Mike Boyd on the GM corporate jets thing

I'd say they do.

There are people in this country who kill for hundreds of dollars. Execs for these large companies are worth milllions, some billions. I'd want some security if I were them.

Then we should see them with bodyguards wherever they go and dozens of guys in black suits and sunglasses with little earpieces patrolling the grounds of their homes LOL. I don't blame them for wanting security, but some of these guys go WAYYYYYYYY overboard. A commercial flight with two or three bodyguards does the trick quite nicely. Poisoned food? Don't eat, problem solved:laff:
 
It really has to do with information security. An Executive Officer can't be doing business on a commercial flight with the information they have. Companies can't risk having that information leaked out. If another pax overheard something or happened to pretend to be sleeping and sneak a peek of an email detailing a major business deal or breakthrough technology, etc, that could have dire consequences for that company. Yes it's a stretch, but that's the real threat for them.
 
Ford and GM have both closed their flight departments. Another 100 some pilots on the steet.

Alex.
 
All of that is fine and hella secure, but do most of these execs really need that level of security:confused:

Were it you, what would the answer be?

I am sure that at some level, YOU are expendable and not worth the added security costs but that is the corp decision.

But to show how things really work, GM has decided to sell its airplanes. Does that mean the execs will be on JetBlue to LAX or USAir to PHX. I doubt it... but the required humbling is taking place.. more smoke and mirrors and definitely NOT a change to the way DC works.
 
Were it you, what would the answer be?

I am sure that at some level, YOU are expendable and not worth the added security costs but that is the corp decision.

But to show how things really work, GM has decided to sell its airplanes. Does that mean the execs will be on JetBlue to LAX or USAir to PHX. I doubt it... but the required humbling is taking place.. more smoke and mirrors and definitely NOT a change to the way DC works.

DC has nothing to do with the reason for them asking for money. There smoke and mirror show is another arguement for another time.
All I can say is that if it were me, I'd take the private jet as an accessible luxury, not as a safety thing. Just to be totally real, even if the jets were available while my company was suffering I'd probably still use the jet. But I definitely wouldn't take it to go ask for a billion dollar bailout mixed in with the fact we aren't doing anything to improve business also mixed in with the fact that this is bringing national media attention. Plus most of the security concerns are stretches and some of the others can be non-issues with a little common sense. But most people don't show common-sense so I see the need for them to use a private jet from a lack of common sense:laff:
 
Ford and GM have both closed their flight departments. Another 100 some pilots on the steet.

Alex.

That sucks. I bet if it didn't get out that they used private jets to go to DC then they would still have a flight department albeit lean instead of doing away with it altogether.
 
Ford & GM

Ford and GM have both closed their flight departments. Another 100 some pilots on the steet.

Alex.

Yep.

A friend of mine knows a guy who flew for GM on the G-V. He told me this afternoon he talked to him and there was a padlock on the hangar door this morning. Same for a guy that he knows at Ford.
 
wow, is it me or does that make corporate flying seem more risky than commercial flying as a career choice. Seems like with commercial lay offs at least you have somewhat of a warning. But corporate gigs can fold over night.

I remember at the airport in NH where Typco flew out of when that CEO was caught smuggling art, the next week their hangar emptied two falcons and an S-76 and only kept a Agusta 109.
 
Of course it's silly. It's also totally unsurprising. Smoke and mirrors indeed.

I'm no fan of a Big 3 bailout...I'm afraid it's time for them to sink or swim (sink). That said, what I find really interesting is that these particular empty suits are being raked over the coals for their relatively piddling $25B in loan gurantees, whilst the Bankstas have already gotten their $700B+ (who knows what it will finally run out to) with nary a whimper from the congresscritters. The 700+ is money that mostly has yet to be created (read, eventually: taxed) and we HAVE NO IDEA TO WHOM IT IS GOING. Look it up if it sounds incredible. The Fed/Treasury has bluntly refused to disclose the recipients of these pseudo-secured handouts, despite the fact that so doing was part of the "deal".

