"I'm not interested in the airlines"

CzechAirman said:
I'm glad I don't work for an "airline". I work for a global logistics company that is perpetually profitable and successful. Your dreams of flying widebodies to exotic locales, having a great QOL while Captains make $300,000.00+ are real here. While we are not hiring at the moment, our entry level aircraft is the 747-400 and current second year pay is in excess of $150,000.00. So, while the passenger carriers futures look bleak, there are a few non-pax carriers where the dreams that got you interested in flying in the first place, can still come true.
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I call dibs when you guys start hiring again.
 
Next month is the 20th year since my first flight lesson. I sit here at my 2nd Part 121 job, but it was never a goal.

If you had asked 16-year old me if I would ever be an airline pilot, "No way". I did everything I could to prepare myself for other types of flying than airline flying. I was learning all about the corporate world and the path to get to there.

Then I got kicked out to the real world. It was an odd time, because times were changing. The hiring crack was just happening in 121. CFI jobs, 135 gigs, corporate gigs wouldn't take a look at me. A crappy little 121 operation did give me a look though. When you're hungry and have no where to live, you take what you can get.

I went into that job with the idea to get enough total time to go find a good 135 PIC or corporate job. Well, 9/11 happened before I had left, and the industry was again in shambles.

Next thing I know, it's 9 years later, and it's time to move on. By this time, the friends I had were scattered to all corners flying airplanes for a living. Some had great connections and got onto majors. Most got furloughed. A couple went corporate, and were jumping job to job coming up the corporate ranks (one of which is a member of this site, and now works at a Large Simulator company).

I'd realized that I'd adapted my life to the "121 Lifestyle", I'd gotten married when I was doing this type of flying and had our first child. Maybe it was a transcendental moment or something, but I'd realized that my "normal" was that kind of life. We had balanced our lives around the 121 life, for better or worse, with all of its peculiarities.

Maybe I'm just rambling and the point I have in my grey matter didn't get across, so I'll just type it out: Flying professionally, so much is out of your hands. You really have to go with the shifting sands of the industry, and carve out the best career you can. You will sacrifice for the job, so I don't see a reason to have self-induced suffering. Find a job track that suits your needs as best you can. Is it a lower paying, more days off job? Is it a higher paying, fewer days off? Maybe you'll be one of the lucky ones that gets the space shuttle ride to the top tier job of your dreams. In any case, enjoy the journey. The road ends, but no one knows where or how.

As for adapting to one lifestyle or another, like many of us, I have seen those that try to form the job to their lifestyle fail miserably; where those that form their lifestyle to the schedules of the job, regardless of industry segment, seem very happy.

That being said, I'm mid-career here, and have no guarantees of my job being here in another 5 years. Even so, I don't think I'd give up moving metal for a living for a cube farm job.
 
When I was actively flying part 91 and 137 work, I routinely thought that 135 cargo and 121 flying wasn't for me. I was happy where I was in life. When my personal world was wrecked while working in the 91/137 field, I had the opportunity to fly 135 cargo and said goodbye. I gave up great QoL. Before the 135 world, I was working an average of 6 month out of the year. I knew I would be home for every holiday, including small ones like Mother's Day (big one for me). I walked away because even though the money was good and the time off was great, I couldn't stand not knowing what was coming next year. There was no seniority system, there was no job protection, it was year to year and that was as good as it was every going to get.

My first 135 job gave me excellent QoL to start off with, but that all changed when I met the woman who is now my wife. I stayed in 135 cargo, but with a different company and base. I made the move to spend more time with my future wife, but ended up with a worse QoL and sometimes saw her less than I did when I was with my previous 135 carrier. It was actually my wife who wanted me to look into 121 flying. When I got the phone call for a class date, I remember thinking to myself that I would have never thought I would work for any airline as little as 3 years ago. It just wasn't what I wanted.

I have now been flying 121 for 4 years now. Yes, there have been ups and downs, but overall the job has given me something that was lacking from the 135 cargo world - stability and good QoL. Even as a junior FO, I have spent more time with my wife and our families than when I was flying 135 cargo. I enjoy the 121 side of flying. It's safe and predictable. If I want to fly, I fly... if not, the autopilot can take care of business. I'm happy with where I am in life right now.

I never would have thought that I would care for flying for the airlines, but now that I have been doing it for several years, we have built our lives around the 121 world.

For those that say that the airlines are not for them... don't knock it until you try it. It is a totally different world.


I wonder how many would be jumping at the airlines if the only thing to change was an increase in pay? (current 121 QoL remains the same)
 
Personally, there's no place else that I'd rather be than where I am right now. I like the people I work with, the opportunity to do darned near anything and the "relative calm" right now. Of course that's all privy to change, but I like knowing exactly what my schedule is this month. I enjoy interfacing with passengers when the situation calls for it and have no problem with working with ten other crew members.

