Mythbusters to take on - PLANE ON A TREADMILL!!!

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Pilot Hopeful said:
Plane on skis . . .

Treadmill = ground, ice, snow; no movement, nothing, zilch, nada

Wheels = stationary, fixed skis; no movement, nothing, zilch, nada

Treadmill speed = wheel speed = 0 = nothing, zilch, nada

Power application, aircraft sliding across ground, acceleration, and takeoff


It works! Yay!
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The ice comparison is not valid in my example. It is for solving the original problem but not in my bastardized version

Still nobody can find an example where the treadmill matches the wheel speed and the airplane still takes off.
 
Really challenging example . . .

Secure an aircraft to an ordinary oversized treadmill, such that the treadmill and aircraft become a single unit. Select a desired speed on the treadmill and note that aircraft tires rotate at same speed.

Suppose the ordinary oversized treadmill also has wheels along the bottom. These wheels are used to help reposition the treadmill around the exercise facility and require personnel to insert chocks to keep the treadmill stationary.

Now suppose the pilot of the aircraft---secured to the treadmill and unable to move with respect to the treadmill---increases thrust and the treadmill chocks are removed. The aircraft tires will continue to spin at a leisurely workout pace, but the treadmill-airplane unit will accelerate and takeoff.

Bon voyage!
 
Sure thing, but with the treadmill stationary, the plane would attempt to move forward upon the treadmill. This would cause the wheels to speed up, which in turn, would cause the treadmill to speed up....
 
Chris_Ford said:
The ice comparison is not valid in my example. It is for solving the original problem but not in my bastardized version

Still nobody can find an example where the treadmill matches the wheel speed and the airplane still takes off.
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You still haven't answered my question regarding this idea:
SteveC said:
Sorry. I think I know what you are trying to say, but it is a fundamentally faulty premise.

Let me start you down the path to (possible) enlightenment by saying that the surface of a treadmill only has a linear speed (defined as distance per time), not a rotational speed (revolutions per time). It cannot have the same (or opposite) rotational speed as the tires since that term doesn't apply. Try redefining what you think the myth author is saying about the treadmill speed (different that my premise that the treadmill is matching the airplane's speed) and we'll go from there.

:)
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Ahhhh...maybe you did answer my question, sort of. Rather than address my post you decided to change the question to your bastardized version, then dangle that as bait to see what kind of reaction you could generate.

Why not just stick with the question as originally posed? Backpedal much?
 
I said it my original post that I was bastardizing the question. As the question is written I have no doubt that the airplane would take off.

I'm not backpedaling at all.
 
Chris_Ford said:
I said it my original post that I was bastardizing the question. As the question is written I have no doubt that the airplane would take off.

I'm not backpedaling at all.
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OK then.

Chris_Ford said:
Not true. If the treadmill matched the speed of the TIRES, the airplane would not go forward. If it matches the speed of the aircraft itself (which is the assumption that most people use), the airplane will go forward.
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If you are willing to stretch a phrase like "...which is the assumption that most people use..." to mean that you "...<were> bastardizing the original question", than I suppose you can stretch "not backpedaling" to include what you're doing here.

:p
 
This thing is awesome! Put some Thrusters, couple wings.. and that fan in the front won't be needed anymore :-D
 
I'm resurrecting this thread just to remind anyone that's interested that this episode is going to be on tonight (Dec. 12). :nana2:
 
GatorFC said:
I'm resurrecting this thread just to remind anyone that's interested that this episode is going to be on tonight (Dec. 12). :nana2:
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Sweet thanks! I have a final but I'll see if I can catch it on a rerun.

Just for the record, I'm going to say NO it does NOT fly. Wings need airflow over them to produce lift, how do you produce lift if the airplane is in a standstill?
 
PGT said:
Wings need airflow over them to produce lift, how do you produce lift if the airplane is in a standstill?
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If are airplane with skis was on ice, does it take off? Yes.

If that ice was moving quickly, would it still take off? Yes. It would just slide on top of the surface. Similar to it being on wheels on a treadmill.

It'll move, and it'll take off.
 
PGT said:
Sweet thanks! I have a final but I'll see if I can catch it on a rerun.

Just for the record, I'm going to say NO it does NOT fly. Wings need airflow over them to produce lift, how do you produce lift if the airplane is in a standstill?
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LoadMasterC141 said:
$10 on the "Won't fly" side for me.
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Murdoughnut said:
My vote is for NO as well, but I don't have that type of money to put up :)
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800px-Not-again-picard.jpg
 
Not only is this thread 2 months old, but it's been beaten to death to such a degree the stench is permeating my entire computer!

To put a quote to the Picard picture above: "Oh no, not this again!"
 
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