New dude here

[jynxyjoe]

Toby is likeable, too. He really is a mumbling Jew but he's likable. His sense of moral indignation is a fault and a virtue. I love when he goes off on the president for his disease and the president tells him to shut up because he is not the one with the disease. To me the characters are so real.

Well something else you have to remember is Toby is Sorkin. Leo has Sorkin's drug problem but Toby IS Sorkin. Now Sorkin understand he couldn't be president, and he's too liberal to be elected, and any president (even a liberal democrat) would have problems relating to Sorkin. So that's in there, he can imagine it so well. But writing inspiring- nay, aspiring speeches and changing minds under a demanding timeline? Check. He could write policy speeches, and kinda does.

The only strange thing about Toby is his cadence vs everyone else on the show. Hard, curt, whitty, smug, inventive and speedy delivery from the entire WH staff, to the President and his advisers. Nancy McNally and Fitzwallis (not to be confused with @SmoothLanderJ) are astoundingly keen and forcefully delivering their lines. Toby enters the scene? *Beat* *shift* *mouth moving slowly to himself then speaking* The only time you really get him on fire is:

"Well... How about when we, instead of blowing Iraq back to the seventh century for harbouring terrorists and trying to develop nuclear weapons, we just imposed economic sanctions and were reviled by the Arab world for not giving them a global charge card and a free trade treaty? How about when we pushed Israel to give up land for peace? How about when we sent American soldiers to protect Saudi Arabia, and the Arab world told us we were desecrating their holy land? We'll ignore the fact that we were invited. How about two weeks ago, in the State of the Union when the President praised the Islamic people as faithful and hardworking only to be denounced in the Arab press as knowing nothing about Islam? But none of that is the point."
"What is the point?"
"I don't remember having to explain to Italians that our problem wasn't with them, but with Mussolini! Why does the U.S. have to take every Arab country out for an ice cream cone? They'll like us when we win!"

Funny story, the only other guy I can think of that didn't deliever his lines like a coke fueled rage was Roberto Mendoza, the supreme court judge. But he, later on, went to captain the Battle Star Gallactica so we'll give him a pass.

 

[ozziecat35]

Toby is likeable, too. He really is a mumbling Jew but he's likable. His sense of moral indignation is a fault and a virtue. I love when he goes off on the president for his disease and the president tells him to shut up because he is not the one with the disease. To me the characters are so real.

Toby tends to piss me off because of his moral righteousness. I really missed Sam. Will Bailey was never a good replacement for Sam...good character, just not Sam.

I also liked Adm. Fitzwallace.

 

[wainscottbl]

Yeah, Toby is likeable and hated at the same time. He is a bit self-righteous but I think he is sincere, not a hypocrite. And I like Sam better, yes. Josh is too smug and only graced by Donna, who is like his guardian angel giving him graces to help diminish his pride. Actually I like Josh, but he reminds me of Bill Murray in Groundhog Day. He has to learn decency from a good woman. Leo is likable and ICJ is too old for me to be attracted to her, but is fun and charming. If I were older I would likely be attracted to her. The president to me is what I wish we could have for a Democrat president--what I would vote for. There is a reason I am Independent but a Democrat leaning conservative. If there were a Democrat like Bartlet running, I'd vote for him. Most of all because he's not a bureaucrat but says whatever in the hell he wants. To me he is what a Democrat should be. As a Catholic there is something about him that I like. The death penalty episode was moving. I am generally for the death penalty but I can sympathize with the other side. I could imagine having to let something like that happen and feeling so bad I would call a priest in. Also he did very well on the scene yelling at God in the National Cathedral when Mrs. Laningham died. I cried. His calling out God was amazingly acted. I told my mother it was not blasphemy but brilliance as it shows how people feel towards God. Mrs. Laningham, like a mother put it well, "Come on, you know God doesn't cause car crashes."

 

[jynxyjoe]

His calling out God was amazingly acted. I told my mother it was not blasphemy but brilliance as it shows how people feel towards God. Mrs. Laningham, like a mother put it well, "Come on, you know God doesn't cause car crashes."

There are a few latin translations of what he says (Sorkin writes) and it's compelling stuff

"You get Hoinz!"

 

[wainscottbl]

There are a few latin translations of what he says (Sorkin writes) and it's compelling stuff

"You get Hoinz!"

I don't need no Latin translations. More or less I understand them. I went to mass in all Latin for years (Tridentine Mass or Extraordinary Form) so I understood what he was saying. Only Protestants need translations of that stuff.

 

[wainscottbl]

It can be summed up thus: Screw off God. Sic semper tyrannis!

 

[jynxyjoe]

I don't need no Latin translations. More or less I understand them. I went to mass in all Latin for years (Tridentine Mass or Extraordinary Form) so I understood what he was saying. Only Protestants need translations of that stuff.

If you say so. I'm Catholic, born and raise, and we didn't have any Latin through 8 years of Catholic school plus alter boying and volunteering and all that other stuff. Once in a while I'll goto a shrine or something and there's 3 or 4 languages including some latin. New age Catholic here. I barely even have a guilt complex.

 

[wainscottbl]

If you say so. I'm Catholic, born and raise, and we didn't have any Latin through 8 years of Catholic school plus alter boying and volunteering and all that other stuff. Once in a while I'll goto a shrine or something and there's 3 or 4 languages including some latin. New age Catholic here. I barely even have a guilt complex.

Well I am thinking about Eastern Orthodoxy which does not have the same guilt mindset as Western Christianity. The Russians as I heard one Dane say do not even have a conscience. I suppose that explains the evul Putin.

 

[jynxyjoe]

This thread should be revived. Who is watching west wing now and what are you wearing.

 

[jynxyjoe]

There's a west wing rewatch podcast. Josh Melina (the worthless Sam replacement) and some other guy do it. With that said, it's great work and the best thing Josh has done connected with West Wing.

If not clear this thread has been replaced as a west wing thread.

 

[Screaming_Emu]

...and what are you wearing.

A/S/L?

 

[Oxman]

I just got awarded a trophy for my first post. Does that now make me an honorary Millennial?