It is what it is, I have an ego disconnect between my profession and Doog Tyler so I don't get too bent out of shape.
 
ctab5060X said:
I wonder how many would be jumping at the airlines if the only thing to change was an increase in pay? (current 121 QoL remains the same)
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I would. All I want is to be paid well with a QOL that is acceptable to me. Most 121 QOL works for me, but the pay at the regionals is far far below what I'm willing to work for. Even 2 and 3 year FO pay is too low.
 
I always said growing up that I'd never go to the airlines. I thought I'd go military then corporate, being too short for the AF, that plan fell through and somehow I stumbled into the 121 world. Just short of one year into the job, I've come to appreciate the things that I used to rag airlines about; as Jtrain said, it's easy and predictable.

I do like my 121 job; but part of me still wants to do something more ''exciting". I've got dreams of one day flying for CBP, random jobs like Swisspilot's, or the right corporate gig.

But, when I was hired, I was the youngest pilot at the company; in an industry where seniority is everything, I can't help but wonder if I stay 121, where will I be 43 years from now when it's time to retire?

Just goin with the flow I guess...
 
The other note I will say is life is too short to not take risks and live your life. "Shoulda coulda wouldas" plague a lot of pilots.
 
I guess the adage of "go scare yourself every once in a while" is one way to look at it.
 
I'm not terribly intersted either. The idea of flying Air Ambulance in a King Air is much more appealing to me than sitting right seat in a CRJ. I'd do it if it were the only option at the time, but definately not my first choice.
 
Doug Taylor said:
I guess the adage of "go scare yourself every once in a while" is one way to look at it.
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We talked about that in recurrent this week. We came to the conclusion that about every 800 hours something happens out on the line that scares you. Would anyone else agree, or am I just not very good at this?
 
Adler said:
But, when I was hired, I was the youngest pilot at the company; in an industry where seniority is everything, I can't help but wonder if I stay 121, where will I be 43 years from now when it's time to retire?
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You'll be a super senior captain with me at 9E complaining about new hire FOs and talking about the way is was in the 'Good Old Days' ;D
 
Screaming_Emu said:
We talked about that in recurrent this week. We came to the conclusion that about every 800 hours something happens out on the line that scares you. Would anyone else agree, or am I just not very good at this?
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Depends. For me, that would be once every 2 years or so with how much I fly.

I think it depends more on how exposed you are. Statistically speaking, you are more likely to have something happen if you fly 800 hours a years vs 200 hours a year.

However, if you are in a situation that you find uncomfortable/scares the crap out of you and you handle it like a professional and learn from the experience... that is not a bad thing.
 
I've never really wanted to be an airline pilot but I will do it if the opportunity is there. I would prefer corporate, or even bush flying though. A King Air just sounds more fun to fly than a CRJ200.

If I do go to a regional airline after school, I don't intend to make my whole career out of flying for the airlines. There's just too many fun types of flying out there to spend all of my time flying the same routes for marginal pay ;)
 
My goals: time off and money. As much as corporate row might fit my personality, I still feel the majors will accomplish my goals the best.
If I do end up in corporate row OMA or the majors, I'll consider it a success with no regrets on routing.
 
I think too many people try to find their "perfect match".

Which doesn't exist.

Our (some of our) parents and teachers lied to us about ultimate life satisfaction being gleaned through employment.
 
Doug Taylor said:
Our (some of our) parents and teachers lied to us about ultimate life satisfaction being gleaned through employment.
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Thank you. I kinda don't want to end up at a major airline. Not that it'd be a bad place to be, but it'd mean I failed in breaking out on my own. Not everyone wants to work for themselves, but it's been a goal of mine since college.
 
Never personally had any interest in an airline gig. I never wanted to be a CFI either, but spending enough time around aviation, I kind of stumbled into it.

I would work at an airline, if the pay would be comparable to what I can make working for myself, or working for someone else doing computer stuff. Basically, anything that would give me 10 days/month home and 150K+ within 2 years. Should such an opportunity present itself, yeah, I guess I would be all over it. But I ain't holding my breath.

Sad state of affairs, I would probably take an airline gig if I could schedule it around the "side job." the side jobs pays about 8x what a regional would. When I actually looked into that, I learned I would make more and have a more flexible schedule as an FA.

I know folks that have left jobs at majors to do what I do, none of them seem to miss it. And for what it is worth, the few aviation gigs that I have been qualified for, and would likely get, all paid far better than a regional with far better QOL (not better than what I do now, but much better than airlines)
 
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