No More Lears

SrFnFly227 said:
75 is just an updated 45, which has been around since the 90s. Same type rating for the pilot, but requires differences training. The winglets got slanted out and it got Garmin avionics. I think I've read in the discussions today that it has ore thrust, but I'm too lazy to google that.



^^^This. The 350 is a good airplane, but it really only sells in the numbers it does because of the ramp presence and price.


I feel like the next big news from Bombardier will have to do with the 600 series Challenger. If they kill it, it may signal the end of Bombardier. If they bring a new product to market as a replacement, they may have some life left.
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They're losing unless they make the 600 series perform like a 350. It's a small gap to fill between the 350 and the Global 5000/5500. And the 600 series doesn't really even have the girth. Their best bet is to make a larger 350...and give it autothrottless this time.
 
KLB said:
They're losing unless they make the 600 series perform like a 350. It's a small gap to fill between the 350 and the Global 5000/5500. And the 600 series doesn't really even have the girth. Their best bet is to make a larger 350...and give it autothrottless this time.
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Wait the 350 doesn't have auto throttles? Even the 604 had those.

I think they've left the 600 series alone because it would take more customers away from the 350/Global than it would gain customers from other manufacturers. Eventually though, a new design is coming. You could be on to something with the 350/600 series merging in to one new product that has the performance of the 350 with the cabin of the 600s. It would probably be a really good plane. The question would be whether people currently shopping for the 350 would jump up in size? Or would they stay in the mid/super mid category and go over to the G280 or the Praetor 500/600?
 
SrFnFly227 said:
Wait the 350 doesn't have auto throttles? Even the 604 had those.

I think they've left the 600 series alone because it would take more customers away from the 350/Global than it would gain customers from other manufacturers. Eventually though, a new design is coming. You could be on to something with the 350/600 series merging in to one new product that has the performance of the 350 with the cabin of the 600s. It would probably be a really good plane. The question would be whether people currently shopping for the 350 would jump up in size? Or would they stay in the mid/super mid category and go over to the G280 or the Praetor 500/600?
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Yup. No auto throttles on the 350 and it has just recently gotten a HUD option.

The numbers that I've see show that the 350 outsells the Praetor 600 5 to 2.
 
SrFnFly227 said:
75 is just an updated 45, which has been around since the 90s. Same type rating for the pilot, but requires differences training. The winglets got slanted out and it got Garmin avionics. I think I've read in the discussions today that it has a bit more thrust, but I'm too lazy to google that.
...
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Thrust went from 3500# per, to 3850 on the 70/75.

Sad to see them go. I’ve been on the 45 family for over 13 years, and overall really like the airframe, and the trip profile that goes with it. We currently operate a fleet of a dozen of the type - a combination of 40/45/70/75. They have some quirks and shortcomings, but overall they are good, solid airplanes, with very nice performance to boot.
 
SteveC said:
Thrust went from 3500# per, to 3850 on the 70/75.

Sad to see them go. I’ve been on the 45 family for over 13 years, and overall really like the airframe, and the trip profile that goes with it. We currently operate a fleet of a dozen of the type - a combination of 40/45/70/75. They have some quirks and shortcomings, but overall they are good, solid airplanes, with very nice performance to boot.
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How long is Bombardier obligated to support the airframe after they announce the end of production?
 
SrFnFly227 said:
Wait the 350 doesn't have auto throttles? Even the 604 had those.
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The 300/350 does not have auto-throttles and it also only has one pack. There are numerous rumors are the early design intentions and equipment to be the LearJet Continental - but much of those ideas were cut back during design as it was deemed to be too large to be part of the LearJet family, which is how it became the small Challenger.
 
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The LR-JET was my first type rating. It taught me a ton, and it was a springboard for the rest of my career. Up until just recently I had more time in 35s than any other airplane. Now the MD11 has surpassed that.
Bombardier has slowly been killing the learjet for over a decade. This wasn't a surprise to anyone.
 
killbilly said:
How long is Bombardier obligated to support the airframe after they announce the end of production?
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Not sure that there is any obligation, legal anyways. Received this email

open.aspx
Dear Mr. C.,

Bombardier has announced the decision to ramp down and progressively phase out production of Learjet aircraft. Learjet was the original business jet, and its impact on private travel has been felt by millions since the first Learjet took flight in 1963.

Although we will wind down production of new aircraft, we want to assure you of our enduring commitment to supporting you and your Learjet well into the future. There are over 2,000 Learjet aircraft in operation today, and each one represents a valued member of the Bombardier family.

Going forward, Bombardier will place an even greater focus on growing customer service offerings. We will continue to supply the parts you need and deliver the exceptional service you’ve come to expect, and we are working to offer you a suite of cost-effective servicing options to help you extend the life of your business jet. Our unparalleled expertise will help you get the most out of your aircraft for years to come.

Learjet aircraft have made a lasting mark on the history of business aviation, and the Learjet brand continues to represent the gold standard for light jets with unmatched performance, cabin experience and smooth ride.

Thank you for continuing to be part of the Bombardier family. We hope that you stay safe and healthy, and we look forward to continuing our relationship as Bombardier enters this new chapter.

Sincerely,

Éric Martel
President and Chief Executive Officer
Bombardier Inc.
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Like others here my first type rating was the LR-JET and until recently was the airplane I had the most time in until the 737 passed it, yeah for not so comfy cockpits! Also the Lear 45 was my first advanced airplane and I really liked it, being dual qualified in it and the 35 while flying charter you really got to see how Bombardier made a great replacement for the 35.

As for them supporting the airframe in the future AIN reported that as of now they will. I know Honeywell has an update for the 45 cockpit to replace the CRT DUs with LCDs that have additional features such as charts and XM weather.

I feel really bad for all of those that are going to get laid off because of this but at least it sounds like the Learjet factory and completion center in ICT will survive.
 
CFI A&P said:
Chiropractors everywhere sigh.

Pilots everywhere rejoice.

If you don't know the joke - it is easy to tell who is a Lear captain and FO, based on the permanent curvature of their back, neck & head.
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I don’t know what you’re talking about, I don’t even notice how uncomfortable it is after 2.4 or so. Of course, I don’t notice because I’m so worried about running out of gas at that point.....
 
My biggest gripe after the seats (at 6‘3 I was full down full back and still got Learjet thigh) is the 45’s daft NWS by wire. Okish in the jet but max braking and steering on a short runway was exciting. In the sim it was a recipe for PIO.
 
fholbert said:
Assume as long as it’s profitable.
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Makes sense. I know there are laws on certain goods that say a manufacturer has to support the product for 10 years after discontinuing - that's what I was wondering - what was the guaranteed (if any) time frame on parts support.
 
knot4u said:
The Lear 28 with CJ610-8s is, and will always be the ultimate Lear hot rod. Understand that I hate these contraptions with a heart blackened by trying to keep them airworthy, but I still respect them. I'd love to know what happened to all of the 29s.
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Yep back in my Chicago Center days in the 80s there was a LR28 going to KMKE from the east coast at FL510
 
killbilly said:
Makes sense. I know there are laws on certain goods that say a manufacturer has to support the product for 10 years after discontinuing - that's what I was wondering - what was the guaranteed (if any) time frame on parts support.
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I don’t know a legal responsibility, but they had better guarantee at least as long as the warranty period on the last production airplane. My guess would be 5-10 years beyond that? Could be less and they just tell people that they will buying reman parts.

I think the comment above about profitability is probably most accurate though.
 
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