Arizona, Florida of the West...

Roger Roger said:
If you were a real hard worker, you would have stayed at those previous jobs. Kids these days won’t stick with a real man’s job like 135, they want to go to the airlines where someone plans their flights, fuels, loads, cleans, briefs the passengers….
Click to expand...
Typical pilot. Always making assumptions…
 
SlumTodd_Millionaire said:
I’d rather have calluses and bad knees than three ex-wives and multiple child support payments, only to die at 68 because the average pilot doesn't live much past retirement.

There‘s a lot more to whether a job is “hard” than just a measure of manual labor. And yes, I spent several years doing heavy lifting in un-air-conditioned Florida warehouses, so I know real labor.
Click to expand...

Well, I probably shouldn't, but I'll stick my toe in the water. The only actual research I can find says that pilots actually live longer than the general population of males. I'm certainly open to seeing other data. You've said plenty about looking at actual science and not just anecdotes, so if you can point me in the right direction, I'd love to see the research.

 
Why do people feel the need to gatekeep hardships that come with a job? Different jobs have different challenges at different times. Go look at a pilot in his early 60s vs the average early 60s man and 9 times out of 10 there's a stark difference, a lot of pilots easily look 10 to 15 years older. I think the takeaway is don't be a dingus towards people working in the same operation as you.
 
msmspilot said:
Well, I probably shouldn't, but I'll stick my toe in the water. The only actual research I can find says that pilots actually live longer than the general population of males. I'm certainly open to seeing other data. You've said plenty about looking at actual science and not just anecdotes, so if you can point me in the right direction, I'd love to see the research.

Click to expand...

It’s a great question, but unfortunately, I’m not aware of any publicly available research. I always heard of the same actuarial data that @Derg has mentioned here before about pension records from DALPA showing early deaths, but I’ve never been able to get my hands on the data. If recollection serves, though, @Derg said he had either seen the data or was supremely confident that the source was accurate.

There are several problems with the study you linked, though. First, it only looks at American Airlines pilots, not a diverse dataset. Second, it’s a study that is now 26 years old, and basically shows data from the “golden age“ of pilot contracts when everybody at American (save reserves) got tons of time off, had astronomical benefits and a fully funded pension, and made bank so they didn’t feel the need to live on voluntary overtime. And finally, they specifically excluded anyone from the study who retired early. That’s a big problem since someone with medical issues is going to retire early. You’ve basically screened out a big chunk of people who would have weighed down the average.

That’s not to say the study isn’t accurate, though. It may well be. We just don’t have the publicly available data to know, and it does contradict what credible sources have said other data shows.
 
SlumTodd_Millionaire said:
It’s a great question, but unfortunately, I’m not aware of any publicly available research. I always heard of the same actuarial data that @Derg has mentioned here before about pension records from DALPA showing early deaths, but I’ve never been able to get my hands on the data. If recollection serves, though, @Derg said he had either seen the data or was supremely confident that the source was accurate.

There are several problems with the study you linked, though. First, it only looks at American Airlines pilots, not a diverse dataset. Second, it’s a study that is now 26 years old, and basically shows data from the “golden age“ of pilot contracts when everybody at American (save reserves) got tons of time off, had astronomical benefits and a fully funded pension, and made bank so they didn’t feel the need to live on voluntary overtime. And finally, they specifically excluded anyone from the study who retired early. That’s a big problem since someone with medical issues is going to retire early. You’ve basically screened out a big chunk of people who would have weighed down the average.

That’s not to say the study isn’t accurate, though. It may well be. We just don’t have the publicly available data to know, and it does contradict what credible sources have said other data shows.
Click to expand...

All of those are fair points. I would LOVE to have linked a newer and more wide ranging study, but as you agreed, the data just isn't public. Thanks for the reply.
 
SlumTodd_Millionaire said:
It’s a great question, but unfortunately, I’m not aware of any publicly available research. I always heard of the same actuarial data that @Derg has mentioned here before about pension records from DALPA showing early deaths, but I’ve never been able to get my hands on the data. If recollection serves, though, @Derg said he had either seen the data or was supremely confident that the source was accurate.
Click to expand...

I can't share it as the data itself is proprietary, but Delta has about double the percentage of pilots on LTD than any other ALPA carrier with an LTD plan. Some of that may be due to the richness of their plan, but it's not *that* much better than several other places. LTD usage isn't a direct indicator of early death, but it certainly points that way.

It's a small sample size (due to being a small carrier), but the average age of death of pilots here in the last 15 years is well in excess of 80 years old.
 
BobDDuck said:
I can't share it as the data itself is proprietary, but Delta has about double the percentage of pilots on LTD than any other ALPA carrier with an LTD plan. Some of that may be due to the richness of their plan, but it's not *that* much better than several other places. LTD usage isn't a direct indicator of early death, but it certainly points that way.

