HELP!

It's incredibly rare. Flight schools, even "mom and pop" ones know that they aren't allowed to trash a pilot to a prospective employer.

PRIA is the most relevant law in our situations, but other fields generally follow the same rules. Enough case law is on the books now that HR departments at even the smallest companies know that you can get hammered for libel or slander for saying anything more than verification of employment.
 
Capt. Caucasian said:
PRIA (Pilot Records Improvement Act)

dcramer16,

First off, airlines do not call the previous employer. There is a form that is sent from them to fill out. If the previous employer submits info that is not asked for then, the prospective airline is required to tell the employee. Like I said, there have been many successful lawsuits concerning this. This is stuff that is taken very seriously.
Click to expand...

I filled out a few of these when I was the GM of an FBO about flight instructors that went on to bigger and better. I remember there being a checkmark asking if the person is eligible for rehire, which is an underhanded way of asking if they were terminated.

Also, any military or police hiring board will ask all of your past employers very in depth information about your work history, including job performance.

Also, the PRIA states this:

1 Training records, including initial and recurrent training records.

2 Qualifications, proficiency, or professional competence of the individual, including comments and evaluations made by a check airman designated under sections 14 CFR Parts 121.411, 125.295, or 135.337. Examples include:

• Documents that show the individual’s qualifications as instructor/evaluator, check airman, or examiner.

• Records of the individual’s proficiency checks, recurring checks for Captain, First Officer. Or Line Checks.

• Records of any disciplinary action taken with respect to the individual that was not subsequently overturned; and

• Any release from employment or resignation, termination, or disqualification of the individual with respect to employment.

(c) Disciplinary Actions that are unrelated to a termination or release from employment, and have been imposed on a pilot by the employer, should only be reported if they involve the individual’s performance as a pilot, and have not been subsequently overturned. Other employment related actions that have nothing to do with the pilot’s flight duties resulting in a disciplinary action, but not discharge or termination, should not be reported.

(d) Release From Employment Records. Disciplinary actions, including those that do not involve performance as a pilot, must be reported if they played any role in the current or future termination, or release from employment of the pilot.
Click to expand...

Sounds like they are perfectly within their rights to mention this, even though I don't believe the PRIA even applies to flight schools.
 
swisspilot said:
Next time just ask the CP if it's ok to go to an other airport for that flight, at my old 141 school we would fly to airports outside the approved list all the time, just make sure they know you are doing it, as long as not the entire fleet does it should be fine..I don't think that list has nothing to do with the FAA or any regulation. For a dual flight I don't think my school ever said no..maybe for a solo..
Click to expand...
That MAY be completely wrong. It all depends on where the list is located. If said list is in your school's FAA-approved TCO, it IS LEGALLY BINDING. Everything in that FAA approved TCO is legally binding on 141 flights. Just like a 121 or 135 OPSPEC.

Now, if that list of "approved airports" is not located or referenced in the TCO, but rather posted on the wall of the hangar, well, as long as the airport meets the requirements of 141.38 you can go there all you want.
 
mojo6911 said:
I filled out a few of these when I was the GM of an FBO about flight instructors that went on to bigger and better. I remember there being a checkmark asking if the person is eligible for rehire, which is an underhanded way of asking if they were terminated.

Also, any military or police hiring board will ask all of your past employers very in depth information about your work history, including job performance.

Also, the PRIA states this:



Sounds like they are perfectly within their rights to mention this, even though I don't believe the PRIA even applies to flight schools.
Click to expand...

You're wasting your time just looking at the text of the Act. That stopped being relevant the very first time a case was brought to court. Now what matters is case law. The way courts apply the law is usually very different than you would expect them to based upon the pure language. In this case, courts have been very strict in applying standards that, generally, only safety of flight issues and training failures are to be reported on PRIA checks. Violations of company policy have pretty much been ruled out.

And like I said, general libel and slander laws also come into play when civil suits get filed.
 
All that Mesa Airlines sends back on a PRIA request is a printout of your training history (usually less than 1 page, just dates and courses taken) and employment dates. I figure most airlines are the same.
 
Roger said:
That MAY be completely wrong. It all depends on where the list is located. If said list is in your school's FAA-approved TCO, it IS LEGALLY BINDING. Everything in that FAA approved TCO is legally binding on 141 flights. Just like a 121 or 135 OPSPEC.

Now, if that list of "approved airports" is not located or referenced in the TCO, but rather posted on the wall of the hangar, well, as long as the airport meets the requirements of 141.38 you can go there all you want.
Click to expand...

They are listed in the "Flight Training Regulations" of the school, which is the same for 141 and 61....
 
ATN_Pilot said:
You're wasting your time just looking at the text of the Act. That stopped being relevant the very first time a case was brought to court. Now what matters is case law. The way courts apply the law is usually very different than you would expect them to based upon the pure language. In this case, courts have been very strict in applying standards that, generally, only safety of flight issues and training failures are to be reported on PRIA checks. Violations of company policy have pretty much been ruled out.

And like I said, general libel and slander laws also come into play when civil suits get filed.
Click to expand...
POP, very sorry to hear of your situation. Any desent employer would have given you a warning first before just etting you go, unless it was a safety or criminal issue, which this was not. I was hoping something positive was going to come out of your talk with the CEO.

On a side note about PRIA, My first employer gave me a very bad employer referal when I applied for the Navy Reserves. The recuiter was like "what the hell is that about?" because all my other employers gave me shining referals. They mentioned I had poor leadership skills and did not work well with others, etc. The funny thing is right before I resigned, they gave me a pay raise and told me I was on the fast track to become a check airman. They were pissed because I quite, period. I wish I knew about PRIA back then!
 
I went to a part 141 school and we had "approved airports" for specific XC's. I think one of my friends went to an "approved airport" for a different lesson and they made him refly the XC going to one of the airports on the list for that specific lesson.

Regardless, good luck.....Its a tough time out there, but if you have your instructor ratings and enough motivation you can always find someone who has an airplane you can use and there are still plenty of students out there. Its just a matter of finding them.
 
I really disliked 141 training programs! They are far too restrictive. Thats one of the reasons I chose to not train at the university when I was instructing. I didn't enjoy training there and I knew I wouldn't have enjoyed instructing there!

Do you have any leads on a new gig?
 
KLB said:
I really disliked 141 training programs! They are far too restrictive. Thats one of the reasons I chose to not train at the university when I was instructing. I didn't enjoy training there and I knew I wouldn't have enjoyed instructing there!

Do you have any leads on a new gig?
Click to expand...
Good point...Pt61 is much more liberating and you have control of how to train your students. However, if you plan on advancing your career then you must get used to following company policy sooner or later because as you move up the rules only become more restrictive.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top