Cirrus Statistics (CAPS & Accidents)

[drunkenbeagle]

There are plenty of nice open fields in your neck of the woods. I think your employer would be quite upset with you if you had already vowed to pull the chute with all those options under you. You pull the chute and you total the airplane. ..

Saving the airplane would not be something I would even consider. If the plane has already given up on you, there is no reason to try and save it.

Besides, wrecking a plane and having everyone walk away is way cheaper for the insurance company.

 

[Seggy]

Lets stop there for one second. I'm not a huge fan of not using this argument because of the Airline Pilot Section but really you are going to make all these comments based on the fact that you are a "seasonal pilot" that gets to go out and fly a couple times a year. Give me a break. How much time in type do you have to base these opinions off of?

Time it type has NOTHING to do with it.

Basic Airmanship does.

 

[jhugz]

MikeD?

I was told the the Air Force doesn't allow there pilots to have any off airport landings, they have to punch out. Any truth in that?

 

[OldTownPilot]

Count me in the group of cirrus pilots that with an engine failure would NOT in a million years pull the chute before 500 feet AGL no matter the terrain or surroundings. Fly the damn airplane to where you want to land. If its not going to work out pull the chute. Its already been shown that a chute into water in not a good thing with back injuries etc. I would hate to pull the chute at 5000' just to drift with the wind over a lake and know my back will be mess up for the rest of my life, with questionable egress. I don't want to know how long I can swim with fractured vertebrae.

If the wind is 23 kts or more you WILL have a lower impact velocity "landing" into the wind, than under canopy. if the wind is 28 kts or more you will have a steeper angle (thats a good thing) of decent too "landing" into the wind than under canopy. Plus you will have control over where the airplane goes, and that is HUGE.

The cirrus WILL recover from a spin (with positive control inputs), if you can even get it into a spin (VERY hard to do). No reason there to pull the chute unless you are below 2000 AGL.

I'd lose the hardon for the chute, if I was you. You might even end up safer in the end.

 

[jhugz]

I'd lose the hardon for the chute, if I was you. You might even end up safer in the end.

Nope your advice is sound, pull the chute at 500 ft. so at that point you are now out of all options including the chute.

 

[OldTownPilot]

Just to show everyone how much you know about the chute that you love, go look up the altitude loss and tell everyone how much it is.

Hint, it's less than 500 feet.

 

[jhugz]

Just to show everyone how much you know about the chute that you love, go look up the altitude loss and tell everyone how much it is.

Hint, it's less than 500 feet.

Thanks champ, I guess you don't either because you would know that the 400 ft number your talking about is in S&L flight not a Vg descent.

Per the POH: With these numbers in mind it might be useful to keep 2,000 feet AGL in mind as the cut-off decision altitude. Above 2,000 feet there would normally be time to systematically assess and address the aircraft emergency. Below 2,000 feet the decision to activate the CAPS has to come almost immediately in order to maximize the possibility of successful deployment.

 

[OldTownPilot]

There already has been a successful pull from 400 feet with the engine out.

How hard is it to momentarily level yourself at an altitude with the engine out?

 

[minitour]

Has anyone run a tank dry in cruise, thought the engine quit and pulled the chute rather than switch tanks at 5 or 6k?

If no, does anyone want to start a friendly pool on how long before it happens?

-mini

 

[shdw]

Has anyone run a tank dry in cruise, thought the engine quit and pulled the chute rather than switch tanks at 5 or 6k?

If no, does anyone want to start a friendly pool on how long before it happens?

-mini

CAPS pull #10, Sept 2006, Bull Bay, Jamaica, 4 uninjured
Factors: VMC cruise, passenger activated when fuel streaming from tank filler openings Activation: low altitude Landing: trees

I don't know the airplane, does it have multiple tanks? Now if you mean a pilot, I can't recall any in jhugz list. So I'll put a :beer: in the pool, by december next year is my guess.

 

[mshunter]

Just want to conclude that after one awesomely nasty, personally insulting PM

Now that right there is just a shame, and uncalled for.

 

[Fly_Unity]

Count me in the group of cirrus pilots that with an engine failure would NOT in a million years pull the chute before 500 feet AGL no matter the terrain or surroundings. Fly the damn airplane to where you want to land. If its not going to work out pull the chute. Its already been shown that a chute into water in not a good thing with back injuries etc. I would hate to pull the chute at 5000' just to drift with the wind over a lake and know my back will be mess up for the rest of my life, with questionable egress. I don't want to know how long I can swim with fractured vertebrae.

If the wind is 23 kts or more you WILL have a lower impact velocity "landing" into the wind, than under canopy. if the wind is 28 kts or more you will have a steeper angle (thats a good thing) of decent too "landing" into the wind than under canopy. Plus you will have control over where the airplane goes, and that is HUGE.

The cirrus WILL recover from a spin (with positive control inputs), if you can even get it into a spin (VERY hard to do). No reason there to pull the chute unless you are below 2000 AGL.

I'd lose the hardon for the chute, if I was you. You might even end up safer in the end.

its hard to put it on a spin? you mean hard to spin it unintentional? Its about as easy to put in a spin as a 172. I once flew with a Cirrus Test pilot who spun them on the initial certification test. He showed me how easy it was to get into one. Its about as easy as a 172. Of course he did not let it develop because its not certified but his experience was that it was extremely difficult for test pilots to recover from a fully developed spin.

