I have always wanted to get my PPL. Did some flying in college, but was not able to finish due to lack of money. Sadly that lack of money has followed me into my adult life. I eventually came to realize that, while I could save up and someday finish my PPL, I didn't foresee a time when I would ever be able to exercise the priviliges because of the cost. A pilot has the responsibility to be safe and proficient, and the only way to do that is to fly regularly and often. I could not, can not, and probably won't ever be able to afford to do that, so for me, it is not "worth it." These days I satisfy my aviation urge by stopping by the local airport. And every once in a great while, I treat myself to a "Discovery Flight." But I focus my time and money on other pursuits that I can better afford.
Is a PPl really worth it?
- Thread starter Simtech
- Start date
Inverted25
Well-Known Member
youngflyer
Well-Known Member
That is true, and if your club has a winch the training can end up being very inexpensive.
Thanks for all the replies! I live in Mississippi not GA or OH. Close though! haha
I guess I should clarify...I know it is personally worth it to me as I have always wanted to do it and Im one to stick to my guns to see it through. It is just the cost seems so high...much higher than it was a few years ago, so I was wondering with cost in mind is it something that can still be enjoyable. As far as other hobbies...well that is my problem when concerned with my wife. I have 4 wheelers, I have a jet ski, guns, fishing gear, fishing boat, you know the stuff I have to have but don't ever use them anymore for one reason or another. I do plan to sell some off though. I can attest that little hobbies do add up to a mountain! Ask my wife!!!!!!
My GI Bill has been exhausted as I used it to finish my BS and my MBA program and that is correct you can not use it for PPL. So basically I know it is what I want but the cost factor of it seems counter productive. I actually thought about doing the discovery flight thing every now and then but it has always been a dream to fly on my own. I dont want to regret not doing it later. I need to think more and smooth things over with the wife. I dont want any remorse later. If I feel it is to cost prohibitive for me to enjoy well then..I guess I walk.
I guess I should clarify...I know it is personally worth it to me as I have always wanted to do it and Im one to stick to my guns to see it through. It is just the cost seems so high...much higher than it was a few years ago, so I was wondering with cost in mind is it something that can still be enjoyable. As far as other hobbies...well that is my problem when concerned with my wife. I have 4 wheelers, I have a jet ski, guns, fishing gear, fishing boat, you know the stuff I have to have but don't ever use them anymore for one reason or another. I do plan to sell some off though. I can attest that little hobbies do add up to a mountain! Ask my wife!!!!!!
My GI Bill has been exhausted as I used it to finish my BS and my MBA program and that is correct you can not use it for PPL. So basically I know it is what I want but the cost factor of it seems counter productive. I actually thought about doing the discovery flight thing every now and then but it has always been a dream to fly on my own. I dont want to regret not doing it later. I need to think more and smooth things over with the wife. I dont want any remorse later. If I feel it is to cost prohibitive for me to enjoy well then..I guess I walk.
amjon
Pilot and A Half (for now
For me, I don't think it was a waste. I don't get to fly that much, but I do enjoy it when I go. I am lucky that I have flight instructors that will fly with me just to go somewhere though, so if I haven't flown in awhile I know they are there. I've had more fun since finishing and have been flying around the state. It has it's costs and I would probably have no debt now if I hadn't spent the money to fly for the past two years, but I think it is worth it.
Hacker15e
Who am I? Where are my pants?
How about this: go buy 2 or 3 instructional flights to see if it's really for you. Either you'll be hooked and it'll be "worth it" to you, or it won't.
There's no way to cost analyze a hobby; either the bug bites you and it's what you want to do, or it's not.
FWIW, nothing in aviation is ever "cost effective"!
There's no way to cost analyze a hobby; either the bug bites you and it's what you want to do, or it's not.
FWIW, nothing in aviation is ever "cost effective"!
drunkenbeagle
Gang Member
Actually, you can tow gliders now for hire with a PPL...
Inverted25
Well-Known Member
Do you actually know anyone doing this though? From what I have heard insurance is higher with private pilots towing
Pietrantonio
Well-Known Member
This is not a diagnosis of asthma. I know this has nothing to do with your question, but this is crap. Here's an abstract you can take a look at http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-2466/11/27. It highlights one of the important aspects of asthma - misdiagnosis. I do not know how the AF handles medical situations, but I would request a formal work-up in a PFT lab with a methacholine challenge test to determine if you ACTUALLY have asthma or not. This disturbes me because you have a dream to fly, and they turned you down because of a cat.
