No, those have always required degrees.
Now being PFJ/PFT is not bad in my book. Every human being takes the advantages they can get to get a job, that is a free society for you. However, those that go this route do tend to look at $$$ signs more than listen to guys that would have told them not to count on the money given.
What I have a problem with is when you whine and complain when you didn't get what you want. Furthermore you constantly berate those that want to get in the field. I have stated this several times, need me to quote myself to show you this?
True, I PFT'd by going to A&P school. I could have gone through the military(which never is PFT/PFJ BTW) or worked my way slaving in a shop for 3 years. I chose the quick route.
When a new mechanic comes straight out of A&P school and starts whining about how bad the industry is, I tell the same thing: Quit whining, you should have done your research better.
My problem is not that you PFT'd it is that you PFT'd and then complain about it. Worse you berate and belittle those that wish to go where you chose not to. I would have never said anything had you been constructive in your criticism
Putting words in my mouth again. When did I say VRA was PFT?
Since you brought up VRAs, how many turn down the offer and complain like you do?
I have not been set off. You have not upset me at any point. The original comments I quoted on my last post (plus comments from other threads) led me to respond.
If you called me out as an OTS hire, thats news to me.
For the record, yes, I am an OTS applicant. Yes I have received a tentative offer. Yes, I have accepted it and am waiting for my paperwork to clear.
I have not announced it because it is not a final offer yet.
I didn't announce my airline jobs until I had a final offers too. Your point?
I yi yi. . .
I never said you said the military was PFT/PFJ - I did say though that those of us who did serve in the military did pay for our job and training through the quality of life that we had to deal with throughout our period with the military or in government service. So there, I said it. . . not you. But I know that analogy doesn't really translate well to those who lack military service.
Since you asked about how many guys turned down VRA appointments, not too many, but I hope you've been to NATCA's website and read the numerous resignation letters from previous DOD controllers who were enjoying a great QOL before coming to the FAA. They jumped ship to head back to the DoD sector. I can't say I blame them. It's a professional field, that should be respected and paid accordingly. None of this keeping aluminum tubes from touching for peanut wages. At least not for me, and not for a number of VRA / Previous DoD controllers who have resigned.
Furthermore, I really do wish you the best of luck.
I think it's real easy and nice for you to be able to sit back and chill out knowing that you took the high road in your mind. Great, now go and do it. Good luck. Don't wash out at OKC, don't wash out of your facility, and make the best of it.
But don't expect the CTI graduates to take too well to you belittling them because you feel personally that it was PFJ/PFT. Some of those guys have advanced degrees in other fields, and much like flying for a living, dreamed of working traffic and they had their chance opened up to them through the CTI program.
If it helps you to think that you did it the old school way and that it'll get you brownie points - then by all means, spread the word that you know all and that you didn't spend time at a university earning a degree with a CTI recommendation. As I graduated HS the military, MARC, and CTI were it. I enlisted in the military and simultaneously worked towards my CTI education. When the time came, the FAA let me down - more importantly, the House of Representatives let me down as well.
But you know what? Some of us wear big boy pants and deal with it, and quit and say no. We then seek other sectors of an industry that we enjoy (flying for a living), and we then move on.
And I know I didn't call you out as an OTS hire. . .it was a rhetorical question.
More importantly, the following is very important. . .so please do read, and just respond to it.
I'll never forget how long and hard NATCA fought with the FAA to get them to return to the table.
This also affected you, Mr. OTS guy. Why should you be paid 30-40% less than those who were hired in the 80's? Hell, why should you be paid 30-40% less than those who were hired 2 to 6 years before you? What makes you cheaper labor? CTI, VRA, or OTS? You tell me that.
Until people, of all industries, quit devaluing their professional skills - organizations (public or private) will continue to follow along, bringing down wages for people who don't realize their own professional skills and what those skills cost.
Three Resignation Letters
I have numerous others in my e-mail inbox from Doug Church. They are though, in .pdf format. 4 are from VRA hires who left the agency after less than one year, all thanks to the FAA's imposed work rules and pay structure.
Just realize it's not just CTI individuals who are fed up. It's everyone, and you should be extremely concerned as well. What's to stop the FAA from imposing another "contract" with even further reductions in pay? You can't tell us that you are not in any way concerned and that you'd do this job no matter what you're paid.
