New Alaska/Virgin pilot mins

pete2800 said:
Nah, man... too soon for that. This place takes a while to get back to people. The people currently interviewing were from the last time the window opened. I'd expect a time window of 0-6 months to hear back.
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Good information - thanks!
 
Just curious, since ma dukes is an FA at Alaska and I'm sure she says daily prayers to have us move out west with her favorite grandkids...
Any mention of no prior 121/no problem?
Yes, I know, apply and find out. Nowhere near applying for ANY job right now, riding my unicorn into the sunset.
Just curious, is all.
Also, is there an accurate pay scale out there I could show my wife?
Good luck all!
 
bucksmith said:
Just curious, since ma dukes is an FA at Alaska and I'm sure she says daily prayers to have us move out west with her favorite grandkids...
Any mention of no prior 121/no problem?
Yes, I know, apply and find out. Nowhere near applying for ANY job right now, riding my unicorn into the sunset.
Just curious, is all.
Also, is there an accurate pay scale out there I could show my wife?
Good luck all!
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Yeah, they hire a decent number of people who come from a charter/private jet background.

The pay scale on the APC page is accurate. Reserve guarantee is 79 hours, line guarantee is 75. Most months, the lines are built to around 80-82 hours of pay. 3% raise happens in April, then again the following April. Then negotiations for a new contract.
 
This is the payscale that was posted on an APC forum by an Alaskan guy:

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pete2800 said:
Yeah, they hire a decent number of people who come from a charter/private jet background.

The pay scale on the APC page is accurate. Reserve guarantee is 79 hours, line guarantee is 75. Most months, the lines are built to around 80-82 hours of pay. 3% raise happens in April, then again the following April. Then negotiations for a new contract.
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Thanks, and if you happen to run into bucksmith's Mother, please don't mention you dropped the college requirement. It will lead to weekly phone calls about how great Alaska is...:-)
 
pete2800 said:
It's kind of like working for Delta Airlines, I think.

:D



Actually, our pay is a lot like working at Delta.




As long as you're on the 717.
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I love to complain. Love love love love love to complain.

But 12 year captain at Delta on the 717 is $239, and 12 year captain at Alaska is $251, and it'll be $258 in a few months on the 737 and A320. It outpaces the A320 rates by $2 and misses the 737 rates by $7.

I know blended rates can suck, but it's something to work on in the next contract.
 
jtrain609 said:
I love to complain. Love love love love love to complain.

But 12 year captain at Delta on the 717 is $239, and 12 year captain at Alaska is $251, and it'll be $258 in a few months on the 737 and A320. It outpaces the A320 rates by $2 and misses the 737 rates by $7.

I know blended rates can suck, but it's something to work on in the next contract.
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And the FO rates are the same as the 717, plus or minus 2 bucks depending on the year.

Sure, the top of the scale may be the least offensive, but you're underpaid all the way there. The slope is all messed up. Alaska captain pay doesn't eclipse year 1 Delta captain pay on the same type until year 11.

And now correct for profit sharing.

This contract has issues, and I haven't even brought up scope yet.
 
pete2800 said:
And the FO rates are the same as the 717, plus or minus 2 bucks depending on the year.

Sure, the top of the scale may be the least offensive, but you're underpaid all the way there. The slope is all messed up. Alaska captain pay doesn't eclipse year 1 Delta captain pay on the same type until year 11.

And now correct for profit sharing.

This contract has issues, and I haven't even brought up scope yet.
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Scope is the only issue that matters. Paid 10% less but with iron clad scope? I'd vote for that all day long, and twice on Sunday.

As for the pay rates, the argument will be that, at a career carrier, you're paid on the top of the scale the longest, so that's the number that matters. Additionally, from a historical perspective, those steps don't matter. Delta 737 rates don't move up more than $13 through the course of the longevity scale because you'd never upgrade at year 2. Delta could throw money at the bottom of the longevity scale and say, "Yeah, sure, we'll give you that" while knowing that they'll never have to pay anyone those rates because for decades, nobody was upgrading that quickly. Even today, there are some outlier upgrades outside of NYC that are in the 2-3 year range, but what's it take to hold a line in ATL on the 737? LAX? SLC? SEA? The benchmark isn't the bad decisions the guy who bids 100% in a category is, it's what the guy at 50% is doing.

Also, look at the Southwest 737 rates, they more closely match what you guys have in top end and percentage of increase year over year.

TL;DR: Scope determines if you get paid, work rules determine how much you get paid. Any other discussions are window dressing for those who don't know any better.
 
ShortField said:
This conversation prompted me to look at Delta’s profit sharing program. AS seems to be more or less advertising 7.5% for this year, and looks like DAL’s is a minimum of 10.
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Delta is a min of 10% up to the first $2.5 billion then is goes up from there. For the last three years it’s been 18%ish.
 
jtrain609 said:
Scope is the only issue that matters. Paid 10% less but with iron clad scope? I'd vote for that all day long, and twice on Sunday.

As for the pay rates, the argument will be that, at a career carrier, you're paid on the top of the scale the longest, so that's the number that matters. Additionally, from a historical perspective, those steps don't matter. Delta 737 rates don't move up more than $13 through the course of the longevity scale because you'd never upgrade at year 2. Delta could throw money at the bottom of the longevity scale and say, "Yeah, sure, we'll give you that" while knowing that they'll never have to pay anyone those rates because for decades, nobody was upgrading that quickly. Even today, there are some outlier upgrades outside of NYC that are in the 2-3 year range, but what's it take to hold a line in ATL on the 737? LAX? SLC? SEA? The benchmark isn't the bad decisions the guy who bids 100% in a category is, it's what the guy at 50% is doing.

Also, look at the Southwest 737 rates, they more closely match what you guys have in top end and percentage of increase year over year.

TL;DR: Scope determines if you get paid, work rules determine how much you get paid. Any other discussions are window dressing for those who don't know any better.
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We're very much on the same page, with the minor caveat that both DAL and Alaska have Captains at significantly less than 12 years at the moment.

I've looked at Southwest's pay. I've also looked at Southwest's scope.

When compared to carriers with pay similar to ours, our outsourcing is catastrophic. When compared to carriers with outsourcing, our pay is pathetic.
 
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