LateStarter
Well-Known Member
Just curious... Do you have Chapter 30 MGIB or Post 911? I believe they changed it with Post 911 to where it will cover the PPL. Something you could possibly check into.
FlyingScot
Spanish Proficient
The question is do you have the time to commit to it now and the $8000? If not it might cost more than $8k if you just dabble along the way to getting your ppl. Do you have $3k a year to keep spending to stay current? If you do not stay current you may end up spending $2-3k one year just to get current (i.e. pass a flight review).
Is you interest in flying worth this much to you then go for it. Don't ever expect to recoup your cost though unless you plan on flight instructing the rest of your life to make up for your cash outlay. Unless you are the rare person that finds a profitable niche, or building flight time to move on the only benefit to instructing is you get to fly an airplane and have someone else pay for it and give you some cash when it done.
Is you interest in flying worth this much to you then go for it. Don't ever expect to recoup your cost though unless you plan on flight instructing the rest of your life to make up for your cash outlay. Unless you are the rare person that finds a profitable niche, or building flight time to move on the only benefit to instructing is you get to fly an airplane and have someone else pay for it and give you some cash when it done.
TopGunn
Well-Known Member
Keep in mind many here including my self did not get into aviation by going through the thought process of "is it really worth it"? My passion and love drove me into this industry and the same love kept me blinded while i spent north of $40K to get all my ratings. I highly doubt if i will be able to recuperate my cost of "investment" with in next 10 years. But one thing you should know, the feeling i get flying airplanes and being in the air is priceless and nothing can ever replace that. You are clearly on the fence. So even if you ever get your PPL, you will never be satisfied. So my suggestion, keep flying your RC's.
ChasenSFO
hen teaser
Do you want to fly airplanes for fun? If the money and time you need to put into it are worth it to you, then go for it. If not, don't. I'm having a blast as a PPL right now, love it! I haven't flown alone in forever, everytime I take different people with me, they always love it. You don't get a PPL because its cheaper than airline travel, it almost never is, you do it because its in your blood, as you have said its in yours. If you want it, go get it!
Nihon_Ni
Well-Known Member
Yes, it's absolutely worth it!!
I started taking flying lessons when I was in high school in 1982. I had a minimum wage job, and a C-150 rented for $42/hr. I had to work for 12.5 hrs at $3.35/hr to afford one hour of flight. Today the minimum wage is $7.25. If a kid worked for 12.5 hrs today he’d earn $90. At my FBO you can rent a C-172 for $90/hr, and I’d think most C-150/152s would go for this price as well. My point is that it’s not really any more expensive now than it was “back in the good old days.” Learning to fly is expensive because you have to fly more often and hire an instructor, but once you have your ticket your hourly rate will go down.
As others have pointed out, flying is an expensive hobby, but the same can be said for many others. I can go spend $100 at the airport while my buddies go to the golf course and spend the same amount. The real difference is that I can do it much quicker. It takes me an hour to fly off $100 but it takes my golfer pals all morning.
To me, flying was something I always wanted to do, so I found a way to afford it. For example, I could take my wife out to eat, even at a modest place like Chilis, and easily spend $50 on dinner, or I could buy groceries and learn to cook and save at least half of that. As I’ve gotten better at cooking, I can now spend an hour or two cooking a meal that would easily run $50/plate for a fraction of the cost. After I do that a couple of times, I’ve saved enough money to rent a plane for an hour. I enjoy cooking, so it’s an easy comparison for me. I’m sure there’s something you currently spend money on that you could restructure and create an airplane rental budget if you want.
