LogTen Pro X

ATN_Pilot said:
Agreed. But that shouldn't involve calling their ethics into question.
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Perhaps I misunderstand.

I think you mean that @Acrofox may be wrongly accusing an ethics flaw. The business is really just leveraging their current consumer base to drive up revenue from a market that is no longer in growth mode. There isn't an emerging market anymore for pilots and their digital logbooks, stuck at regionals, just a slow trickle. While many professionals move on to a big time airline it's unlikely they'll need to keep on top of those logbooks for decades while age 65 (or whatever age comes up next) and economic recessions take their toll on future careers. All these logbook companies are going to try and adopt the "slow bleed" approach every business in America is trying out because of it's success by the cell companies in America. Rightly / wrongly (doesn't matter) American's will accept this slow bleed on their wallet much easier than 2 generations before.

A consumer can criticize any way they wish even if it's hyperbolic, right?
 
jynxyjoe said:
A consumer can criticize any way they wish even if it's hyperbolic, right?
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Of course. But once you start using words like "exploitative," I think you cross the line. That's alleging unethical business practices, and there's nothing unethical about trying to improve profit margins with a new pricing structure.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
Of course. But once you start using words like "exploitative," I think you cross the line. That's alleging unethical business practices, and there's nothing unethical about trying to improve profit margins with a new pricing structure.
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He may not fully understand what he said as it applies to business. I would be shocked if @Acrofox is alone in his disdain and that will probably translate to some lost customers. I think Logten (primarily apple) is cemented well in the apple culture of "spend spend spend" and I doubt it will hurt their bottom line much. Their margins will probably increase as a result. Apple phone users are targeted because they, as a demographic, are proven to spend much more with regularity, than an android user. However, look for a sharp turn if they announce next month "ONLY KIDDING, REFUNDS FOR ALL!" because that means I (and they) are wrong.
 
Mine is free... www.pilotica.com works for my purposes. not sure what the 121 guys need but happy to add stuff if you need it.
 
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I have 3.2.1 iphone and 5.7.5 macbook and they work great. I just need to input 2011-2012 then was planning on buy the latest version, but I guess i'll have to see how it all works out. Can't say I'm thrilled about a yearly subscription.
 
Was looking into LogTen a couple months ago to replace my excel spreadsheet and paper logbook. I decided to keep using the spreadsheet because it does everything I want it to (including time in type) and if I need some new info I just set up a new cell with the formula and it gives me exactly what I want, but it does mean putting in a little extra work. The convenience of having a standalone product wasn't worth the expense then, and I figured if/when I outgrew it I could get the latest version of LogTen without too much hassle.

Glad I held back, it's going to take a lot of additional benefits from my current system that I just don't see right now to make it worth $70 per year.

In theory, though, I'm not opposed to a subscription. Developers have to get paid for their work somehow. The other way (buying a program that eventually becomes obsolete and doesn't work on the latest OS) has always been frustrating to me, as it's basically the same thing without the upfront understanding of exactly how much it costs and when the charges will occur. As long as there is always a way provided to export my data in a usable format if I ever decide not to pay, I'll gladly pay a reasonable subscription fee.
 
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but software "as a service" compared to software "as a product" is the present and the future.

We do live in this strange world where $70 per year to track all of the items that it tracks would be a bargain in any other industry... except professional aviation.

I haven't used the software extensively so i can't attest to the utility of it, but many of us drop at least $70 on mediocre booze and wings at a semi-average bar and all we end up with is indigestion and a hangover.

Having just cut a check for the NetworkJC bill* that would make most of this website "nervous vomit" like a high school girl on Zima (or @DPApilot), believe me, things cost stuff and it's generally much more than we, especially as pilots, realize.





*Which "revenue" < "cost" and luckily, compared to 2010, the difference is slightly less than five digits so I'm "happy".
 
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Derg said:
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but software "as a service" compared to software "as a product" is the present and the future.

We do live in this strange world where $70 per year to track all of the items that it tracks would be a bargain in any other industry... except professional aviation.

I haven't used the software extensively so i can't attest to the utility of it, but many of us drop at least $70 on mediocre booze and wings at a semi-average bar and all we end up with is indigestion and a hangover.
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While this is certainly true, Logten X is in my "want" column, not "need" column. If I were managing a group of pilots and needed an official, audit-proof time-management system, I'd be more than willing to shell out an annual fee.

I think they have a neat platform and wish them the best, but I'd rather spend the money on other "want" items.
 
Derg said:
We do live in this strange world where $70 per year to track all of the items that it tracks would be a bargain in any other industry... except professional aviation.
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Here's an app to track billable hours for $7.99 and no subscription fee.

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2406097,00.asp

The app then syncs with a desktop program that can do invoicing once you've tracked all your billable hours in the app. That costs $47, and again, a one time fee.

While I agree that we're in a subscription based environment for software these days, the ask for LogTen Pro X is too much, I believe. If this is the case, the market will sort it out, and they'll go out of business.

But my guess is that the more likely outcome is that they reduce their pricing.
 
I have been using LogTen since 2007 and I just wrote Coradine a letter expressing my discontent with the present lease model. I suggest everyone who feels the same way post a comment on his website as well. I'm not upgrading to LogTen X is not worth it when I have the previous version that does exactly what I want it to do and it's paid for. Why would I want to start paying for something on an annual basis when I can do it already without paying anything for it. The only thing I will lose is iCloud sync since my version will not work with Yosemite. Oh well back to wifi syncing which is not all that painful.
 
From Coradine in 2012:

"We listened, here's what you said.
We conducted a customer feedback survey in early January and we wanted to share the valuable results we received from thousands of your peers.

The majority of pilots felt the initial price was pretty close, but the upgrade price was too high (which was exacerbated by the fact that this was the first time a major new version of LogTen Pro launched for Mac, iPad and iPhone all at the same time).
-- 74% of respondents were in favor of paid upgrades, as opposed to a subscription or in-app purchase model.
-- 80% of you want a universal app so you can run LogTen Pro on both iPhone and iPad with one app.
-- 81% are running Mac OS X Lion
-- 79% have an iPhone 4 or 4S
-- 80% have an iPad (with the majority having an iPad 2).

Thank you for your honest feedback. We always want to consider the customer first when deciding the future direction the company takes."
 
C150J said:
While this is certainly true, Logten X is in my "want" column, not "need" column. If I were managing a group of pilots and needed an official, audit-proof time-management system, I'd be more than willing to shell out an annual fee.
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I wouldn't call LogTen Audit Proof and wouldn't use it to manage a flight department. Just about every place I have worked have used a custom in house system, sabre, flica or rockwell collins FOS.
 
Bandit_Driver said:
I wouldn't call LogTen Audit Proof and wouldn't use it to manage a flight department. Just about every place I have worked have used a custom in house system, sabre, flica or rockwell collins FOS.
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Absolutely - just referring to the "type" of time/asset management software that I believe is worthy of a subscription.
 
They're idiots still. How can you explain how the sync worked, then iOS 8 came out with drive and it "broke"? Now with LTP X, it's magically fixed. The guy is a con. Too bad karma is the B word.
 
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