Considering ATP flight school for pilot training at 34 (no experience)

Also to add this..
When i took out my loan i got a few thousand extra for living expenses and what not, long story short i was running out of my personal money so i wanted the extra money from my loan that i took out so i contacted ATP and was given the run around. They kept saying they could not give me the extra 4k that was MINE until training was completed.. After a 2 week battle with them although they were not too happy, i finally received the funds
 
Keep in mind, this is probably best case scenario. There are guys on this board who have been at regional airlines for 5+ years and haven't seen the left seat. You are likely looking at 5+ years without breaking 50k.

A friend of mine is with Endeavor now, been with the same "company" since Mesaba...7 year F/O....poor bastard...

I also wanted to try and do a career change for some stupid reason, but now that I look back at that thought and it seems like it would of been a stupid decision for me. At the same time I am in a different boat, I have a great job, I have really no debt, and I get to come home and see my 3 kids and wife and dogs every night. So I guess not changing careers was the best thing I ever did. I do find myself staring at the planes leaving MSP while I am on break and sometimes imagine what my life would be like if I was in the front of them. Then my friend at SCX will tell me.."It's not all cracked up to what you think it would be"

So all I do is putz around with my PPL and that satisfies me well enough, perhaps someday I will do a Instrument and Com certificate and do CFI on the side as a retirement gig..seems like a good plan.

I wish you good luck in your pursuit of happiness.
 
A friend of mine is with Endeavor now, been with the same "company" since Mesaba...7 year F/O....poor bastard...

I also wanted to try and do a career change for some stupid reason, but now that I look back at that thought and it seems like it would of been a stupid decision for me. At the same time I am in a different boat, I have a great job, I have really no debt, and I get to come home and see my 3 kids and wife and dogs every night. So I guess not changing careers was the best thing I ever did. I do find myself staring at the planes leaving MSP while I am on break and sometimes imagine what my life would be like if I was in the front of them. Then my friend at SCX will tell me.."It's not all cracked up to what you think it would be"

So all I do is putz around with my PPL and that satisfies me well enough, perhaps someday I will do a Instrument and Com certificate and do CFI on the side as a retirement gig..seems like a good plan.

I wish you good luck in your pursuit of happiness.

I know a guy who has spent the last 9 years in the right seat at a regional. He's now on his third airline. This career doesn't always pan out the way people want.
 
You just need to spend a little more time finding a super rich woman to marry. Then all your problems will be solved.
 
I disagree with not being able to pay off the debt. Very easy to live cheaply as a pilot. Minimal expenses and yes, you'll have to make sacrifices at first but even $100k in debt can be paid off fairly rapidly if single.
If my above post about marrying a rich wife doesn't work out...I actually agree with this. ^^^

The advice given here is solid, but most of the posts I've seen assume that you would be a regional airline F/O and wouldn't make squat for the first 5-10 years of your career. While that is possible, it DOES NOT have to be the case. One of the above posts even gave a 10 year outline for your salary and then somebody else said that was the BEST CASE..which I do not agree with at all. I also think that the general attitude shown by the above posts is a very black and white one, where DEBT=BAD and nothing more. And for the most part, they are right.

But in your case, it could also be an investment. You have to look at your future earning potential. If you start a flying career now, and go the airline route, you have 30 years left to fly for a living. IF you worked through your ratings as quickly as possible and started working your way up the airline ladder, you would still have 20 years of making very good money, even IF the first 10 years of your airline career were complete poverty. If you look at the amount of $ you would make as an airline pilot until age 65, vs. the amount of $ you would make painting houses until age 65, I have no doubt that you would make more flying airplanes. Possibly millions more. Obviously this would take some luck, too, because any number of things could set you back in your career or end it early. But it's certainly possible.