If you fly the right airplane, you can do so very economically. I used to own a Grumman Yankee. My wife and I could jump in it with 45 lbs of bags and fly for 7 gallons an hour at 115 kts. I ran car gas in it and there wasn’t much maintenance or other expenses, so it was pretty economical. After owning it for 6 yrs I added up every penny I spent on it (gas, oil, insurance, paint, repairs, charts, tie-down, etc.) and divided by the hours it flew, and it came out to $22/hr. That was with gas prices about $1.50/gal, so it would be more today, but it would still be economical. I got about 20 miles to the gallon in cruise flight, so it was almost as efficient as my wife’s Ford Explorer, which is the vehicle we’d travel in when we didn’t fly. We lived in NC and our family was in OH, so driving was either an all-day 13 hr journey, or we’d get started after work on Friday and stop at a hotel for the night. When we flew we could shorten the trip by 100 miles and because we were going almost twice as fast as a car we could make the trip in 4 hrs. In that case, flying was cheaper (in both time and money) than driving. I used my hobby to travel extensively. We flew all over the eastern part of the US: Maine, Florida, Wisconsin, all around the Carolinas and Virginias and of course to Ohio. We visited friends and family, took vacation, or just went out for lunch or breakfast. (Lots of small airports have pancake breakfasts.) Before my wife learned to fly she always wanted to go somewhere when we flew, so we traveled all over. It was cheap enough that I never once thought about how much it would cost me to fly somewhere. Because it was so economical, I never had to think about the price, when I felt like flying I went.
There are planes out there that offer the same economy, you just have to really evaluate what kind of flying you will do and don’t confuse your needs with your wants. Start small and see where it goes from there. You may want to consider an ultralight. You may need to buy one in order to make this work, but it’s definitely a way to get in the air for a few gallons an hour and not much other expense. I just checked Trade-a-Plane and there’s a few listings there for ultralights between $4-13K. Or you could get an experimental airplane, like a Bowers Fly Baby for about $10K. http://www.bowersflybaby.com/forsale/index.html
I started taking flying lessons when I was in high school in 1982. I had a minimum wage job, and a C-150 rented for $42/hr. I had to work for 12.5 hrs at $3.35/hr to afford one hour of flight. Today the minimum wage is $7.25. If a kid worked for 12.5 hrs today he’d earn $90. At my FBO you can rent a C-172 for $90/hr, and I’d think most C-150/152s would go for this price as well. My point is that it’s not really any more expensive now than it was “back in the good old days.” Learning to fly is expensive because you have to fly more often and hire an instructor, but once you have your ticket your hourly rate will go down.
As others have pointed out, flying is an expensive hobby, but the same can be said for many others. I can go spend $100 at the airport while my buddies go to the golf course and spend the same amount. The real difference is that I can do it much quicker. It takes me an hour to fly off $100 but it takes my golfer pals all morning.
To me, flying was something I always wanted to do, so I found a way to afford it. For example, I could take my wife out to eat, even at a modest place like Chilis, and easily spend $50 on dinner, or I could buy groceries and learn to cook and save at least half of that. As I’ve gotten better at cooking, I can now spend an hour or two cooking a meal that would easily run $50/plate for a fraction of the cost. After I do that a couple of times, I’ve saved enough money to rent a plane for an hour. I enjoy cooking, so it’s an easy comparison for me. I’m sure there’s something you currently spend money on that you could restructure and create an airplane rental budget if you want.
If you fly the right airplane, you can do so very economically. I used to own a Grumman Yankee. My wife and I could jump in it with 45 lbs of bags and fly for 7 gallons an hour at 115 kts. I ran car gas in it and there wasn’t much maintenance or other expenses, so it was pretty economical. After owning it for 6 yrs I added up every penny I spent on it (gas, oil, insurance, paint, repairs, charts, tie-down, etc.) and divided by the hours it flew, and it came out to $22/hr. That was with gas prices about $1.50/gal, so it would be more today, but it would still be economical. I got about 20 miles to the gallon in cruise flight, so it was almost as efficient as my wife’s Ford Explorer, which is the vehicle we’d travel in when we didn’t fly. We lived in NC and our family was in OH, so driving was either an all-day 13 hr journey, or we’d get started after work on Friday and stop at a hotel for the night. When we flew we could shorten the trip by 100 miles and because we were going almost twice as fast as a car we could make the trip in 4 hrs. In that case, flying was cheaper (in both time and money) than driving. I used my hobby to travel extensively. We flew all over the eastern part of the US: Maine, Florida, Wisconsin, all around the Carolinas and Virginias and of course to Ohio. We visited friends and family, took vacation, or just went out for lunch or breakfast. (Lots of small airports have pancake breakfasts.) Before my wife learned to fly she always wanted to go somewhere when we flew, so we traveled all over. It was cheap enough that I never once thought about how much it would cost me to fly somewhere. Because it was so economical, I never had to think about the price, when I felt like flying I went.
