JetBlue hires violent felon as a pilot

ppragman said:
I mean, why not? If he’s rehabilitated, served his time, he should be fine.

Otherwise why is he out of prison? He may have been a giant • then, but he’s been deemed fit to reenter society, why should he not get the chance provided he is qualified (it appears he is).

Otherwise, why release him in the first place. Honestly, this is a good thing.
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He has been rehabilitated in the minds of anonymous civil servants that get it wrong most of the time. Not some of the time, most of the time. I don’t have to accept the habitually flawed efforts and opinions of our judicial and corrections systems.

The data is pretty clear on this subject. In most states, the felony recidivism rate for assault and burglary felons exceeds 60%. The only encouraging thing is that these felons are most likely to reoffend with a non-violent crime.
 
Uhm, this dude showed up at the house of a judge, wearing body armor, and beat his ex-fiancee with a metal baton. We're not talking about parking tickets. We don't let violent felons vote, and there's absolutely no reason that they should not be discriminated against in hiring. The word "discrimination" has gotten a bad rap because it's been deployed only to describe *unjust* discrimination (which of course is rightly to be despised). But the word just means "drawing a distinction", which everyone does and everyone obviously should.

I'm glad this guy has apparently turned his life around. Great. Go forth and sin no more, my son. At Walmart.
 
Pilot Fighter said:
He has been rehabilitated in the minds of anonymous civil servants that get it wrong most of the time. Not some of the time, most of the time. I don’t have to accept the habitually flawed efforts and opinions of our judicial and corrections systems.

The data is pretty clear on this subject. In most states, the felony recidivism rate for assault and burglary felons exceeds 60%. The only encouraging thing is that these felons are most likely to reoffend with a non-violent crime.
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So be mad at the criminal Justice system, also how long has he been out? How many chances has he had to re-offend.

If he’s not fit to re-enter society he’s not fit - but that shouldn’t be JetBlue’s responsibility to figure out. Regardless - I don’t even see what this particular crime has to do with operating a piece of aviation Industrial machinery? (Or to quote @Boris Badenov an “aviation appliance”)
 
ppragman said:
Right? “Oh those guys were never convicted so, you know, I feel safe with my family on their airplane?” Cmon.
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Why don’t you do some research on the Tailhook scandal before you run your (redacted).

Tailhook destroyed careers of hundreds of folks including some that were thousands of miles away. Comparing the crimes of this psychopath to what happened at Tailhook in 1991 is insane.
 
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ppragman said:
Every violent crime shouldn’t be a life sentence
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What life sentence? He's not in prison. However, your actions follow you around forever, that's the way the world works. Is it a "life sentence" if a guy fails three training events and can't get hired at "the majors"? No, it's a rational assessment of whether or not he will perform his duties effectively and safely.

This is 100% settled Law...employers have every right to discriminate against potential employees for that Permanent Record you were warned about in 3rd grade. So the question is simply whether or not hiring a convicted violent felon, however reformed he may or may not be, is a good play on the odds. And, as @PilotFighter points out, it's pretty obviously not.
 
ppragman said:
Like straight up, the people pearl clutching over this sort of thing are hilarious. It’s not even like this particularly heinous crime is even related to how the dude could operate an airplane - I get being hesitant about someone who served time for smuggling or repeatedly driving drunk or whatever, but even then the guy is either rehabbed or not.

If you don’t believe he was rehabilitated, then your problem should be with the prison system not with JetBlue.
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There’s a huge difference between being truly rehabilitated and simply being let out after doing your time. Some people do get out of prison and lead honest, law abiding lives. Statistics prove that the rate of recidivism is pretty high though.

This guy premeditated a heinous and violet crime. He was caught wearing a bullet proof vest with knifes, handcuffs and a shovel in his car. Apparently, from folks I know that knew about him in the AF, this wasn’t his first criminal act.

You claim the “Pearl clutchers” are hilarious and basically overreacting (implied) over such a mundane crime. I find your cavalier attitude about his crime and the willingness to put him in a high responsibility job affecting many lives….scary. You can’t really believe for one second the US prison system‘s deplorable rehabilitation record is suffice enough to put this person in the front of a jetliner carrying hundreds of people? You can argue that anyone could snap and possibly commit a criminal act while piloting an aircraft. True, but this guy already removed all doubt of what he’s capable of, so what happens if he has another “bad day”? I would not want to be in JetBlues’s shoes answering to that “social experiment“.

I believe when you commit violent crimes against others you forfeit future opportunities afforded to people who follow the rules their whole life. I believe in second chances….but only to a point. I don’t want my doctor being an ex-violent offender, I don’t want my priest to be a child sex offender and I don’t want the person flying me or my family around at FL350 having a violent criminal record. Call me crazy….just the way I feel.

I can’t believe a reputable airline (even a non-reputable one) would hire this person while having hundreds or thousands of qualified “clean record“ applicants on file who have followed all the rules. What a slap in the face to them! Geez….I remember when a speeding ticket was a disqualification check mark on an application. Nowadays, it seems you can be an attempted murderer with a felony prison record and get to go to the front of the line.

www.ocala.com

Pilot charged in attack at judge's home

PANAMA CITY - An Air Force pilot charged with forcing his way into a judge's home and attacking the jurist's stepdaughter will remain jailed pending his trial. Senior Circuit Judge Michael Miller den…
www.ocala.com
 
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mikecweb said:
He's not in prison. Doesn't mean he belongs in the cockpit.
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That may be the case - but if that is the case then we should be talking about the FAA letting him keep his certs, etc. not JB for hiring him. Being “of good moral character” certainly should mean something - but pearl clutching over this when he has been “rehabilitated and released to society” is silly.

