New "controller" at KJFK Tower...

[Duck_Twacy]

You don't just "bring your kid into the tower and let him talk" without your boss knowing whats going on before hand.

I agree, there is just way too much liability involved for him to sneak his son into the tower cab and start slinging out clearances.


I thought it was great, sounds like all the pilots involved did too. My wife was appalled. I guess we're not supposed to do anything that comes close to having fun at work. That's not allowed.

 

[JeepPilot88]

I think the kid working traffic is a riot.
However the way things are these days... it was INCREDIBLY stupid of the father. Not because it was unsafe, or "unprofessional"... but because of the inevitable over-reaction of the media and general public.

It's a shame but this guy will lose his job over this... It is not just going to disappear. the kid will more than likely be on the today show in the next week...

America... RELAX. :chair::chair:

 

[Bernoulli Fan]

While there may not be any "harm" in a couple of radio calls....how long was the kid in the tower? Would you not be distracted by your child running around your office. Would the other controllers not be.

Even if not sitting on your lap making radio calls, just him being in the tower is a distraction. Your attention would always be somewhat diverted.

Is this being blown out of proportion? Yes.....but it was still pretty damn stupid.

Have you ever been in a tower? There are plenty of distractions; controllers still seem to find a way to get it done. I frequently take students on tours, and -- can you believe it? -- the local controller answers the student's questions between issuing takeoff and landing clearances!

 

[ralphbrynard]

I thought that the whole thing was cute. With that said, are you guys really that out of touch? Everything in this society is based on the appearance of professionalism and the assumption of control. Everyone in the aviation industry may think nothing of this sort of thing because we know things that people outside the industry don't. We know how the system works, and we all have confidence in that system. People outside the aviation industry know nothing about aviation, or how anything works within the system. So, in order to make the flying public feel comfortable we put up a front of professionalism. We have to wear ties to work, speak proper english(some of us:insane. It is not a matter of how we feel, but how the public feel. As harmless as this may have been, it has decreased the confidence of the flying public. They rely on us to be professional at all times. You may get upset by my post, but this industry is about more than you or I. We demand that they treat us like professionals, lets be professional. Just my .02.

I agree with the need to be professional. However, the public is enraged by a tower controller supervising his child making basic radio calls (ie. contact departure...)

However, the public needs to decide what it is they want. They want safe, curteous, friendly airline service, then they need to pony up the dough and pay fair prices for tickets.

 

[staledog]

I thought that the whole thing was cute. With that said, are you guys really that out of touch? Everything in this society is based on the appearance of professionalism and the assumption of control. Everyone in the aviation industry may think nothing of this sort of thing because we know things that people outside the industry don't. We know how the system works, and we all have confidence in that system. People outside the aviation industry know nothing about aviation, or how anything works within the system. So, in order to make the flying public feel comfortable we put up a front of professionalism. We have to wear ties to work, speak proper english(some of us:insane. It is not a matter of how we feel, but how the public feel. As harmless as this may have been, it has decreased the confidence of the flying public. They rely on us to be professional at all times. You may get upset by my post, but this industry is about more than you or I. We demand that they treat us like professionals, lets be professional. Just my .02.

I'm not that out of touch, I'm not surpised at all that "they" are blowing this out of proportion. But it sucks. And I agree with the other 95% of the posters in this thread that is was totally harmless. I mean, really, with all the other more important things to worry about in this jacked up world we live in today, this is what the news and the FAA should be worried about? I remember when I was about 5 years old my dad taking me to the coal mine where he worked and letting me ride with him in one of those moster dumptrucks that are bigger than a house. And he let me pull the chain that made the hopper dump about 20 tons of coal into the back of it. One of the best/first memories of my childhood. I can just imagine what the media would do with that these days if they found out. And society wants kids to grow up so fast now, they even have preschools that advertise that they prep for college! But God forbid if you let a child actually DO SOMETHING!!

I really hope that

-A: someone from the FAA is following this thread, and does something to "enlighten" the other feds that want to pursue this, or

-B: someone from this forum just prints this whole thread out and sends it to the feds in charge of this investigation, or

-C: someone actually starts a petition that could possibly make a difference to possibly save the jobs of these controllers.

