New "controller" at KJFK Tower...

queeno said:
if only FFA licensed controllers are suppose to talk to aircraft how in the hell are we allowing trainies to talk to them, they are not licensed yet? dont answer it its a retorical question. ive seen some trainies do more damage that a dozen 12 year old could do.

iam also one of those bad controller that have let children give clearences to aircraft, i was a very bad man a very bad man ,or was i.i guess if i was a manager haveing sex with a trainie like the guy in denver id be a better person.
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Maybe it would have been OK if he told the kid to say, "I thought you were a hooker. I was about to reach for my wallet."
 
CNN has picked up the story........"Kid at the controls of a/c in JFK tower....."


I hope those pilots can come to the defense of this guy......Let's play on everyone's fears......Great job CNN and others..... :sarcasm:
 
I haven't read the entire thread, blowing throw JCs right now, so if it has been said please forgive. I hope this doesn't lead to a big overreaction where the FAA bars kids from getting a tour of the tower. My son and I had to wait, until the designated guy could do it, but it was a great experience. They had an offline training seat, and made a fake track for him to take the hand over. Nothing unprofessional about it.
 
JEP said:
CNN has picked up the story........"Kid at the controls of a/c in JFK tower....."


I hope those pilots can come to the defense of this guy......Let's play on everyone's fears......Great job CNN and others..... :sarcasm:
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I totally agree with you. On NBC, the idiots were like " I can't believe the pilots didn't get angry and call the controllers out for letting the kids control".

NEWS FLASH NBC: THE PILOTS LIKED IT!!!!!!!!!
 
watching some interviews done by Fox, asking people on the street. Not suppose to happen, kid is not suppose to be in the place.
Another said, I think its a security breach i mean i would not let my kid up there.

Oh come on give them a break, no harm no foul as they say :)
 
JohnM said:
watching some interviews done by Fox, asking people on the street. Not suppose to happen, kid is not suppose to be in the place.
Another said, I think its a security breach i mean i would not let my kid up there.
QUOTE]

Well as long as their doing their due diligence and making a thorough investigation of it....
Just like jury of your 'peers', (or a Congressional inquriy into how Toyota ECU, throttle and brakes are designed) ask people with no possible hope of making an intelligent assessment of the situation.
This is just more fear mongering/grandstanding.

I noticed when I listened to the clip that the kid was only giving takeoff clearances and handoffs, anything time sensitive or safety related like TIPH the dad did.

<<<<<<<<<<<<<< (OH and I let my 3 y/o control an airplane, and we didn't die :) )
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yea even though the FAA is taking action I really hope its just a slap on the wrist type thing if anything.
 
I'm a bit bothered by the reactive nature of the Federal Govt. in general. I wonder what amount of action would have been taken had liveATC not picked this thread up the day it happened. It's like it's only a safety issue when Fox news picks it up. Some of the same things that have troubled me a bit about 3407.
 
upup89 said:
yea even though the FAA is taking action I really hope its just a slap on the wrist type thing if anything.
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Considering that Randy Babbitt did an emergency permanent revocation of certificates of two pilots who did not crash, did not cause a traffic conflict, landed with well above IFR minimum fuel, and did not violate any company procedures (in their current manual) at the time I'd say the outlook is grim for this controller which is really a shame because he was one of the good ones at JFK that was able to be friendly and move airplanes when it was busy.

The buzzword this year is "professionalism". You're going to be hearing a lot more about in the upcoming year as the FAA, NTSB, and congress all have this on their radar. Look for more misguided kneejerk legislation like S. 3048 introduced by Sen. DeMintt last week.
 
XLR99 said:
JohnM said:
watching some interviews done by Fox, asking people on the street. Not suppose to happen, kid is not suppose to be in the place.
Another said, I think its a security breach i mean i would not let my kid up there.
QUOTE]

Well as long as their doing their due diligence and making a thorough investigation of it....
Just like jury of your 'peers', (or a Congressional inquriy into how Toyota ECU, throttle and brakes are designed) ask people with no possible hope of making an intelligent assessment of the situation.
This is just more fear mongering/grandstanding.

I noticed when I listened to the clip that the kid was only giving takeoff clearances and handoffs, anything time sensitive or safety related like TIPH the dad did.

<<<<<<<<<<<<<< (OH and I let my 3 y/o control an airplane, and we didn't die :) )
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Hi, I'm from the FAA. I'm here to help you... to surrender your pilot certificate on the basis of you being dangerously dangerous. We were just going to give you a talking to but we noticed you fly GA airplanes so as a premptive action to prevent you from flying your airplane into a building in a fit of despondancy over your chastisement we've decided to revoke all of your certificates.

You'll be getting your emergency revocation letter soon. :bandit:
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THE MEDIA SUCKS!

When I first saw this thread a couple of weeks ago I thought it was only a matter of time before the story became a national media spectacle. This is another case of the general public and the media reacting to something they have NO understanding of.