If you think this sucks - fine I understand, but then tackle the problem. Be mad at the system, or even be mad at the FAA, but JetBlue is not responsible for fixing the problems of society.
 
Derg said:
I assume JetBlue had a vigorous “chat” about it, ran it through legal and made a decision we’re not privy to. I really know nothing beyond what I’ve read on the interwebs.
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I would assume that too. Just surprising they think it's worth the risk and correct me if I'm wrong isn't hiring a majority a risk assessment on damaging the brand or metal?
 
Derg said:
I assume JetBlue had a vigorous “chat” about it, ran it through legal and made a decision we’re not privy to. I really know nothing beyond what I’ve read on the interwebs.
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“Oh I was terrible person back then” <gives multiple examples> “this is how I changed, why I changed, etc” <gives multiple examples> “the old me sucked.”

like I said, people aren’t monolithic
 
ppragman said:
That may be the case - but if that is the case then we should be talking about the FAA letting him keep his certs, etc. not JB for hiring him. Being “of good moral character” certainly should mean something - but pearl clutching over this when he has been “rehabilitated and released to society” is silly.

If you think this sucks - fine I understand, but then tackle the problem. Be mad at the system, or even be mad at the FAA, but JetBlue is not responsible for fixing the problems of society.
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I ain't bad at anything. I'm just shaking my head that JetBlue is going this deep on the bench. If "the system" took care of all the prerequisites why do we even interview.
 
mikecweb said:
I would assume that too. Just surprising they think it's worth the risk and correct me if I'm wrong isn't hiring a majority a risk assessment on damaging the brand or metal?
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I really have no idea about what transpired there in Jersey City. Anyone that I do know internal to their process certainly isn’t going to tell me anything specific to the person in question.
 
A300Capt said:
There’s a huge difference between being truly rehabilitated and simply being let out after doing your time. Some people do get out of prison and lead honest, law abiding lives. Statistics prove that the rate of recidivism is pretty high though.
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sure - agreed, but that’s notJetBlue‘a job to figure out.

if you’re upset about this tell your congressman to fix the prison sysem
A300Capt said:
This guy premeditated a heinous and violet crime. He was caught wearing a bullet proof vest with knifes, handcuffs and a shovel in his car. Apparently, from folks I know that knew about him in the AF, this wasn’t his first criminal act.
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sounds like he was a real POS - I imagine his redemption arc is pretty captivating.

A300Capt said:
You claim the “Pearl clutchers” are hilarious and basically overreacting (implied) over such a mundane crime.
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You guys aren’t necessarily over reacting - but you may be reacting to the wrong issue.
A300Capt said:
I find your cavalier attitude about his crime and the willingness to put him in a high responsibility affecting many lives….scary
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nothing cavalier about it - dude went to prison and served his time. If he wasn’t “fixed” by that, well, then who’s fault is that?

A300Capt said:
You can’t really believe for one second the US prison system‘s deplorable rehabilitation record is suffice enough to put this person in the front of a jetliner carrying hundreds of people?
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I mean - there’s the rub right? If the systeM doesn’t work… who’s responsibility is it to fix it?

A300Capt said:
You can argue that anyone could snap and possibly commit a criminal act while piloting an aircraft. True, but this guy already removed all doubt of what he’s capable of, so what happens if he has another “bad day”?
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this is a hit of a non-sequitur here, but sure anyone could snap… but if he’s likely to snap, why the hell is he out of the klink in the first place?

if he wasn’t rehabilitated why is he out? And is it JB’s responsibility to act as some weird corporate arm of the justice system?

A300Capt said:
I believe when you commit violent crimes against others you forfeit future opportunities afforded to people who follow the rules their whole life
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People change man, we all do. If he changed - truly and fundamentally as a person… what is the point of punishing him the rest of his life - and yes, forfeiting all possibilities of a certain kind is a punishment for life.

A300Capt said:
I believe in second chances….but only to a point.
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then you don’t believe in second chances. we don’t have to forget what the dude did - but continuing to hold the crimes he’s done against him, to deny him the opportunity to get ahead, when clearly he had a good enough interview to get hired in SPITE of him being a jackass before is kind of messed up.

he’s either rehabilitated or he’s not. If he’s not, then why was he released?

A300Capt said:
I can’t believe a reputable airline (even a non-reputable one) would hire this person while having hundreds or thousands of qualified “clean record“ applicants on file who have followed all the rules. What a slap in the face to them! Geez….I remember when a speeding ticket was a disqualification check mark on an application. Nowadays, it seems you can be an attempted murderer with a felony prison record and get to go to the front of the line.
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I doubt he’s gone to the “front of the line” just saying.
 
Boris Badenov said:
JetBlue is definitely responsible to the Court of Public Opinion, however one feels about it. This is an obvious own goal, for obvious reasons.
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Sure - and that may screw them, but yeah, I don’t see this as a “net bad” unless he reoffends - then who should we be upset at? Obviously him, but really “if prison didn’t fix him why the hell was he let out?”
 
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