Pilot Fighter
Well-Known Member
I'm pretty sure that the NTSB is going to go ahead with their investigation despite my post. While anything is possible, not everything is probable.
Landing Incident @ SFO
- Thread starter BEEF SUPREME
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drunkenbeagle
Gang Member
Area 5150
Model citizen, Zero discipline
Please follow up all ideas and personal investigations, regarding this crash, to A.Net! They've got 97% of it figured out.
They'll be closing the books on this incident in 17 minutes. NTSB be damned!!
**Cough**
HVYMETALDRVR
Well-Known Member
You can fly a visual without a glide slope? Damn you freight pilots are bad ass!
Pilot Fighter
Well-Known Member
Need somebody to hold your hand?
drunkenbeagle
Gang Member
I'll say it myself. Drawing conclusions without facts does a disservice to everyone.
I don't know why this happened.
You don't know why this happened.
We don't know exactly what happened.
Get data, examine data, see what it tells us. Right now, all intelligent people have are questions.
Buzzkill....It's much more fun to speculate with Wolf Blitzer as I reach for another pale ale. And for those that dont know me......
SeanD
Well-Known Member
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
Oh snap. The JC crowd brought out the Flightaware printouts. Let the crucifixion begin.
Area 5150
Model citizen, Zero discipline
Ok, I'm shocked that Wolf didn't pose the question of why a Pizza Joint was built at the end of a runway!!
I swear, he becomes more of a slacker, each day.
drunkenbeagle
Gang Member
Other than possibly being the only Air Force guy with a lower GPA in college, I doubt he has anything in common with me at all. But from what I have read, his interpretation is generally quite valuable and informed.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
This guy knows all
Is that any worse than your analysis of flightaware and "speed looks low." He hasn't said anything worse than what I have read in this thread.
Area 5150
Model citizen, Zero discipline
Is that Alex Van Halen?This guy knows all
drunkenbeagle
Gang Member
Tommay85
Well-Known Member
This guy knows all
I always laugh like an idiot whenever I see this guy. His mannerisms and accent crack me up, then I turn him off.
Winglet
Well-Known Member
Thats Richard Quest!!!! I cant get enough of this guy!
inigo88
Composite-lover
Gee good thing the ATP rule is coming into effect in a month so accidents like this do not happen
jtrain609 said:
jtrain609 is absolutely right. I'm not sure how you thought this incident would somehow support your 1500 hour rule bashing, since the exact opposite is true. The fact is that ab initio training and cadet programs are the norm in Asia, and people with ~250-300 hours really ARE put in the right seat of heavy jets.
I really hope this incident creates a more public discussion about ab initio training, the practice of outsourcing their new hires to pilot mills in the U.S. (and why it's done), the "FO" contracts they have with freight companies like Ameriflight, and the cultural differences and age and experience hierarchies "nc" referred to that don't lend themselves to adequate CRM.
We should also be talking about the practice of hiring ex-pat westerners as captains (which many of you say "babysit" or "flight instruct" the foreign FOs). I've read this is on the decline in Asia, as countries become more nationalistic, view the ex-pats as taking their jobs, and promote more of their own FOs to Captains rather than hire the ex-pats. What happens if those new captains still aren't up to par, and they're now the ones responsible for leading and supervising the new ab initio FOs?
I think this is a pretty complex issue, but from the outside it sure looks like ab initio training in Asia is broken.
So if you'd like to rage about the 1500 hour rule and how it's preventing you from getting into the right seat of an RJ faster, today's incident is not very good supporting evidence. In fact, it may end up serving as a solemn reminder of why the U.S. should not go the ab initio route (despite how pleased the airlines would be to have their pilots bought into indentured servitude).
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