 

[twotwowoo]

I'm one of the most vehemently childfree people you'll ever meet, but even I don't have a problem with that kid in the tower. He was being supervised by several certified controllers, not to mention that there were some very experienced pilots at the controls of the aircraft. It was no different than a trainee giving a clearance. The public needs to stop freaking out over stuff like this!

 

[AndrewT]

Another said, I think its a security breach i mean i would not let my kid up there.

Oh come on give them a break, no harm no foul as they say

The kid could be part of a terrorist network trying to infiltrate our control towers. I'm pretty sure I also heard the kid speak some spanish or something in there, so he's probably an illegal immigrant taking away jobs from hard working Americans. This is what happens when you leave Democrats in charge of our security! Komrad OBAMA!

Anyway, I think the whole thing displayed a lack of judgment on the controllers part. Letting the kid watch is fine, but jumping on the comms....sure its cute, but like was pointed out before, if ANYTHING happened, there would be hell to pay. Also, you could see the news firestorm coming from miles away over this.....

 

[Kestrel452]

I consider bringing children into a tower to be an innately poor decision at best. Dangerous and lacking in common sense. What does he know about directing traffic? One false move and hundreds of people are toast, we all know this. This is not the FAA being the "big meanie", disciplinary action IMO is very well deserved in this matter. Keeping properly certificated people at the helm and radar screen while reducing distractions as much as possible is the least we can do to keep aviation safe.

This is not "cute", it's just dumb.

 

[AirmetTango]

I remember when I was about 5 years old my dad taking me to the coal mine where he worked and letting me ride with him in one of those moster dumptrucks that are bigger than a house. And he let me pull the chain that made the hopper dump about 20 tons of coal into the back of it. One of the best/first memories of my childhood.

In this case, instead of a fantastic memory and positive experience that could lead to a career in aviation ("Wow, the Jet Blue pilot thought I did awesome!"), the kid will likely end up somewhat traumatized ("OMG, I got Daddy fired, and the world thinks he's the worst controller ever"). He certainly won't think about aviation or ATC very positively anymore. I wonder who will work the kid over first, the FAA or Homeland Security? Then the media circus....

 

[Malko]

I consider bringing children into a tower to be an innately poor decision at best. Dangerous and lacking in common sense. What does he know about directing traffic? One false move and hundreds of people are toast, we all know this. This is not the FAA being the "big meanie", disciplinary action IMO is very well deserved in this matter. Keeping properly certificated people at the helm and radar screen while reducing distractions as much as possible is the least we can do to keep aviation safe.

This is not "cute", it's just dumb.

And you base that statement on what.....You experience as a Controller...Oops. A certificated pilot.....Ooops.

Have you been in a tower? Seriously.

I have with many other individuals here at JC. We were in the tower at LAS and OMGz, we were talking to the controller while they were directing traffic. Call the papers right now.......

This kid was not directing traffic. He was repeating the exact words his father told him too.

 

[darrenf]

I consider bringing children into a tower to be an innately poor decision at best. Dangerous and lacking in common sense. What does he know about directing traffic? One false move and hundreds of people are toast, we all know this. This is not the FAA being the "big meanie", disciplinary action IMO is very well deserved in this matter. Keeping properly certificated people at the helm and radar screen while reducing distractions as much as possible is the least we can do to keep aviation safe.

This is not "cute", it's just dumb.

wow. :drool:

 

[bLizZuE]

I consider bringing children into a tower to be an innately poor decision at best. Dangerous and lacking in common sense. What does he know about directing traffic? One false move and hundreds of people are toast, we all know this. This is not the FAA being the "big meanie", disciplinary action IMO is very well deserved in this matter. Keeping properly certificated people at the helm and radar screen while reducing distractions as much as possible is the least we can do to keep aviation safe.

This is not "cute", it's just dumb.

The amount of ignorance in this statement is astounding.

 

[TallFlyer]

One false move and hundreds of people are toast, we all know this.

Yeah, because man, can't trust those pilots; they don't do anything right!

Are you for real?

The thought came to me today that the media is going absolutely nuts about a kid repeating a clearance in the tower but put a 7 year old (Jessica Dubroff) in an airplane with the intent to fly across the country and they're all cool with that.

