Baronman
Well-Known Member
You guys are cute talkin about how tough your days in the CRJ were..
With your autopilot, FMS, glass, coffee maker, cockpit door, and lav... [emoji38]
Wouldn’t it just be quicker and easier for everyone to Uber?
Morbid curiosity. Upgrade times?
- Thread starter ZapBrannigan
- Start date
Wouldn’t it just be quicker and easier for everyone to Uber?
That’s cute with someone else to fly half the legs….You guys are cute talkin about how tough your days in the CRJ were..
With your autopilot, FMS, glass, coffee maker, cockpit door, and lav... [emoji38]
Crockrocket94
Well-Known Member
I don’t care what a charter pilot thinks, so no worries.
A guy wrote:
“Regional pilots are out there in the same weather as mainline pilots, flying 4-5 legs per day, with aircraft that aren't as capable, with maintenance controllers who are less knowledgeable, and dispatchers who are less experienced. They have less support, are pushed harder, and are expected to do more with less.”
And your answer was this regional guy hasn’t flown Dulles to (meant) Heathrow. As if that is harder or more difficult flying?
I flew the CRJ across the Midwest and Northeast in avg 5 legs day. Flown the Bus 320, B737, and it doesn’t even come close. The job at the regional was much more challenging, much more difficult. Life is easy now. Granted I haven’t flown to Europe, my ETOPs experience is Alaska/west coast to Hawaii. Still an easy breeze compared to 5 leg days of deicing in crap Midwest weather.
I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make, other than people shouldn’t be Captains at two years longevity. If that’s your only point, I agree with you.
Actually that's the exact point I'm getting at.
Its a different style of flying that presents its own issues that a guy who hasn't done much, I mean, technically a guy can go left seat ETOPS with NEVER having flown left seat etops, and paired with someone in the right seat who may not have ever done ETOPS etc. Green on green if you will. My point was that there could be a lack of experience with that style of flying. And Being exposed to it for a while before you sign for the plane as you jet across 3000 miles of open ocean may be beneficial.
Also I am a former charter pilot thank you.
I guess I don't see why ETOPS flying is somehow difficult. Just because it used to be only senior people that could hold doesn't mean it's difficult or requires tons of experience. Senior bubba's fly international because it's easy.Actually that's the exact point I'm getting at.
Its a different style of flying that presents its own issues that a guy who hasn't done much, I mean, technically a guy can go left seat ETOPS with NEVER having flown left seat etops, and paired with someone in the right seat who may not have ever done ETOPS etc. Green on green if you will. My point was that there could be a lack of experience with that style of flying. And Being exposed to it for a while before you sign for the plane as you jet across 3000 miles of open ocean may be beneficial.
Also I am a former charter pilot thank you.
Crockrocket94
Well-Known Member
Noone listens hah.
I didn't say it was DIFFICULT, I said it presents its own set of challenges that people who HAVENT flown that stuff, mainly contingencies. dealing with foreign operations, etc.
Man you guys are tough this week. Whats going on?
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
I just don’t think it’s as hard as you make it out to be. Most of our ETOPs stuff is dumbed down so even a caveman could do it. Stuff like ADS-C, dual SatComs, CPDLC, ETOPs reference cards, etc.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
Perhaps they’re just perplexed at why you think something is a problem that has been going on for nearly a century with no issues.
Crockrocket94
Well-Known Member
Todd - why are you still even a part of this forum?
It ebbs and flows with experience levels, and you can't tell me that having LOWer time, inexperienced in the airframe guys up front isn't a risk factor? Im pretty sure there is a HUGE book of rules and regulations etc that has been getting thicker every year because "there wasn't a problem".. until there was.
CC- Yeah, and that's great when everything is going as planned, but when the serious crap hits the fan, its definitely a different ball game.
End rant / People with no experience in the environment they are to operate in is a potential risk factor. 121 does a good job of mitigating the poor pilots by setting a pretty firm operation envelope so that everyone is guided by the same playbook. I get that.
It ebbs and flows with experience levels, and you can't tell me that having LOWer time, inexperienced in the airframe guys up front isn't a risk factor? Im pretty sure there is a HUGE book of rules and regulations etc that has been getting thicker every year because "there wasn't a problem".. until there was.
CC- Yeah, and that's great when everything is going as planned, but when the serious crap hits the fan, its definitely a different ball game.
End rant / People with no experience in the environment they are to operate in is a potential risk factor. 121 does a good job of mitigating the poor pilots by setting a pretty firm operation envelope so that everyone is guided by the same playbook. I get that.
ZapBrannigan
If it ain’t a Boeing, I’m not going. No choice.
Actually that's the exact point I'm getting at.
Its a different style of flying that presents its own issues that a guy who hasn't done much, I mean, technically a guy can go left seat ETOPS with NEVER having flown left seat etops, and paired with someone in the right seat who may not have ever done ETOPS etc. Green on green if you will. My point was that there could be a lack of experience with that style of flying. And Being exposed to it for a while before you sign for the plane as you jet across 3000 miles of open ocean may be beneficial.
Also I am a former charter pilot thank you.
That is the case I will most likely be finding myself in sometime in the next 18 months or so. [emoji15]
Autothrust Blue
”…trusting ze process…”
Your employer got ETOPS and it was like the second coming of Christ apparently.
ZapBrannigan
If it ain’t a Boeing, I’m not going. No choice.
Your employer got ETOPS and it was like the second coming of Christ apparently.
They just turned on autothrottles and LNAV less than a decade ago. I think you can give them a pass about getting excited about finding an island in the middle of the ocean rather than adding another nonstop to Lubbock[emoji57]
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
The constant yapping on 12345 about how only specially trained southwest pilots could manage to navigate the "C route" was amusing for about a day and then got old.
AA34
Well-Known Member
Hey Lubbock is the Hawaii of West Texas.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
I have friends here. And I’m hardly the only former-pilot/non-pilot here.
ZapBrannigan
If it ain’t a Boeing, I’m not going. No choice.
I know less than nothing about ETOPS. But eventually I'll have to learn I suppose.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
It's WAY more simple than people would have you believe. You'll probably never want to go back to domestic once you experience CPDLC. And ETP pretty much makes your decision making process binary.
Doug Masters
Well-Known Member
The hardest part of ETOPS is Gander sending you your oceanic clearance with a track change the exact moment your meals get handed up. Uploading a new route while also not spilling your soup is a skill that can only be honed with many years in the right seat.
Screaming_Emu
Well-Known Member
The only time I have ever jumpseated with you guys was right after they “turned on” VNAV. I didn’t understand it either, but it was amusing seeing them pull out “VNAV for dummies” approaching TOD.
Screaming_Emu
Well-Known Member
I don’t know much about ETOPS, but it’s my understanding that if things go according to plan, which they usually do, it’s no big deal.
It’s kind of why I laughed at multi engine requirements for hiring. 99.999% of flying around with multiple engines is pretty similar to single engine flying.
ZapBrannigan
If it ain’t a Boeing, I’m not going. No choice.
There's a bunch of them who could use a refresher on "VNAV for dummies". A few chapters from "Autothrottles for kids who can't read good" wouldn't hurt either.