flightinfo.com

TonyC said:
That's your opinion.


Other people have 'em, too.
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Actually it's a fact.

I did a little science experiment.

I said "with you" and then "good day"

They both take the exact same amount of time, even when you shorten them to "with ya" and "g'day".

Not liking "with you" because it "clogs the frequency" is stupid as it's not the only banter that does it. Not liking it for not being standard phraseology would make much more sense.
 
I don't think it has anything to do with "time" on the freq, but I avoid "with you" because I know for a fact that a lot of controllers have a pet peeve about it. That's enough for me!
 
Chris_Ford said:
Actually it's a fact.
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NO, it's your opinion.


Let's review:

Chris_Ford: "... to call it out for "taking up time" is fallacious."

TonyC: "That's your opinion."



Now, at least we'll focus on what we're talking about.

Doing an experiment to determine how long it takes to say something is meaningless. If it takes more than ZERO time, and it is non-standard, then it can be considered to take up time that is not necessary.


Your claim that such a view is fallacious is YOUR OPINION!




I swore I'd never post at FlightInfo again, and here I am... ooops, never mind, I'm at jetcareers.




Chris_Ford said:
Not liking "with you" because it "clogs the frequency" is stupid as it's not the only banter that does it.
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There's another opinion.


:)




.
 
TonyC said:
NO, it's your opinion.


Let's review:

Chris_Ford: "... to call it out for "taking up time" is fallacious."

TonyC: "That's your opinion."



Now, at least we'll focus on what we're talking about.

Doing an experiment to determine how long it takes to say something is meaningless. If it takes more than ZERO time, and it is non-standard, then it can be considered to take up time that is not necessary.
Click to expand...

So then you also hate it when people say "Good day" right? And you also hate when people mispronounce 3 as "three" rather than "tree"? My point is that one cannot call out the "with you" crowd but look the other way on the other nonstandard communications. Especially on the grounds that it takes up much needed frequency time, when common statements like "good day" take the same amount of time.

Your claim that such a view is fallacious is YOUR OPINION!
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[URL="http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/fallacy" said:
http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/fallacy[/URL]]
3 : an often plausible argument using false or invalid inference
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Given: Person A posts on flightinfo stating that "With You" is a waste of time
original fi.com post (emphasis added) said:
Guys, quit the student pilot "with you" when talking to controllers. It's redundant and a waste of time and makes you sound like a student pilot. They KNOW you are "with" them by the mere fact you are talking to them. It's goofy and a waste of time.
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Given: Person A does not say anything in regards to nonstandard communication (simply citing it as redundant)

Given: It takes just as long to say "Good day" as "with you"

Therefore: "With you" is no more of a timewaster than "good day".

Did I dumb it down enough for you to understand?


I swore I'd never post at FlightInfo again, and here I am... ooops, never mind, I'm at jetcareers.
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Yeah if this was flightinfo, I'd call you a self-serving egomaniacal prick who has never made a mistake in his life, but it's JC, and I do like you (despite what that last sentence may lead you to believe)
 
I have heard controllers use "non-standard" phrases before so its not just pilots that do it. Some times i say "o" insted of zero but they know what I mean and if there is any question they ask. Pilots should be smart enough to ask when to are not sure about something that been said.

As for the "with you" give me a break, alot of us say it, i know i do and dont think about it.
 
seagull said:
I don't think it has anything to do with "time" on the freq, but I avoid "with you" because I know for a fact that a lot of controllers have a pet peeve about it. That's enough for me!
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there's the tampa approach dude who replies to all of them with "ok, i'm with you too". even better are the "checkin in with you"s
 
Chris_Ford said:
Given: Person A posts on flightinfo stating that "With You" is a waste of time


Given: Person A does not say anything in regards to nonstandard communication (simply citing it as redundant)

Given: It takes just as long to say "Good day" as "with you"

Therefore: "With you" is no more of a timewaster than "good day".

Did I dumb it down enough for you to understand?
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Considering that the first two givens have nothing to do with the Conclusion, and the conclusion is simply the third given restated, yeah, I'll have to say it's pretty dumb. :)



I'll even concede that your conclusion is a fact.




You have not proven that it is a fallacy to critique "with you" as being a time waster.


If you break one rule, does that make it OK to break them all? Of course not.

If you try to obey one rule, is your attempt in vain because you have violated another? No, it is not.

Perhaps you thought the guy's point was silly - - and I might agree with you. It seems a bit trivial to me. Just the same, he's entitled to his opinion on the matter, and you're entitled to yours. His failure to list all other non-standard radio calls that take up time does not prevent him from mentioning this one.

You've got your priorities, and he's got his -- don't sweat the little stuff.







.
 
Texasspilot said:
ahh this is starting feel like FI already!
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pop your head into any thread that Chris_Ford is taking part in, there seems to be a correlation between him posting and my brain cells dying.
 
Dear god, even a thread about FI has gone bad. Who'da thunk?

Personally, the "with you" thing is a pet peeve of mine, but nothing I'm gonna pop a blood vessel over like some guys. Flightinfo does have some good information once you get past the "all regional pilots are route thieves", "XXX stole our flying", "XXX regional sucks, you should fly at YYYY", etc, etc, infinity. It takes about three posts for a thread to get ruined over there. I'm registered, but I've never posted. Once they figure out I fly for PCL, my opinion instantly becomes worthless because I either stole flying or daddy bought my job.....
 
I still think it's crazy that FI now charges $10 for new applicants. I guess they either need money or want only serious people to join? Either way, it's going to turn off a lot of people.
 
AlexF said:
I still think it's crazy that FI now charges $10 for new applicants. I guess they either need money or want only serious people to join? Either way, it's going to turn off a lot of people.
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I don't know why they need to charge they have every manner of aviation ad on the planet running on the site!
 
The 10bucks is for new members joining. I guess that's why they stopped taking in new members a few days prior to that.
 
AlexF said:
I still think it's crazy that FI now charges $10 for new applicants. I guess they either need money or want only serious people to join? Either way, it's going to turn off a lot of people.
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If anything, it will stop actual pilots from joining. It sure ain't gonna stop the kids. Look at A.net.
 
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