In any event, I have the ultimate solution: Will all the whiners in this country with your panties permanently in a wad just leave?

 

[MarkE]

I consider bringing children into a tower to be an innately poor decision at best. Dangerous and lacking in common sense. What does he know about directing traffic? One false move and hundreds of people are toast, we all know this. This is not the FAA being the "big meanie", disciplinary action IMO is very well deserved in this matter. Keeping properly certificated people at the helm and radar screen while reducing distractions as much as possible is the least we can do to keep aviation safe.

This is not "cute", it's just dumb.

you must have forgotten the sarcasm tag. Here, lemme add it for ya.

 

[AirmetTango]

What does he know about directing traffic? One false move and hundreds of people are toast, we all know this.

Again, the kid wasn't giving out vectors or altitudes. Routine, expected clearances only. If I'm in position and holding, I'm expecting my takeoff clearance. If I'm climbing out, I'm expecting to get handed to departure. I question the common sense of anyone who has knowledge of aviation communications going off the deep end about a breach of safety in this situation. Breach of ethics...can't argue with that. Breach of safety, no.

 

[MFT1Air]

While there may not be any "harm" in a couple of radio calls....how long was the kid in the tower? Would you not be distracted by your child running around your office. Would the other controllers not be.

Even if not sitting on your lap making radio calls, just him being in the tower is a distraction. Your attention would always be somewhat diverted.

Is this being blown out of proportion? Yes.....but it was still pretty damn stupid.

The word "distraction" is subjective. I can drive 75 MPH down a freeway with crying babies in the back, and it's a distraction, but I'm still safe. School bus drivers can drive down the streets with 50 screaming kids in the back; again, it's a distraction, but it still should be considered "safe."

In this situation, stupid is what people perceive. With the kid in the tower, he was probably at his most professional, "attentive" moment.

So sad, the paranoids among us don't see it that way. . .

 

[Matt13C]

While there may not be any "harm" in a couple of radio calls....how long was the kid in the tower? Would you not be distracted by your child running around your office. Would the other controllers not be.

Even if not sitting on your lap making radio calls, just him being in the tower is a distraction. Your attention would always be somewhat diverted.

Is this being blown out of proportion? Yes.....but it was still pretty damn stupid.

"Next on news at 5. Is your ATC distracted by home life? Should they be allowed to marry and have children? Would you feel safer in the sky knowing the ATC giving directions to your pilot was a mindless lemming?"

I consider bringing children into a tower to be an innately poor decision at best. Dangerous and lacking in common sense. What does he know about directing traffic? One false move and hundreds of people are toast, we all know this. This is not the FAA being the "big meanie", disciplinary action IMO is very well deserved in this matter. Keeping properly certificated people at the helm and radar screen while reducing distractions as much as possible is the least we can do to keep aviation safe.

This is not "cute", it's just dumb.

You assume that the pilots are incapable of logical thought. Dont you think a pilot would question ATC if what they heard sounded wrong or would put them into a dangerous situation, especially if the direction was given by the voice of a five year old?

 

[MFT1Air]

Originally Posted by Kestrel452
I consider bringing children into a tower to be an innately poor decision at best. Dangerous and lacking in common sense. What does he know about directing traffic? One false move and hundreds of people are toast, we all know this. This is not the FAA being the "big meanie", disciplinary action IMO is very well deserved in this matter. Keeping properly certificated people at the helm and radar screen while reducing distractions as much as possible is the least we can do to keep aviation safe.

This is not "cute", it's just dumb.

wow. :drool:

Indeed. Scary even. . .watch out for comet trails too! The world's coming to an end. . .soon!

. . .or is it meteors first or 2012?!

 

[Nigel Croker]

I consider bringing children into a tower to be an innately poor decision at best. Dangerous and lacking in common sense. What does he know about directing traffic? One false move and hundreds of people are toast

I'm questioning your "innately poor decision" to comment on this subject.....are you for real with that statement. You revealed that your lack of knowledge is huge....

 

[adreamer]

Archie League

ATC_RET, was he the one who sat by the runway use red or checker flags directing traffic? somewhere in St. Louis?