Icing-What do you do?

troopernflight

troopernflight

Well-Known Member
When you have a storm to get through and there is a section showing pink (mixed precip), obviously this can present extemely dangerous icing conditions. What process of decision making do you use to determine what altitude you need to be at in order to safely cross this border area and either get into the straight snow, or into the rain side? BTW, this is in a FIKI aircraft!
 
I eat the icing first then the cupcake.


Seriously though. I would base my judgement on other resources such as winds aloft for temps, PIREPS, ect. Looking at all resources will give you a good overall picture of what is happening and you can plan accordingly.
 
I'm by no means an icing expert (I'll save that title/honor for my freight dog brothers), but if I'm icing and I know it's clear air above me, I'll climb. If not, I will descent. Tell ATC instead of asking if it is serious. Don't dilly dally around thinking "maybe this will pass", it will get worse before it gets better, and depending on how bad, it may not get better. Ice is one thing that still sends a chill up my spine....that and big CB's
 
Most people like to climb out of ice rather than descend if they are able. More options are available that way. Some interesting stuff is that you can fly around in "icing conditions" all day long and not see one crystal of ice form on your aircraft.
 
This winter has been nice so far, only had to get deiced once!

Depends on what I am flying. Some of my stuff does a little better than the other.
 
I second the idea of going higher first. Typically, one can climb to colder temps that wayang get out of the ice all together. Once at higher altitudes you have more available options. I'd much rather descend through ice rather than climb through it.
 
The pink area on the radar represents surface conditions. The temp at altitude, even low altitides, can be a lot different. You will need to consult other WX reports to develop a solid icing strategy. Start with the winds aloft.
 
The main thing that scares me about icing is the unpredictability of it. Even after the exhaustive testing and research on the topic, they still can't definitively say, "you will pick up ice when the sat is x degrees and the rat is x degrees, and the severity of that ice is predicated on x atmospheric conditions as pictured in this handy little graphic". Just when I think I have it figured out what I'm running into, mother nature throws me a curve ball. Even though I'm yet to be presented with a situation in which the aircraft couldn't handle the conditions and required immediate action, I still shudder at the thought of it. I guess experience is the best way to learn how to put all of your resources together, and hopefully arrive at a safe and uneventful conclusion to the flight.
 
Maurus said:
Most people like to climb out of ice rather than descend if they are able. More options are available that way. Some interesting stuff is that you can fly around in "icing conditions" all day long and not see one crystal of ice form on your aircraft.
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Important point. WX man can only tell you that conditions favor icing, PIREP (or looking out at your wings) is the only way to know for sure. It's tricky stuff that is very localized in a lot of cases. That being said, I hear "icing" and I work to find a way around it. They don't pay me enough to test it out on my own without anti-ice gear
 
Unfortunately with ice you will run into a situation where good planning wasn't enough. Someone has to be the first to find "severe" icing to get the PIREP up. Best you can do is be vigilant when in icing conditions and have some sort of "out" ready.
 
Ice is ice, and it is where you find it. That said, my first instinct in most airplanes is set a speed that'll be my decision speed, then try to.figure out the best way out of it. If you get out of it before you slow to that speed -that great, if not then climb or descend as appropriate. 9/10 times I'll be climbing to clear it if the weather is cold enough where you can't get below the freezing level. Generally speaking ice is a non-event provided you think. What speed you pick to act depends on the severity, and also on the weather in the region. FZRA usually means instant action, as does almost any icing in a caravan.
 
Maurus said:
Most people like to climb out of ice rather than descend if they are able.
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This. Get as high as you can while you can.

But also it depends on the airplane and the situation. I like ppragmans idea of setting a limit. I always think of bad icing sort of like starting an invisible timer. At some point you are going to be screwed and you dont know how long from now that will be.
 
The only thing you need to know is whether you have an escape route. 0 or above air. An escape route that gets you to the destination is above freezing temperatures at the minimum vectoring altitude. If not, you'll need sky clear below the minimum vectoring altitude so you can cancel IFR and go scud running in warm air until the ice melts off: you get to your destination VFR below the clouds, or you can climb back up with a clean air frame and try again.

Climbing is always a good first option. Much nasty weather, including freezing rain and fronts moving around still have sky clear above 8-10,000 feet. If you don't make the climb and get on top before requiring oxygen, at least you've had time to think and prepare options, like execute an instrument approach to an airport enroute just to get below the vectoring altitude and spend some time in (hopefully!) warm air to clear the ice. If you break out from an approach with fair visibility, consider following an interstate or stay below clouds to make it to the destination as long as it can be done VFR.

The rule of thumb that icing is less prevalent 3000' above or below is valid: the most severe accumulation happens with extreme amounts of large freezing droplets (or just dense moisture), at temperatures between 0 and -4. Below -5 it is usually rime icing which accumulates on surfaces you can control. So climbing into colder temperatures is also a partial escape route.

If you have no warm air anywhere it usually indicates your weather is too cold to have freezing rain, mixed or clear (water) icing. If it is just snow or rime icing, no worries. But if there's mixing of freezing and warm air masses and you're flying through it with no warm air at any altitude you can get to, it is best to turn around and try another day. I sometimes give it a shot to see if climbing through the icing conditions will be possible (because weather forecasts for icing are so hit-or-miss, but dispatch won't hear of any cancellations!): I ask to get vectors for a downwind departure; attempt to climb through the icing layer, if I succeed I go on my way, but if the wing just turns to an ice cube and a waterfall of freezing rain renders the climb rate 0, I'm in a position to turn right around to the final approach fix if it doesn't work out. Only had to do that once, so 97% of the time it works out better than expected.
 
Romulus said:
This. Get as high as you can while you can.

But also it depends on the airplane and the situation. I like ppragmans idea of setting a limit. I always think of bad icing sort of like starting an invisible timer. At some point you are going to be screwed and you dont know how long from now that will be.
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As my grandfather put it: "Climb. If you don't, you'll be descending soon anyway."
 
Another thing is IF you can climb.. ie. prop driven planes. sometimes you just don't have the power that would be required to get high enough to get out of a bad system...in this case if up is impossible, down is impossible, and circumventing doesn't seem likely..why not turn around? if you flew into the system, then behind you is usually a guaranteed way out.
 
I like http://www.aviationweather.gov/adds/icing/icingnav , you can select different altitudes and see how much icing is at that particular altitude. Also a great way to see the tops. Seems to be really accurate.

Yesterday I heard reports of moderate and severe icing in Jackson hole all day, yet nothing (very little) was on the nexrad or ground based radar in that area. Not a big fan of radar to determine icing conditions
 
Fly_Unity said:
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Yesterday I heard reports of moderate and severe icing in Jackson hole all day, yet nothing (very little) was on the nexrad or ground based radar in that area. Not a big fan of radar to determine icing conditions
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Can't say I'm familiar with using radar in relation to determining icing conditions - can you point me to some info on that?
 
SteveC said:
Can't say I'm familiar with using radar in relation to determining icing conditions - can you point me to some info on that?
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You can see the precip returns on the snow bands. Not as accurate as being in the airplane and getting ice, because generally you don't know if there's ice there. But as a general rule of thumb, if you're passing through some snow bands, or rain and you're in the middle of the winter, you may see ice.

At least that's how I've always viewed it, because snow might not mean ice at all.
 
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