Yes, the corporate jet issue is a dog and pony show distracting from the meat of the big 3 bailout. But the big 3 bailout is a dog and pony show distracting from the lightning-quick and amazingly unremarked-upon ordination of a new ruling class in the United States. Welcome to the realm of the Federal Reserve Government.
 
Time Magazine Agrees: http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1863640-2,00.html

When the heads of the Detroit Three auto companies return to Washington this week to testify before Congress about their restructuring plans, they won't be traveling on their corporate jets. Not after the story broke on Nov. 19 that they had flown their "luxurious" aircraft to Washington to beg for $25 billion in loans to keep their companies afloat. Official Washington was outraged at the extravagance. Columnists and comics were ever so grateful for the gift. "I mean, couldn't you all have downgraded to first class or jet-pooled or something to get here?'' whined Representative Gary Ackerman of New York.


This from a legislative body that has raised money-wasting to an art form. It wasn't too long ago that members of Congress often mistook corporate aircraft for the Congressional Airline. "Hitching" a ride on corporate jets was such a regular event, and so abused a privilege, that eventually the solons had to stop themselves. There was nothing to stop Senator John McCain from using his wife's jet to make dozens of campaign stops this year, contravening but not breaking election laws because he, or at least Mrs. McC, "owned" the aircraft through a family company.


It was pointed out that the three could have flown commercial that morning for something like $212 each. But let's do the math. Three CEOs being paid millions a year each are going to Washington on a business trip to try to save $300 billion worth of sales and 3 million jobs — and they are supposed to risk all of that on Northwest or US Air, a.k.a. Northworst and Useless Air, formerly Allegheny a.k.a. Agony Air? I see the connection: you fly to D.C. on a previously bankrupt airline as you contemplate the bankruptcy of your own company. The experience should be enough to scare you into devising a scheme to save your own company from such a fate. But wouldn't this be a case of America's worst-run manufacturing companies relying on America's worst-run service companies? There'd be a 50% to 75% chance of the CEOs showing up on time. What are you supposed to do, call Congress and tell them you're on a gate hold?
ABC milked the story for all it was worth, as any news organization would do. But ABC's VIPs are not strangers to corporate jets. This week there's ABC's Charlie Gibson interviewing George Bush on Marine One, the helicopter the President uses to get out of town to Camp David. You think Charlie took Amtrak to Washington to meet the President? Even if he did, it's fairly routine for the networks to ferry their precious anchors around by private jet these days. (And while we're at it, why can't Bush take a carpool to Camp David? This nation isn't exactly flush, and he's not exactly essential any more. Doesn't the Secret Service own an armored Suburban?)


And don't expect the honchos at Walt Disney Co., which owns ABC, to be arriving for the Obama Inaugural festivities via United or American. Disney, like any self-respecting media company, owns or leases aircraft to get its own VIPs around. They're not going to let Miley Cyrus slum it on Southwest. The privileged would include Bob Iger, Disney's CEO. The company spent more than $65,000 in 2007 on Iger's personal travel aboard corporate aircraft, and it requires him to fly corporate when he's on business. Disney extends the private-jet perk to other top officers as well as directors attending meetings and other company events. Nice. Yes, Iger is having a way better year than the Detroit Three — would you rather own High School Musical or Buick?


But the issue here is that most of the Fortune 500 boards require the boss to fly in the corporate jet. And why not? What's the point of achieving the big corner office, knifing all those people on your way to the top, if you don't have the ultimate travel ticket? You might as well stop at divisional vice president. That should be no less true for the Detroit Three. Ford boss Alan Mulally left an aircraft company, Boeing, to take the top job at the auto company — the man is used to big jets.


