Embarasssing ALPA Magazine Blunder

JaceTheAce said:
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I see what you did there, but I'm missing the funny.
 
Did Martins actually pass a bar exam? :) And not the one with the Jaegermeister plopped atop it?
 
I'm not defending either one, but both met all the requirements. The only difference is that one (or maybe both) are blatant liars, and the other was voted in.
 
Doug Taylor said:
Did Martins actually pass a bar exam? :) And not the one with the Jaegermeister plopped atop it?
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You know, I dont know the whole story behind catch me if you can, but if Abignale actually passed the bar exam, then more power to him. You could probably argue that all the time in the cockpit made him more experienced than some of the wonder pilots we have now days.
 
Is it embarrassing to ALPA - sure. Is it embarrassing to the profession - sure.

I never miss an opportunity to argue with Todd, and he IS a little too much on the "ALPA can do no wrong" bandwagon - but seriously - the NY Times had a plagiarist working for them. How many scandals has the NY Times had over the last 5 years? And their primary job is to publish news. Yes, ALPA got fooled on this, but I think that people generally don't expect to be lied to (particularly if they are honest) and the fact that the people involved in writing the piece probably hold pilots in high regard also worked against them in this situation. I believe one aspect of this error was a complacency brought on by a certain measure of deference and respect to the profession maybe. I would not be ready to burn this Jan person at the stake yet. Yet.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
Jan Steenblick is not a reporter.


I haven't "called you names." I've merely pointed out the hypocrisy that is so common in airline pilots. We demand due process for ourselves whenever we get in some sort of trouble, but we're lightning-fast to be judge, jury, and executioner whenever someone else is perceived to have done something wrong. I want due process for all. Attacking a staff member when you don't know him, don't know his job description, don't know the circumstances, don't know anything really, is completely inappropriate. Let's give everyone the chance for due process that we all expect for ourselves.
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In your first sentence you say you're not calling me names, then in the second you call me a hypocrite. Whut?

As far as 'attacking' a staff member- who said it was an attack? I have an opinion on the matter, and yes, it's derogatory. This is a publication my dues contribution funds. This is what I get for it?

As for your other name calling, this was the one I first referenced:

ATN_Pilot said:
What I see is a bunch of unionized pilots behaving like a bunch of airline managers: crucifying someone without even hearing his side of the story.

I guess due process is only for pilots, huh?
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Given that we all know your attitude towards unscrupulous airline management types, this seems pretty obvious. I get it- you wanted to stem criticism of the staffer in question by saying we were all as bad as crooked management types if we dared to do so.

Gee. Are you the kind of mentality representing pilots' interests? I remember the IBT had a segment threaten its members for criticizing their union.

Once again, I expect better.
 
Todd supports you contractually and per ALPA bylaws as long as it gets him re-elected...


oh the life of a politician.... caring more about the office one holds than the constituents one serves...
 
cencal83406 said:
Todd supports you contractually and per ALPA bylaws as long as it gets him re-elected...


oh the life of a politician.... caring more about the office one holds than the constituents one serves...
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Is this what this website has become? Years ago we used to hope we could get some high level ALPA guys, and some more mainline guys to come around. Now that we get them to stick around, we try to chase them off.
 
Yes, yes it has.

Shame really.

Then again, we allow non-professional pilot ideaologues rant and rave endlessly as if they know about the direction and challenges of our profession.
 
jtrain609 said:
Is this what this website has become? Years ago we used to hope we could get some high level ALPA guys, and some more mainline guys to come around. Now that we get them to stick around, we try to chase them off.
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I am ALPA, you are (were) ALPA. Same with Josh. To have Todd basically dismiss MEMBER opinions as "behaving like a bunch of airline managers" is indicative of an "ALPA can do no wrong" mentality. Yes, this is a website, but if you extract the arguments on here and get into real life, you'll notice that there are a great many folks that are only into being ALPA as a political machine.

You wonder why I have a problem this? Well, how can one be totally against the Age-65 rule (see his signature), which was endorsed by ALPA when it was clear that it was going to get through Congress anyways... and yet defend a poorly researched article's author. What would he be doing if it was a non-pilot writing in the newspaper some poorly researched drivel about how us pilots are dangerous? Oh wait, he thinks so too, even though he's charged with defending PILOTS.

I'm not trying to chase anyone off. There are a bunch of mainline pilots on here that never attack union member opinions. He has done a good job of representing, IMHO, the union in an extremely bad light. While he has done great things, there are other things he supports that I don't think are a benefit to his constituents....... - Multi-Crew Pilot License.

We get the flavor of the week in regards to opinions. I'd personally be pissed at the National for something like this:

ALPA Negotiates in bad faith

Is ALPA perfect? Of course not, but there are some huge warning flags about the things it's doing.

And are the geezers around to defend THEMSELVES?

And I almost forgot.... why do we hope we get high level ALPA guys? There are a TON a ALPA-approved websites out there where you can get in contact with union reps.
 
The perspective of line pilots is very interesting. They don't trust management and they don't trust their own Union. They also think both groups are overpaid.

Just as many pilots get agitated when others jump to conclusions before crash investigations are complete, I believe we owe the same respect to our Union leaders. Let this thing play out before we start pointing fingers and questioning the value of someone's salary.
 
jtrain609 said:
Is this what this website has become? Years ago we used to hope we could get some high level ALPA guys, and some more mainline guys to come around. Now that we get them to stick around, we try to chase them off.
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No one's chasing me off. You can't get rid of me that easily. ;)

Rex, if you want to have an intelligent conversation about this or anything else, you have my phone number and email address. If you just want to accuse me of being an opportunistic politician, then don't bother. Either way, I'm not getting into an argument with you here.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
No one's chasing me off. You can't get rid of me that easily. ;)

Rex, if you want to have an intelligent conversation about this or anything else, you have my phone number and email address. If you just want to accuse me of being an opportunistic politician, then don't bother. Either way, I'm not getting into an argument with you here.
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I'm not worried that you are, but the tenor that exists these days in this community is disturbing at best.
 
jtrain609 said:
Is this what this website has become? Years ago we used to hope we could get some high level ALPA guys, and some more mainline guys to come around. Now that we get them to stick around, we try to chase them off.
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LOL. Agreed. It reminds me of the joke about the difference between an airline pilot and a jet engine.
 
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