It’s Not Worth Showing Off

Boots2Wings said:
Predatory towards ones peers…
Im not sure why this take of yours irks me more than others…but it does. Sure, pull that ladder right on up after you've ascended the next level.
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But they’re choosing to pay, voluntarily. How’s it any different when someone wants to get rid of a trip, and they offer $400 to anyone who can take it away. Bottom line, money is being exchanged along with a trip.






Boots2Wings said:
We had senior FOs at my shop do the same, bid the “destination” layovers only to trade them back via the board asking for more credit…

Its almost like a century has taught some of us nothing about camaraderie in this profession.
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Whoa hold up. What’s wrong with bidding a 11:30 credit Hawaii 2-day, and then putting a handshake request (trade board) asking for a 2-day trip that pays more? People do this all the time.

Or a guy gets a min credit trip (like a day trip) on the trade board with a request of looking for higher paying day trip.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
But they’re choosing to pay, voluntarily. How’s it any different when someone wants to get rid of a trip, and they offer $400 to anyone who can take it away. Bottom line, money is being exchanged along with a trip.








Whoa hold up. What’s wrong with bidding a 11:30 credit Hawaii 2-day, and then putting a handshake request (trade board) asking for a 2-day trip that pays more? People do this all the time.

Or a guy gets a min credit trip (like a day trip) on the trade board with a request of looking for higher paying day trip.
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Yes i know, you’re view is that abject capitalism is always good; given your seemingly lifelong position of privilege relative to your peers that makes sense.

The day trip thing you mentioned is real…But when you have the dynamics and trip mixing that shops other than your own, its easy to see how someone might want a change from the repetitive overnights to something exotic. When you have only a handful (less than 10%h of “those trips” that the super senior FOs bid, good luck. Granted, we just havent had any lately, but when we did it was clearly predatory.

I do agree with you though, if theres a market then why not? Its why I havent had a single international destination since I started…its not worth it to me. Only place i want to be, if off at home with my partner.


But in the same way theres a predatory market for these trips, the same is applied to any number of things…”Oh, you dont want this house THAT BAD…well theres a market for you”. Its disgusting, especially when we should have some empathy towards one another.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
But they’re choosing to pay, voluntarily. How’s it any different when someone wants to get rid of a trip, and they offer $400 to anyone who can take it away. Bottom line, money is being exchanged along with a trip.








Whoa hold up. What’s wrong with bidding a 11:30 credit Hawaii 2-day, and then putting a handshake request (trade board) asking for a 2-day trip that pays more? People do this all the time.

Or a guy gets a min credit trip (like a day trip) on the trade board with a request of looking for higher paying day trip.
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Abrogation of seniority.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
If it’s your trip, I don’t care what you do. Including “selling” it for $500 to some other guy.

Thats just me :)
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And if the person selling that trip makes more money per hour, has the ability to win that trip without contest, and does so specifically to capitalize on more naive or desperate peers?…

Let me guess…
“Have you tried being more senior bro?”
 
Boots2Wings said:
And if the person selling that trip makes more money per hour, has the ability to win that trip without contest, and does so specifically to capitalize on more naive or desperate peers?…

Let me guess…
“Have you tried being more senion bro?”
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It is a seniority system. Yes.


And if I wanted to capitalize on more naiive or desperate peers, I would get them into Iraqi Dinars. :)
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
It is a seniority system. Yes.


And if I wanted to capitalize on more naiive or desperate peers, I would get them into Iraqi Dinars. :)
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I appreciate you…

Taking a hard line stance on this. Makes the back and fourth semantics obsolete.

Iraqi Dinar aside, ill happily share over a beverage the story of my soldier who tried to sell me on bitcoin way back when….
 
BEEF SUPREME said:
If I’ve learned anything this is how guys like @Cherokee_Cruiser, @Skåning and @word302 operate.

They get so upset and go for the jugular when anyone mentions something that could be improved about their precious reserve system because they are benefiting from it financially.