In our country there no longer exist wiggle room to have fun. How do "we" expect our children to get excited about a job or career when all of the fun is sucked out of it. What this shows me is that the government wants us all to be robot's that are programmed to push buttons. Maybe the kid in the tower brought some happiness, albeit for a few minutes, to a job that is stressful and thankless at times. Maybe that kid made the pilot's listening remember why they got into aviation and reivigorated that pilot to continue with his job even in the most dismal of financial times for the industry.

the media ,and the FAA for their knee jerk reaction of suspending the ATC controller and manager.

Rant over!
 
I can only imagine the questions faux news were "asking"...

REPORTER: "So this kid was in charge of the entire JFK airport and probably put 10's of thousands of people's lives in danger, and can you imagine if this was happening the day 9/11 happened??!!"

CIVILIAN: "UHHHH...."

REPORTER: "So there you have it folks, danger in the skies once again!"
 
31L was probably a departure only runway at the time during a very slow period at JFK. I see nothing wrong with it. Heck, he sounded better than a lot of controllers giving takeoff instructions.
 
from CNN...

Washington (CNN) -- The Federal Aviation Administration is investigating after an air traffic controller at New York's John F. Kennedy Airport brought his young child to work and allowed him to communicate with planes, a source with knowledge of the investigation told CNN.
"Pending the outcome of our investigation, the employees involved in this incident are not controlling air traffic," the FAA said in a statement. "This behavior is not acceptable and does not demonstrate the kind of professionalism expected from all FAA employees."
However, Dave Pascoe, owner of liveatc.com, a Web site where the recording of the air traffic communications is posted, told CNN he believes the incident is "ridiculous" and has been "blown out of proportion."
In the recording, a child can be heard saying "Jet Blue 171, cleared for takeoff."
A man is then heard telling the plane, "Here's what you get, guys, when the kids are out of school."
The pilot chuckles and says, "Wish I could bring my kid to work." The same pilot later tells the child he did an "awesome job."
During the recording, which is dated February 17, the child also speaks to an apparent Air Mexico flight.
The source confirmed the incident to CNN. A second controller who was supposed to be in charge at the time "should be making sure that things like this don't happen," the source said.
The controller who brought the child to work later reported that he had done so, the source said. The controllers involved have been assigned to other duties pending the outcome of the investigation.
But Pascoe said, "Nobody in the aviation community felt like this was anything more than a noble thing, that a father would take his kid to work.
"And when you listen to any of the recordings, the situation in the tower is very controlled. There is no hint ... that anyone was too busy or anyone was interrupting the planes. The kid cleared two airplanes. It was very controlled and I don't think safety was compromised, nor should anyone be disciplined for this," said Pascoe, who is also a pilot.
The recording was from a network of receivers, he said, but couldn't reveal the source. The site, he said, exists for pilot education and sometimes other curious parties listen in. There was "absolutely no security threat" posed by the incident, he said.
"I have every belief that they'd make sure there were additional eyes there," Pascoe said. "Only the best of the best work at JFK tower and they are the best at what they do."
"It was one incident where a kid was up in the control tower," he said. "If you know anything about aviation, you know that the air traffic control towers are highly supervised. JFK is highly supervised. It's not just one controller controlling the runway. Supervisors are there and multiple people are there making sure by looking through binoculars and at radar ... a father was taking a child to work and let the kid clear planes for take off and now the world thinks it's an unsafe place."
The National Air Traffic Controllers Association, the union representing controllers, said in a statement, "We do not condone this type of behavior in any way.
"It is not indicative of the highest professional standards that controllers set for themselves and exceed each and every day in the advancement of aviation safety," association spokesman Doug Church said in the statement.
But "this is a ridiculous story," Pascoe said. "... It was blown out of proportion. Considering how skittish the public is, maybe it shouldn't be done, but I think there should be a procedure to allow visitors in the control tower."
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CBpilot said:
THE MEDIA SUCKS!

When I first saw this thread a couple of weeks ago I thought it was only a matter of time before the story became a national media spectacle. This is another case of the general public and the media reacting to something they have NO understanding of.

In our country there no longer exist wiggle room to have fun. How do "we" expect our children to get excited about a job or career when all of the fun is sucked out of it. What this shows me is that the government wants us all to be robot's that are programmed to push buttons. Maybe the kid in the tower brought some happiness, albeit for a few minutes, to a job that is stressful and thankless at times. Maybe that kid made the pilot's listening remember why they got into aviation and reivigorated that pilot to continue with his job even in the most dismal of financial times for the industry.

F the media ,and F the FAA for their knee jerk reaction of suspending the ATC controller and manager.

Rant over!
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couldnt have said it better, oh and nice one NATCA you can forget about me joining as a retired member now. maybe you guys can stick you noses a little farther up babbits butt , nice one throughing one of our own under the bus.
 
SBI said:
Unfortunately?! I don't think so. That's a good thing. This is not a game and these things should not happen.
Would you also allow your son to take your seat at the controls like the Russian captain did??
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Less than accurate comparison. As I might play devil's advocate and say the incident could easily be contrued as inappropriate, all the "unprofessional" comments are absurd. "Unprofessional" comments I've heard more on the JFK "ground" frequency ATC guys as opposed to the "tower" freq.

I don't believe safety was an issue here although "talking heads" in the media have raised eyebrows and fear as usual.

Yep, an "admonishment" might be in order. . .hey, keep your child off the loops.
 
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