Norwegian Deny NAI / now DOT-approved

Our union formed up something similar. I was gonna post it on here but I figured it would be met with the same bafoonery that the 135 duty and rest rules post was...
 
Done, however I cannot help but notice that ALPA and its' Delta Leadership call out the big guns in support of protecting their mainline Widebody networks. Those at the top of the food chain, must be protected. However they are also the first to throw the bottom of the list / industry under the bus when it suits them. The very first RJ that flew in the US had Delta Express written on the side. This forced the entire industry to follow.

I am not a huge fan of APA but they held the scope line for the longest time. The marines have a saying, it's something like "loyalty down the chain of command, leads to loyalty up the chain of command." ALPA needs to keep this in mind, instead of constantly referring to the problems of the "fee for departure" segment of the industry. It really is time for ALPA to stand up for the regional section of the industry and point out that the public mainline carriers are aiding and abetting wage wars at the regional level. Mainline carriers need to be paying more for feed so that regionals can pay more for pilots. The industry has changed enough so that it could happen. If you pay them they will come.

If ALPA went on the offensive to urge the major's to pay more to the regionals, so that low paid new hires could make at least a living wage, you would get a lot of public support. It can be made to be a safety issue and one of basic fairness. Instead ALPA is concentrating on protecting their international flying. NAI is quite content to put an former RJ captain in a 787 for about $80K a year. ALPA, it's the monster you helped create.
 
pilotmg1501 said:
Anybody have a form letter to copy? I suck at coming up with coherent thoughts when writing my reps.
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You can copypasta mine from the other thread, if you think it's suitable


bimmerphile said:
Thanks for posting, took a few tidbits for the letter to my congressman

Dear Congressman _______-
The Department of Transportation recently approved Norwegian Air International to fly trans-atlantic routes from the EU to the United States. NAI is a Norwegian owned airline flying under an Irish flag of convenience to undermine their home state's strict labor laws, allowing them to employ the operation with lower cost labor sourced from an Asian staffing agency. This directly undermines the tone of the US-EU-Norway-Iceland Open Skies agreement, which states in Article 17 of that Air Transport Agreement "...the opportunities created by the Agreement are not intended to undermine labour standards or labour-related rights and principles." The Department of Transportation is charged by Congress to "consider fair wages and working conditions; prevent unfair, deceptive, predatory, or anticompetitive practices in air transportation; and to strengthen the competitive position of (American) air carriers to at least ensure equality with foreign air carriers."
In the interest of American jobs, and to protect the US airline industry, I would ask you to investigate this matter and recognize the precedent this may set for the global air transportation industry.
Sincerely,
_______
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Just got an ALPA email regarding this, thanks @Seggy for your volunteer efforts on this. I hope people realize how critical this really is.
 
For those here represented by APA, check the last two Information Hotline emails. There is a link to a Take Action message sender buried close to the end of the Legislative Alert portion of the hotline.
 
I'm going to offer a counter-opinion:

Both the Obama administration and the Bush administration worked to get an Open Skies agreement between the US and the EU. NAI is flagged in an EU-member nation and the DOT has virtually no reason to doubt the efficacy of the oversight of Irish transportation regulators. The State Department is all for this agreement, as they continue to work on US-EU transportation issues. It's my belief that US carriers, people, and businesses have benefited greatly from the US influence on EU transportation authorities and our open skies agreement with the EU.

ALPA should attempt to work with European labor groups to establish standardized labor laws for EU airlines as labor politics is typically better received in Europe.
 
hook_dupin said:
I'm going to offer a counter-opinion:
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You need to look at the facts.

Both the Obama administration and the Bush administration worked to get an Open Skies agreement between the US and the EU. NAI is flagged in an EU-member nation and the DOT has virtually no reason to doubt the efficacy of the oversight of Irish transportation regulators.
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How can the Irish provide oversight when the airplanes are going to be traveling from LGW primarily and not even touch Ireland?

The State Department is all for this agreement, as they continue to work on US-EU transportation issues. It's my belief that US carriers, people, and businesses have benefited greatly from the US influence on EU transportation authorities and our open skies agreement with the EU.
Click to expand...

The DOT has failed to acknowledge the importance of Article 17 bis of the U.S.-EU/Norway/Iceland Open Skies Agreement in their decision.

ALPA should attempt to work with European labor groups to establish standardized labor laws for EU airlines as labor politics is typically better received in Europe.
Click to expand...