Oh, Also just to clear things up. Its possible to maneuver the Cirrus around under canopy with just the engine and rudder.

and.... everyone is talking about back injuries coming straight down at 1700 FPM. The Cirrus comes down in a nose low attitude so that the front nose wheel and the mains take most of the shock. Because you will be falling forward, you will be pushed forward against your seatbelt and airbag will take most of the impact and the coil will take the rest(not dropping 20 feet straight down on your butt like someone suggested earlier). Which is why most people walk away from the site after the deployment. Water landings on the other hand will be extremely hard because the gear will not take the impact. So you would have to use your engine (if available) to get away from the water if your under canopy.

I recently had a very good friend kill himself with an engine failure in a 210 (many pilots on JC knows him) What if he had a parachute? I know the Cirrus has a 1 to 8 glide ratio. With a glide that good Im going to try and put it on a road or a field. BUT in the Rocky Mountains sometimes it does not matter how good of glide ratio you got, its just impossible to find spots to land. The Chute is another option that is going to be another resource to me IF I need it.

close to 1000 hours in the SR22 and I havnt needed to pull the Chute yet. Thought about it once though when I had an alternator failure but then I realized I had 2 alternators.

 

[Fly_Unity]

http://forums.jetcareers.com/pictures-road/98930-pictures-wyoming.html

This is where I would probably pull the Chute. I fly this route quite a bit and half the time its at night. If it was day I would try and find a flat spot first. At about 1000 AGL pull the chute if I was unable to find a spot. Even with this terrain, chances if living seems mighty slim.

 

[wjmiller3]

http://forums.jetcareers.com/pictures-road/98930-pictures-wyoming.html

This is where I would probably pull the Chute. I fly this route quite a bit and half the time its at night. If it was day I would try and find a flat spot first. At about 1000 AGL pull the chute if I was unable to find a spot. Even with this terrain, chances if living seems mighty slim.

Curious, I fly 22's also and wondering why you have ALT 2 turned off in one of those pics?

 

[MikeD]

MikeD?

I was told the the Air Force doesn't allow there pilots to have any off airport landings, they have to punch out. Any truth in that?

No restriction like that that I know of, it's up to the PIC. Now, whether wise to land off airport in a fighter-type aircraft that would most likely destruct upon landing vs ejecting in a controlled environment and parachuting down in a chute that you have some control over, that's a whole another ball of wax.

In a light aircraft, you can easily land any number of places with no engine, and at least have some measure of control of where you come down and how hard/soft. For the times that you would not have that control (severe structural damage, truly no place to let down such as a heavy forest, etc) then the chute may be the more viable option.

All I'm saying is you normally have a better chance if you as the pilot keep flying the plane as long as its controllable, and using the chute as a true last resort if its no longer possible to still control the aircraft. The Cirrus affords that opportunity that other planes don't, which is a great thing. Pilots though, should know the limits of that system and when the appropriate times it is to use it. The limiting factor is pilot knowledge and training, NOT the Cirrus. Again, by every measure the Cirrus is as fine an aircraft as any other, with the added last-ditch safety feature of the chute. An excellent design IMO.

 

[mikecweb]

The real question is if the plane is out of Coke, do you pull the chute or ask them if they wouldn't mind sprite?

 

[TFaudree_ERAU]

Saving the airplane would not be something I would even consider.

Then you have no business flying professionally.

If the plane has already given up on you, there is no reason to try and save it

If you pop an engine at V1 in a twin engine airplane, do you just let the airplane swerve off the side of the runway? No, you stomp the rudder, fly the effing airplane, and nurse it back around to land. Airplanes WILL "give up on you" sooner or later. I hope you have the ability and desire to do more than just throw your hands up in the air and let Newton take over.

Besides, wrecking a plane and having everyone walk away is way cheaper for the insurance company.

Bull.

When you pull the chute, you total the airplane. An airplane that, on the used market, sells for ~$250,000. You land in a field, crack a wheel pant or two, and the insurance company pays out a couple thousand dollars.

 

[darrenf]

Bull.

When you pull the chute, you total the airplane. An airplane that, on the used market, sells for ~$250,000. You land in a field, crack a wheel pant or two, and the insurance company pays out a couple thousand dollars.

You can't think of another potential outcome of an off field landing that could result in higher financial damages?

 

[Roger, Roger]

You can't think of another potential outcome of an off field landing that could result in higher financial damages?

Or other damages.

N6869R's off field landing looked pretty survivable.

I think a lot of people overestimate the chances of an off-airport landing being a success. And no, I'm not talking about Ben. I'm talking about all the macho, "I'd never pull the chute, you'll survive better if you fly it into the ground" types on here. Not that I'm advocating throwing up your hands and yanking the chute the first time the engine stumbles, but just a reminder that even a well-executed off-field landing can have horrific consequences.

 

[wjmiller3]

Or other damages.

N6869R's off field landing looked pretty survivable.

I think a lot of people overestimate the chances of an off-airport landing being a success. And no, I'm not talking about Ben. I'm talking about all the macho, "I'd never pull the chute, you'll survive better if you fly it into the ground" types on here. Not that I'm advocating throwing up your hands and yanking the chute the first time the engine stumbles, but just a reminder that even a well-executed off-field landing can have horrific consequences.

true....