There are planes out there that offer the same economy, you just have to really evaluate what kind of flying you will do and don’t confuse your needs with your wants. Start small and see where it goes from there. You may want to consider an ultralight. You may need to buy one in order to make this work, but it’s definitely a way to get in the air for a few gallons an hour and not much other expense. I just checked Trade-a-Plane and there’s a few listings there for ultralights between $4-13K. Or you could get an experimental airplane, like a Bowers Fly Baby for about $10K. http://www.bowersflybaby.com/forsale/index.html
erice
Well-Known Member
Here is my story.
Flying was always a dream of mine, ever since I can remember. I always thought I would solo before I got my driver's license. But my family moved from an area where could conveniently be able to learn to fly, and the opportunity never really presented itself later. I went into secondary education.
Fast forward to my early 40s. I work and live about a mile from an airport with a flight program. I realized that (1) Flying is not getting any cheaper, and (2) I am not getting any younger. So I went for it, and for the past 6 years, have had no regrets. My family is supportive, but they don't have the same passion for aviation that I do. I have continued through my instrument rating, and am approaching the commercial certificate, mostly because I always want to be learning more. I may never fly for a living, but it at least opens more options in life, and having options is good.
My advice to you is to go for it!
Flying was always a dream of mine, ever since I can remember. I always thought I would solo before I got my driver's license. But my family moved from an area where could conveniently be able to learn to fly, and the opportunity never really presented itself later. I went into secondary education.
Fast forward to my early 40s. I work and live about a mile from an airport with a flight program. I realized that (1) Flying is not getting any cheaper, and (2) I am not getting any younger. So I went for it, and for the past 6 years, have had no regrets. My family is supportive, but they don't have the same passion for aviation that I do. I have continued through my instrument rating, and am approaching the commercial certificate, mostly because I always want to be learning more. I may never fly for a living, but it at least opens more options in life, and having options is good.
My advice to you is to go for it!
drunkenbeagle
Gang Member
Well, you legally need at least 100 hours, and insurance will want at least 200, so no - you really aren't going to start making any money before you would have had an C-ASEL anyways. It isn't a legal thing though.
And your probably aren't going to end up towing without already having a Comm Glider/CFI-G.
Inverted25
Well-Known Member
We actually have two tow pilots here who dont glider licenses. They just do their mandatory flights in a glider each year. Under costellos new plan we dropped our tailwheel requirement to 50 hours but our total time requirement is still 500
I_Money
Moderator
It is a very personal decision - to me the cost just makes it not worth it. If I was flying and paying $200 a week I would think what am I doing. Yes I have thought about maybe doing some hang gliding or ultralight flying as that is in my price range where the enjoyment will be there. Right now I am taking up piano as my new hobby and am very excited. Not quite like flying, but is awesome.
stesta5074
Well-Known Member
Forget renting and look for a flying club or a partial ownership situation. I don't make much money and I can still afford to be in a 10 member club.
Piper Archer II, 55 bucks a month, $38/ hour tach dry. We split "big ticket" items every few months like the new ELT: $40 / member. The 38$ covers the engine and a maintenance reserve.
If I could go back, I would have simply joined a flying club in the first place, and forgotten about renting all together. FBO's make money on the fuel, and they have to pay huge insurance. Google different clubs in your area, you will be able to afford it more easily.
Another of my friends found a person at MYF who rents his 172 six cylinder STC for 80/tach hour wet. There are deals everywhere. Don't let professionals on this board poo-poo your dreams. Hit the tarmac, and start asking around all your local airports. I am SURE something will turn up!
Piper Archer II, 55 bucks a month, $38/ hour tach dry. We split "big ticket" items every few months like the new ELT: $40 / member. The 38$ covers the engine and a maintenance reserve.
If I could go back, I would have simply joined a flying club in the first place, and forgotten about renting all together. FBO's make money on the fuel, and they have to pay huge insurance. Google different clubs in your area, you will be able to afford it more easily.
Another of my friends found a person at MYF who rents his 172 six cylinder STC for 80/tach hour wet. There are deals everywhere. Don't let professionals on this board poo-poo your dreams. Hit the tarmac, and start asking around all your local airports. I am SURE something will turn up!