If you exit the runway and taxi to parking without ever hearing a word from the tower then you've taxiied without clearance.
Sometimes I get "N1234 turn right at Kilo, monitor ground .9" Would that be a legal taxi clearance, or should they say "taxi to parking" to make it legit?

No, I didn't feel like looking it up.....:D
 

n9088d

New Member
Sometimes I get "N1234 turn right at Kilo, monitor ground .9" Would that be a legal taxi clearance, or should they say "taxi to parking" to make it legit?

No, I didn't feel like looking it up.....:D
Hey, I don't blame you for not wanting to look it up. ;)

In this case, you (the pilot) are off the hook. By the letter of the law, that is not a taxi clearance. However, the controller's intent was clear even though he/she used improper procedure/phraseology. If for some reason the tapes needed to be pulled (in the event of a runway incursion, etc.), the feds would clear you of any wrong-doing and the controller would certainly be reprimanded. The FAA safety inspectors I've spoken with and flown with would interpret this scenario as a pilot being victimized, in a way, by a controller who said the wrong thing. If you really wanted to be a perfectionist you could ask tower/ground to clarify or use the word "verify" (that's in the pilot/controller glossary) regarding the ambiguous instruction to "turn right and monitor ground." On a checkride I might say something like, "Right on Kilo, monitor ground, verify we're cleared to taxi to parking; N1234."
 
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