<!--pagebreak--> What really ticks us off is not that the Detroit Three flew private on a begging mission. It's that we have to fly commercial, and they don't. Anyone who has spent time seething at an airport hub, squished into a middle seat of a 737, or paid $2 for a bottle of water and some attitude has nothing but venom for those who can avoid it. The corporate fleet has mushroomed over the years as commercial service has deteriorated. Going from Grand Rapids, Mich. to Jackson, Miss.? That will only involve an entire day shoehorned into "regional" jets apparently made in a region where all the people are 4 ft. 6. It was the reduced service to secondary markets that prompted some corporations to take action. Toilet-paper and Kleenex maker Kimberly-Clark, for instance, created an airline, Midwest Express, in 1984 partly to compensate for the lack of service in Neenah, Wis. (its headquarters at the time) and to optimize the use of its owned or chartered planes. Midwest Express quickly became known for top-rated service, unsurprising coming from a company that knew a little bit about taking care of customers' tushes.



Invariably, the jets that CEOs ride — Gulfstreams, Citations, Lears — are described as luxurious by reporters who probably have never been on board. Good guess, though. Being a business journalist, I've been on a number of corporate chariots, ranging from Nike's (think new, cushy Air Jordans with wings) to Wal-Mart's (think used Chrysler minivan with wings.) Typically, you are offered a ride-along with the CEO to watch the big boss in Action Mode. I'm not really sure if this is designed to impress or if it's simply an effective use of the CEO's time. After all, he's got to get from A to B, so he can use this otherwise dead period to fill some idiot reporter's head with stuff. The joke's on them, though, because on a corporate jet, the subject is trapped. He can hardly say, "Well, I'd like to talk to you a little longer but I've got a meeting across town." Not without a ripcord.



The best thing about flying corporate isn't the comfy seats or the jumbo shrimp, or even the ego massage. The best thing about a corporate jet is that it's not a commercial-airline jet. The best thing is avoiding long airport-security lines and having to simultaneously untie your shoes, take off your coat, get a laptop out of a carefully packed bag and walk at the same time; it's avoiding the crummy, overpriced airport food, the packed planes, the overstuffed overhead bins and the frazzled, overworked crews. And being No. 175 for takeoff. When you fly corporate, you are driven up to the plane, you get in, and when everyone is ready, they tell the pilot to go. And then you do. That is real, unadulterated luxury.



Those complaining about the extravagant cost of winging CEOs around the world are also forgetting about the extravagant cost of CEOs. My own company, Time-Warner, at one time owned five G-5s, a couple of which were used to haul movie stars wherever it was they needed to be hauled to. They certainly were not for journalists; I've been on a company jet exactly once in the last 10 years. The shareholders paid Time-Warner CEO Jeff Bewkes $19.6 million last year. Based on a 40-hour week (and he'd better be working more than that), his hourly cost is about $9,400 — I'm guessing that's beyond the hourly run rate of a G-5. Bewkes has actually been known to fly commercial to Los Angeles. If he takes United Flight 29, he's on time 70% of the time. If he's not on time, he's cooling his heels at JFK, burning the shareholders' money. My money. So take the corporate jet, Jeff. We're not paying you to sit around airports reading People.

As for the Detroit Three, they don't have a choice this week. The weenies at Ford announced they were selling two jets (meaning, of course, that lower-ranking execs will be flying Northwest to the plant in Valencia) and driving a Ford Escape hybrid to Washington. GM has caved completely and shut down its air force, throwing 50 people out of work. (Thanks, Congressman Ackerman!) Maybe the President should send his helicopter for the GM honchos. He doesn't really have use for it now. And when some truly desperate Americans need a dramatic rescue, sending in Marine One isn't a bad idea at all.
 
It really has to do with information security. An Executive Officer can't be doing business on a commercial flight with the information they have. Companies can't risk having that information leaked out. If another pax overheard something or happened to pretend to be sleeping and sneak a peek of an email detailing a major business deal or breakthrough technology, etc, that could have dire consequences for that company. Yes it's a stretch, but that's the real threat for them.