It's a small sample size (due to being a small carrier), but the average age of death of pilots here in the last 15 years is well in excess of 80 years old.
Click to expand...
Just a quick look at, say, Hawaii vs Georgia life expectancy takes care of about 4 years worth of difference.
 
MarkE said:
Bridge to Coronado Island?
Click to expand...
Correct! Didn't think anyone would know.

1639009456697.png
 
CFI A&P said:
When I meet a professional pilot, it is very easy to discern if they've ever had a job outside being a pilot. Waiter, blue collar trades, sales, anything - anything Mike Rowe ever did on Discovery Channel... Not all, but many of the only-ever-been-a-pilot types I've met will bitch about a 20 minute EDCT as if there were asked to dig a 300ft long trench for sprinklers.

Like you said flying for a living is hard in some aspects, time away from home, etc.. However, I've never met a pilot that has calluses or bad knees from being a pilot.
Click to expand...
Bad knees, tinnitus, bad back here.

Crap hits when you get older to plenty of pilots including skin cancers, blood clots in their legs, circadian dysrhythmia, diet issues on the road leading to other medical problems, hiding any depression or other emotional/mental issues, medical problems related to the cabin air, long exposure to a couple of different types of radiation,, serious fatigue/sleeping issues which can affect the immune system and can cause other medical problems, musculoskeletal disorders and more, trust me.
 
Last edited:
I don’t really know what I expected years ago, if I even thought much about the passing of time. I’m happy and have all I might need but, damn, it’s hard to start “wearing out.” Whoever thought it would be necessary to plan how you might get back up if you went to ground for any reason, from playing with the pups to stocking dog food on a lower shelf.

Schedules are a thing of the past (both good and bad). Awake thru the night until roughly 05:00 today and finally drifted-off to get some four hours sleep. Instead of agonizing over such things, I’ve found it better to simply eat when I’m hungry, drink when I’m thirsty and sleep when it finally comes.

It just is what it is, I guess (and, frankly, still beats the other alternative a-coming one day ).
 
Bob Ridpath said:
I don’t really know what I expected years ago, if I even thought much about the passing of time. I’m happy and have all I might need but, damn, it’s hard to start “wearing out.” Whoever thought it would be necessary to plan how you might get back up if you went to ground for any reason, from playing with the pups to stocking dog food on a lower shelf.

Schedules are a thing of the past (both good and bad). Awake thru the night until roughly 05:00 today and finally drifted-off to get some four hours sleep. Instead of agonizing over such things, I’ve found it better to simply eat when I’m hungry, drink when I’m thirsty and sleep when it finally comes.

It just is what it is, I guess (and, frankly, still beats the other alternative a-coming one day ).
Click to expand...
I'll wake up in the middle of the night and my finger joints (knuckles) hurt when I turn over. They're mostly fine during the day, but I wonder what I might be looking forward to. I'm sure plenty of people here would be happy if I wasn't able to type, I type with one or two fingers most of the time anyway, sorry to get your hopes up.
 
SlumTodd_Millionaire said:
It’s a great question, but unfortunately, I’m not aware of any publicly available research. I always heard of the same actuarial data that @Derg has mentioned here before about pension records from DALPA showing early deaths, but I’ve never been able to get my hands on the data. If recollection serves, though, @Derg said he had either seen the data or was supremely confident that the source was accurate.

There are several problems with the study you linked, though. First, it only looks at American Airlines pilots, not a diverse dataset. Second, it’s a study that is now 26 years old, and basically shows data from the “golden age“ of pilot contracts when everybody at American (save reserves) got tons of time off, had astronomical benefits and a fully funded pension, and made bank so they didn’t feel the need to live on voluntary overtime. And finally, they specifically excluded anyone from the study who retired early. That’s a big problem since someone with medical issues is going to retire early. You’ve basically screened out a big chunk of people who would have weighed down the average.

That’s not to say the study isn’t accurate, though. It may well be. We just don’t have the publicly available data to know, and it does contradict what credible sources have said other data shows.
Click to expand...

It was in a spreadsheet.

66.49 years. No idea if that’s gone up or down in the last few, especially after the age 65 truly kicked in.

Live fast.
 
Derg said:
It was in a spreadsheet.

66.49 years. No idea if that’s gone up or down in the last few, especially after the age 65 truly kicked in.

Live fast.
Click to expand...
I told the first financial advisor I ever spoke to that I wanted to retire at 50 when I was 23. I'm 50 now and still a few years from my original goal. Such is life.
 
knot4u said:
I told the first financial advisor I ever spoke to that I wanted to retire at 50 when I was 23. I'm 50 now and still a few years from my original goal. Such is life.
Click to expand...

A friend and I had a discussion about this over cocktails yesterday. We’re both on the financial “downstroke” so we could technically retire in the next couple years and have a fantastic time, but… healthcare. Man, if I could keep my healthcare plan for a reasonable amount or had access to a better system, KTHXBAIIIII! :)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top