In addition we actually had cool destinations in our airlines network the nice trips would absolutely be for sale. But we don’t. So that isn’t a dynamic we’ve seen. So far.
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It’s funny how everyone just ignored you

Go on and tell us how you didn’t upgrade for the money

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FlyingAccountant said:
I mean, if I had the money to spend, a LHR trip seems a lot nicer than doing multiple ORD-LGA turns in a day.

I was talking to a Qantas pilot not too long ago who was telling me their widebody seniority list is "revolving". There's a set period of time, six months or something, and everyone advances up the seniority list every month until you get to the top and then you fall back to the bottom. Wash, rinse, repeat.

Sucks if you're an OG and you can hold something near the top in a traditional scheme, but I guess it's nice if you're a low guy and you're not stuck flying somewhere undesirable for months(or years) on end.
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Yes, Air New Zealand does holidays similarly. If you haven't flown any of the last 4 Xmas holidays for example, you're covering for someone who has worked a few in a row. They have a small pilot group for a national carrier and movement is rather stagnant with most Kiwis having to fly abroad quite a while before snagging an Air NZ interview.
 
SteveC said:
Well, I'd guess it kind of depends on if seniority (for trip bidding purposes) is intended for people to fly the trips that they want, or if it’s for making money off the lower number plebeians?
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Well, it's like this. I'm a LCP so chances are that I'll be conducting training and the senior FO will get released.

Lets say two FOs are awarded the bid to fly with me, one senior, one junior. The senior pilot is most likely going to get bought off.

In walks super-duper senior FO that says "How about we swap trips for a thousand high-fives and the FO takes the deal.

Now super-duper senior, while out of $1000, is now the senior FO on my pairing, I do an OE and he gets released from the trip with pay.

Here's the funny part. I swap with open time for better trips all the time, so if I swap-out of the trip, now I've got some cranky old man sending me hate mail about swapping-out of the trip or the 'formerly senior before the purchase" co-pilot calls in sick because he expected to be off anyway. There is a lot of down-line "butterfly effect" issues so the company said "nope" and SouthernJets ALPA also said "thou shall not".
 
derg said:
Here's the funny part. I swap with open time for better trips all the time, so if I swap-out of the trip, now I've got some cranky old man sending me hate mail about swapping-out of the trip or the 'formerly senior before the purchase" co-pilot calls in sick because he expected to be off anyway. There is a lot of down-line "butterfly effect" issues so the company said "nope" and SouthernJets ALPA also said "thou shall not".
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So this kind of thing is basically shop-specific, where one airline and its pilot group either doesn’t address it or basically allows it, while another airline and/or pilot group specifically prohibits it? If this is the case, am surprised more airlines don’t specifically disallow it, if just due to your last sentence alone.
 
MikeD said:
So this kind of thing is basically shop-specific, where one airline and its pilot group either doesn’t address it or basically allows it, while another airline and/or pilot group specifically prohibits it? If this is the case, am surprised more airlines don’t specifically disallow it, if just due to your last sentence alone.
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Probably. Admittedly, the only exposure I get to other brands is via Jetcareers.
 
derg said:
Well, it's like this. I'm a LCP so chances are that I'll be conducting training and the senior FO will get released.

Lets say two FOs are awarded the bid to fly with me, one senior, one junior. The senior pilot is most likely going to get bought off.

In walks super-duper senior FO that says "How about we swap trips for a thousand high-fives and the FO takes the deal.

Now super-duper senior, while out of $1000, is now the senior FO on my pairing, I do an OE and he gets released from the trip with pay.

Here's the funny part. I swap with open time for better trips all the time, so if I swap-out of the trip, now I've got some cranky old man sending me hate mail about swapping-out of the trip or the 'formerly senior before the purchase" co-pilot calls in sick because he expected to be off anyway. There is a lot of down-line "butterfly effect" issues so the company said "nope" and SouthernJets ALPA also said "thou shall not".
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This is crazy behavior and I’m waiting for the day someone decides to pull this with me. Apparently we have a few folks around here that have sent messages or called people who call out sick for their reserve block. I guess they were mad because they got pushed to the top of the list and don’t get to sit at home anymore.
 
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