Me thinks you overestimate the percentage of these guys' time that is spent on truly confidential stuff. In fact, about 95% of their time is spent just trying to find out WTF is going on in their own companies, so they can respond truthfully and fully to analyst / wall street questions.
 
Guffaw if you wish but at some of the big companies, their security makes the TSA look like a huge joke. Go search the web for travel info on Home Depot, Coca-Cola, Sony, 3M.. where they fly, what airports they visit world wide and when. You probably also know that many of these 'luxury barges' are hardened just like AF1 for secure communication, the food and water on board is tested to rigorous standards, etc.

Invest is secure communication, food, and water? Your imagination is too active. . . go visit a GA airport, drive your car onto the ramp. . . park in front of the CEOs jet. . . security my A$$!
 
Thanks for the tall glass of Kool-Aid, Zap:laff: That article reminded me of playing the dozens, I'm pissed because I fly commercial:laff:
 
Can I just make sure people have me on the "really don't see the big deal about GM execs flying corporate jets, but think there might have been a more safe for the mass media and armchair hysterics method of getting to DC to make a dash for the cash"? :)
 
You know, something that seems to be overlooked in the Boyd article is that the corporate jets do not just fly around the execs.

I know of a couple Fortune 100 companies which fly around staff on their jets. Sometimes, it was cheaper to fly them to where they needed to get than flying commercially. If you've got to pick up a last minute ticket, it can get really spendy really quickly. So if you've got to get a team of workers into a place that's not well served by commercial airlines, then the corporate jet can be the better choice.

It looks bad, but let's face it. The corporate jets at GM, Ford, and Chrysler are not the problem. Nor is the job bank for the UAW. It's chump change compared to the real problem.
 
It looks bad, but let's face it. The corporate jets at GM, Ford, and Chrysler are not the problem. Nor is the job bank for the UAW. It's chump change compared to the real problem.

:yeahthat::yeahthat::yeahthat:It looked darn bad for the mission at hand.
 
Deek voiced what I've been thinkin' since the first time I saw the 1st video clip: how much is the national debt and how many of those congresspersons flew to that meeting on a personal jet? Hmmmm...now who are the supposed hypocrites? Lol. :rolleyes:

Check 6,
Air Pirate out.

www.flyefi.com
F70, SoCal
 
Deek voiced what I've been thinkin' since the first time I saw the 1st video clip: how much is the national debt and how many of those congresspersons flew to that meeting on a personal jet? Hmmmm...now who are the supposed hypocrites? Lol. :rolleyes:

Check 6,
Air Pirate out.

www.flyefi.com
F70, SoCal

Very valid point (but those types of arguements are a pet peeve). Basically it says leave me alone and let me do "wrong" since you're doing "wrong".
 
Invest is secure communication, food, and water? Your imagination is too active. . . go visit a GA airport, drive your car onto the ramp. . . park in front of the CEOs jet. . . security my A$$!

I take it from your brusque response you fly for some company with loose security? Or you hang around various airports with corporate aircraft? Try getting near the Coca Cola hangar. Try getting near the Sony or the 3M aircraft. And you will note on many high profile companies there is NOTHING to identify the company on the airplane.

And I know some companies reportedly do NOT take on any potable water or food when overseas. Secure comm.. and you think these people communicate without scramblers? Many company airplanes are essentially flying offices and come with comparable levels of security.

And I fly out of many GA airports and security is ramping up (no pun intended). Not imagination. Fact. Whereas a few years ago one could roam the 'drome without anyone asking, now I find more and more line guys are challenging and asking for credentials. And I am just your average old white guy.

Of course, the field where I keep my airplane is out an out-of-the-way little 'drome and that is fine with me. But all small aircraft, no jets, no corporate aircraft. However I can see the day when even these little airfields will be subject to regs.
 
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