Obama administration and user fees

[SpiceWeasel]

But there is more important things to worry about Waco....

Do I wear the ALPA blue lanyard today, or the ALPA white one?

I don't wear my ALPA lanyard that's for sure. I have more important things to promote with my lanyard, like the KC Chiefs.

Something else bothered me recently.... the notion that non-ALPA pilots shouldn't be allowed to use CrewPASS. Talk about not furthering the profession for everyone?!?! What about APA, JBPA, SWPA, etc.? Just because your organization spearheaded something doesn't mean you have to be an immature school kid about your club. And trust me, I heard this from an officer. Pathetic.

 

[meritflyer]

With no GA, he wouldn't have to share his airline cockpit with lowly civilian trained pilots.

LINK

Enough said.

 

[darrenf]

LINK

Enough said.

Crash & burn Velo, crash & burn.

 

[HeyEng]

The best thing I have done in months in regards to JC is this:

This message is hidden because Velocipede is on your ignore list.

Now if I can get you peeps to stop quoting him, that'll be great.

 

[SIUav8er]

OMG! OMG! User fees! THE SKY IS FALLING!

You guys crack me up.

I dont understand why you feel that GA in some way needs to pay more than they already are. I have yet to hear ANY valid argument other than "you use it, you pay for it" which is ALREADY being done in the form of gas taxes and the taxes paid on the aircraft itself. Not to mention the jobs it creates (which increases tax revenues indirectly). I think GA more than pays for itself by that fact alone. It is in no way a drain on the federal, state, or local budget. If you feel it is, please tell me!

Sure maybe the fees may initially be low, but why open the door in the first place? Of course the government will eventually raise the user fees once they are in place.

 

[Toonces]

That's a rather ironic statement given your current avatar.

You're dangerous. Your ego is writing checks your body can't cash. You're dangerous.

 

[JEP]

[modhat]


folks, regardless of whether or not you 'get along' with a certain user really doesn't matter to the other members. Try to stay somewhat close to the topic at hand .vs digging on each other.

[/modhat]

 

[JordanD]

Hey, no one is questioning how you spend your disposable income. Its just time to pay for the services you use. The free ride is over.

I'm 18, still in highschool, and pump gas at the airport to pay for my flight training. I'm not spending disposable income on flying, I'm spending ALL of my income on flying. So is what I'm hearing out of some of you basically "well, tough crap."?

 

[wrxpilot]

I guess its automatically a "lie" when someone suggests you should pay for the services you use. Heck the airlines do, why can't you? Ever heard of landing fees?

This guy's pretty thick, I gotta tell you...

This is something I took from another site (Thanks BoilerUp!):

"Currently, non-airline Jet-A is taxed at $0.218/gal, whereas airline fuel is taxed at $0.043/gal. GA pays FIVE TIMES the fuel tax of airliners. A House FAA Reauthorization bill that was killed earlier this year would have increased GA fuel tax to $0.359/gal, a 65% increase, while airline fuel taxes remained the same at $0.043/gal. In that instance, GA would pay more than 8.3 times higher fuel tax than the airlines."

I've known a couple of guys that just hate civilian pilots. One guy in particular felt that he was being screwed at his airline due to "all of those civilian cessna jockies" that were unfairly in front of him since he was in the military. No respect for civilian pilots at all. He's a bitter ex-Eastern guy that is just pissed at the world, and there's no reasoning with him. I suspect we have a case like that here as well.

 

[Maurus]

He's a bitter ex-Eastern guy that is just pissed at the world, and there's no reasoning with him. I suspect we have a case like that here as well.

Nah, just bitter about anything that might be hurting his view of "the pilot profession". If user fees are created they will most likely include the airline improvements that have already been seen in past bills such as reduced taxes for passengers of which the airline will pocket and maybe give to their employees at the expense of over 1 million GA jobs.

Also come 2012 when the 65 year old pilots are forced into retirement there will be not just a pilot shortage. Instead there will be a large shortage which will allow for a very big bargaining chip at the next contract talk with management. ALPA is all he thinks of and is how he makes his decisions.

When it comes to the user fees, the government will probably be using the current flying statistics to make their money argument. But as the poorer aviation folk drop out they will need to increase the fees which will force more to drop out till the cycle ends with a very limited GA. This cycle had been seen in many countries and Velo tries to make it seem like it isn't a big deal. Then again he would never have to pay a fee in his life. Funny how that works.

Oh, and sure the airlines will have to pay the fee, but with the more than likely tax cuts the airlines will receive the airline will most likely be making more money than they normally would.