Here are some positive things regarding your situation:
1. You already have a degree. Which is key for trying to land a good flying job. Doesn't matter what your major was.
2. You are single and have no kids. You can afford to be broke for a while (I know it sounds weird). If you were a family man I wouldn't be saying any of this.
3. You are ONLY 34, which isn't really that old. As I said above, that's still 30 years before mandatory airline retirement age. When I was a lowly CFI, another instructor I worked with quit her successful career as a veterinarian at age 38, and started a flying career. She then worked at a regional for a few years, and has now been at a major airline for a while. Although this is not typical, it shows that it can happen.
4. Regarding mandatory retirements, there are A TON coming at all the major airlines in the next 10 years. While there will never be a true pilot shortage, pilot hiring is going to be at an all time high for the next several years. It's a good time to be a pilot.

I've rambled enough for tonight. I say go for it. Just try not to lose your shirt. YOLO.

Staledog out.
 
Last edited:
Thanks! And extremely helpful you all have been! Its really a great forum! I have to say... ATP just called me to follow up with my inquiries, and I can't say i've ever felt more like someone wanted me off the phone quicker.

Ha! Thats nothing. When I was a pen stroke away from signing the final piece of paper for the ATP accelerated training program, I changed my mind, thanks to the helpful advice of a few JC memebers, (you know who you are) I called to let them know I wouldn't be coming and that I stopped prior to taking out the $50k loan.The guy on the other line told me I was throwing my career away and Id regret the decision the rest of my life. He was a total Richard. :bounce: I chose to train at the local school with equal results and A LOT cheaper.
 
I knew guys who went to flight schools, paid with credit cards, got out and declared bankruptcy. It was the plan from day one. It's unscrupulous, but people do it.
 
I knew guys who went to flight schools, paid with credit cards, got out and declared bankruptcy. It was the plan from day one. It's unscrupulous, but people do it.

How long ago was this? My understanding of bankruptcy law (which is limited) is that they've made it much, much harder to declare now, and will more often than not still require regular payments to be made even afterwards. @jtrain609 - you take any BK coursework?
 
This was in 1993. To be fair, I knew a couple who had planned it, never found out if they were successful, but I suspect they were. Leave a good paying job with good/lots of credit, charge it up and good to go. This is back when idiots at comair were finishing training, ponying up an additional 13k for PFT just to start at 16k. The only ones who made it were on daddies dole, or went broke
 
I won't say absolutely no debt, but definitely if you going into more debt, make sure it is smart debt. ATP and other pilot mills is not smart debt. I'd recommend finding a club to rent from and/or join EAA and network. There are a lot of people willing to help you, if you go about it the right way.... I'd say first steps are 1st class medical, intro flight, ground school of some sort, written test, save every penny (6-8k), maybe a second job, find the best instructor for you (this will save you money now, even if their rate is higher and in the future with a good foundation) then bang out your private in a month or two. I can't over emphasize how important the right instructor will be, also be prepared for each lesson and chair fly a lot. Then start over, rinse and repeat for you other ratings... And, remember to enjoy it! Don't be too focus that you miss the fun of it. It is great ride, can come with memories and lessons for life. Good luck!!!
 
How long ago was this? My understanding of bankruptcy law (which is limited) is that they've made it much, much harder to declare now, and will more often than not still require regular payments to be made even afterwards. @jtrain609 - you take any BK coursework?
Its a MEANS test. Fall under it and you qualify CH7, over it and welcome to 3 or 5 years of CH11.

Obviously a new COM pilot / CFI, fresh out of training with no job and zero assets and any debt will fall below the MEANS test line. Worse they risk in liquidation of assets beyond the low cap. So if JoePilot had a nice car, they might lose that.
I think they moved the ability to re-file either 7 or 11 again out to eight years though after first filing. What the change did was keep those with large incomes from accumulating huge debt and choosing CH7 as well as playing the rinse, wash, repeat game.
 
Though no plane is really much better than the 152.. (Seriously, I've had more fun flying a 152 than anything else that I can think of)

That's what I learned in - a pair of them. Ratty suckers they were.

They slip a lot better than a 172. It's fun to turn a 152 into an express elevator.
 
Back
Top