By posting this it shows you aren't that well versed on the subject. You see ALPA is working with European labor groups. The European labor groups are against this as much as ALPA is. The European Cockpit Association, European Transport Workers' Federation, and the Norwegian trade union Parat have been objecting to this application and are noted in the DOT's document temporarily granting the permit as objectors.

The issue with the labor is they will be contractors based in Thailand from a Singapore contracting agency, flying out of LGW with an airline based in Ireland. How does that work?
 
Zapphod Beblebrox said:
If ALPA went on the offensive to urge the major's to pay more to the regionals, so that low paid new hires could make at least a living wage, you would get a lot of public support. It can be made to be a safety issue and one of basic fairness. Instead ALPA is concentrating on protecting their international flying. NAI is quite content to put an former RJ captain in a 787 for about $80K a year. ALPA, it's the monster you helped create.
Click to expand...

NAI has no intention of putting an RJ captain in a 787. Thats the entire point.
 
Zapphod Beblebrox said:
Done, however I cannot help but notice that ALPA and its' Delta Leadership call out the big guns in support of protecting their mainline Widebody networks. Those at the top of the food chain, must be protected. However they are also the first to throw the bottom of the list / industry under the bus when it suits them. The very first RJ that flew in the US had Delta Express written on the side. This forced the entire industry to follow.

I am not a huge fan of APA but they held the scope line for the longest time. The marines have a saying, it's something like "loyalty down the chain of command, leads to loyalty up the chain of command." ALPA needs to keep this in mind, instead of constantly referring to the problems of the "fee for departure" segment of the industry. It really is time for ALPA to stand up for the regional section of the industry and point out that the public mainline carriers are aiding and abetting wage wars at the regional level. Mainline carriers need to be paying more for feed so that regionals can pay more for pilots. The industry has changed enough so that it could happen. If you pay them they will come.

If ALPA went on the offensive to urge the major's to pay more to the regionals, so that low paid new hires could make at least a living wage, you would get a lot of public support. It can be made to be a safety issue and one of basic fairness. Instead ALPA is concentrating on protecting their international flying. NAI is quite content to put an former RJ captain in a 787 for about $80K a year. ALPA, it's the monster you helped create.
Click to expand...
9266189.jpg
 
Seggy said:
The DOT has failed to acknowledge the importance of Article 17 bis of the U.S.-EU/Norway/Iceland Open Skies Agreement in their decision.
Click to expand...

DOT thinks they took all aspects of the agreement into account, and even took an extraordinary step of consulting with both Justice and State on the matter.

The whole rub is that 17 bis is rather vague and arbitrary.

EU-US Open Skies Agreement said:
The opportunities created by the Agreement are not intended to undermine labour standards or the labour-related rights and principles contained in the Parties' respective laws.
Click to expand...

It's not clear exactly clear what our labor standards or how NAI would undermine them. As the NAI application sits, they plan on hiring European contractors vice employees. Is that difference enough to stop the execution of a major international agreement? A trifecta of executive departments think not.
 
For the non-ALPA folks that would like to participate in the call to action:

Fellow ALPA member,

You are one of more than 11,800 pilots who have participated in our call-to-action this week urging the DOT to #DenyNAI. I want to personally thank you for making this our best call-to-action ever.

Less than a week ago, the DOT announced a bad decision. Ignoring your union, U.S. and European airlines, our fellow pilots from around the world, the text and intent of the U.S.-EU Open Skies Agreement and the will of Congress, DOT signaled that it is prepared to grant NAI’s flag-of-convenience operation that will send our jobs overseas. Our opponents were hoping that after two years, we would be wearied and forgetful, that we wouldn’t respond in force. You have proved them wrong!

This fight is not over. We need to continue to build on the momentum generated by our collective action. Today, we are opening a call-to-action managed by POPVOX at www.alpa.org/denynai for the general public. I hope you’ll encourage all of your family and friends to join our fight by participating through that platform. Our call-to-action for ALPA members will remain open as well, as we continue to weigh in with the Congress, the DOT, and the White House demanding they #DenyNAI.

More engagement will be required going forward. Every letter, every email, every call intensifies the pressure on President Obama and Secretary Foxx to do the right thing. Your participation is what is keeping us in this game and what will propel us forward.

Thank you again.

Sincerely,



Tim Canoll, President
Air Line Pilots Association, International
 
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