 

[Barty]

Pay double if you wish, I simply don't wish to. I'll pay for using something I'm not already paying for, no problem there; but I'm not going to throw my money to the govt for no reason..

...that'd be as smart as investing with Madoff.

I agree. Anyone who thinks this is a great idea is welcome to open up their checkbook and stroke a check to the imperial federal goverment for however much additional tax they feel they need to be paying.

As for me, I hold to my original premise. The Gov't needs to get its financial house in order before asking me for another dime of my money. In my eyes, we are already paying for these services, but our politicians just fall over each other to find ways that they can give away money in exchange for the loyalty of a voting bloc.

 

[surreal1221]

As for me, I hold to my original premise. The Gov't needs to get its financial house in order before asking me for another dime of my money. In my eyes, we are already paying for these services, but our politicians just fall over each other to find ways that they can give away money in exchange for the loyalty of a voting bloc.

So then I take it you're going to stop having any federal or state withholding this year then right? Already change that W4? Right?

Just sayin'

 

[MikeD]

So then I take it you're going to stop having any federal or state withholding this year then right? Already change that W4? Right?

Just sayin'

I think he means "....beyond what's already normally taken from my income....."

 

[granlistillo]

So then I take it you're going to stop having any federal or state withholding this year then right? Already change that W4? Right?

Just sayin'

The word "needs" is key here. He is making a prescriptive statement of what ought to be. Don't see it as advocacy of tax evasion.

Again, GA taxes are collected everyday and then disappear like a fart in a hurricane in the US treasury.

This argument that GA needs pay for its share of maintaining the NAS is a bogus one. Basically it is a political game where the FAA is trying to get the budget to pay for upgrades. They are not successful. So, lets sell congress that we will start charging user fees to "pay for it", so they will have political cover and get their appropriations bill.

This is a direct attack on the freedom of pilots everywhere except for perhaps maybe the odd curdmugeon airline pilot here and there. I don't get an opportunity to fly GA much anymore, but I can not accept such a cynical political game to destroy peoples livelihood, without a complaint.
Besides, who thinks double charging people is fair??

There is an old adage, you want to decrease an activity, tax it. You know like cigarettes..

 

[juan valdez]

Thats what he is looking for! He wants to play big bad airline pilot over the internet.

He is out of his league on this one though...

Velo,

Do you realize how many foreign students there are training in the states right now?

At my school alone there were at one time 200 students pumping 50K a piece in the US economy. Thats $10,000,000 from one school, in one year.

Everyone in the world wants to come train in the US because we have the finest, cheapest GA system in the world. You want to put a stop to that?

We are not getting a free ride, in fact we are probably saving the airlines millions. How much do you think the price of Jet A would go up if there were not 10s of millions of gallons of avgas being sold each year?

Are you going to answer my questions or are you going to copy and paste, and take everything out of context? You could twist my words up soo much that you could eventually call me a scab. That's your specialty isnt it?

Go back to your silly little jumpseat wars.

I went to a flight school in Daytona for some refresher training and a BFR. The school is pretty much geared for foreigners and my instructor was from Norway. I asked him why he trained here and stays here, his answer is pretty much money. It costs way too much over there to train so a lot of europeans come over here. For everyone here that rags on teh cost of "academy" training and how its way too much, it's a bargain for those guys. I don't want our system to end up the same way eventually.

 

[juan valdez]

So then I take it you're going to stop having any federal or state withholding this year then right? Already change that W4? Right?

Just sayin'

:banghead:

 

[Roger, Roger]

See, here's the thing. The current ATC system works juuuust fine for the vast, overwhelming majority of GA pilots. How many other drivers of little planes have had no trouble with congestion and delays and all the other stuff that the airlines and FAA complain about, during your recent use of ATC?

 

[SpiraMirabilis]

Flying into Vail, CO almost everyday during ski season makes me wish I could shoot down some of those "GA" business jets. Especially the day after the airport got closed due to weather.

"Eagle Clearance, Airshuttle 7091 for denver."
"Air Shuttle 7091, Eagle Clearance <clearance> ... you are number 11 to start engines."

 

[Barty]

I think he means "....beyond what's already normally taken from my income....."

Yes, that is what I meant. I'm sure he knew what I meant too, but it is so much better to try to spin a statement than to critique the underlying message.

 

[WacoFan]

What is wrog it limiting the slots in the busiest airspace, selling those slots to the highest bidders, and then the people wanting seats on those flights the airlines have paid for can pay higher ticket prices for those times? Why wouldn't that work? (other than the fact that Velo would be denied his wish of having the sky's cleared of everything but airline or military flights)