ASA/ExpressJet

Seggy said:
That is the thing, the company CAN compete.
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Then they can at least keep the current rates.

The concept of taking pay CUTS on a contract from 2004 is insanity. If the rest of the contract has already been gutted AND they want pay cuts on top of that, then the ship might as well just go under.
 
Nah, they don't need to keep the current rates. They can wind you guys down and replace it with Skywest.
 
I think they will loose a lot more flying if there are pay cuts due to people leaving, I know Ill leave in a heart beat. Then they will my actually making us a desirable regional to come work for. If they make it a desirable regional to work for then everyone will want to work here and we will have the pilots to fly and the other regional's wont.
 
Seggy said:
I still have NO CLUE why you want to move back there.
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Inflation, if the calculator I just used is accurate, has been 24% since the contract was signed in 2004.

And they want cuts ON TOP OF rates that have already had their buying power reduced by 24%?

Full Pay To The Last Day.
 
surreal1221 said:
Good! I would also recommend e-mailing the members of your negotiating committee.

This pilot group is being teed up for a concessionary contract. It may not have been obvious a few months, or even a year ago, but it should be very clear at this point.
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If they do need to be told that, they all need to be removed from the negotiating committee. Which, given the fact that they didn't get up from the meeting and walk out the second they brought it up, shows maybe that's the case.
 
Even if you're looking at it simply as an investment its a bad idea.

Give management some of our money so they can go out and get more flying so I can finally upgrade?

I simply don't have the faith that our management team could even pull that off. Look how this place is run on a daily basis.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
If they do need to be told that, they all need to be removed from the negotiating committee. Which, given the fact that they didn't get up from the meeting and walk out the second they brought it up, shows maybe that's the case.
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Yeah...about that...you must be under the impression that this union has leadership, or the required vision of a body with a leader at the top. No vision whatsoever. Just, "Get this done. We can't miss out on the next flying. Our -200s and ERJs could disappear. We must finish this NOW!"

So...hmm...you think negotiators would actually get up and walk out? They've been given marching orders to finish this. Hell, I actually have a great relationship with a majority of the negotiating committee and find them to be pretty standup dudes. However, when the orders are given from on high...well...they march.

That said, while I agree with The Train's assessment of inflation and all that mathematics stuff...might I also remind all of us that it is not just the hourly rate that establishes contract costs.

Areas we all should be concerned with, that impact our online banking, paperless statements:

Vacation pay and accrual.
Sick Leave pay and accrual.
Scheduling bidding, and the MULTITUDE of elements that directly impact your ability to work less or more, and to control your average paycheck (think credit window size, min day credit, duty/trip rigs, etc.)

The elements are many and not just about our hourly rate. But hey, now that they've sent the e-mail out saying the company wants concessions...well...like most things around here, what the company wants, the company gets. Right? :sarcasm:
 
surreal1221 said:
Yeah...about that...your pilot union lacks real leaders Joe. No vision whatsoever. Just, "Get this done. We can't miss out of next flying. Our -200s and ERJs could disappear. We must finish this NOW!"

So...hmm...you think negotiators would actually get up and walk out? They've been giving marching orders to finish this.
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If the company really needed this done immediately or sooner, they'd make it worth our time.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
If the company really needed this done immediately or sooner, they'd make it worth our time.
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yeah, I agree. I'm not in any rush. Seggy is under the impression that this needed to be done yesterday, or last year, or something along those lines.

I'm cool with this taking another decade. Honestly, I'm not too worried about the lack of a JCBA at this point. Status quo seems much better than the HPV infested sandwich that could be sold to us.
 
surreal1221 said:
yeah, I agree. I'm not in any rush. Seggy is under the impression that this needed to be done yesterday, or last year, or something along those lines.
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No it really did need to get done about a year ago (at least).

I would wager that a current Pinnacle Pilot (doesn't matter if they were Colgan, Mesaba, or Pinnacle), who is now living under a concessionary contract, made more money since the time of the announced merger, than someone at ExpressJet or ASA with similar seniority.

surreal1221 said:
I'm cool with this taking another decade. Honestly, I'm not too worried about the lack of a JCBA at this point. Status quo seems much better than the HPV infested sandwich that could be sold to us.
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Are you supposed to be sarcastic there? I would be extremely worried about the lack of a JCBA. Without it there is whipsawing that will/already has happen(ed).
 
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