Another knee jerk reaction to the Colgan crash

Sorry about that.

ast week, the FAA announced changes in its policies regarding enforcement records. Until recently, violations were expunged (removed) from a pilot’s FAA record after 5 years and Letters of Warning were expunged after 2 years. In addition, under the Pilot Record Improvement Act (PRIA), air carriers were required to perform background checks on pilots prior to hiring them. Air carriers would request information directly from the pilot applicant’s prior air carrier employers and from the FAA.
Congress passed the Airline Safety and Federal Aviation Administration Extension Act of 2010 late last year. This legislation requires the FAA to develop a database with all pilot training and enforcement records, licensing records, etc. Instead of seeking background information from the carriers directly and from the FAA, all information required under PRIA will now be maintained in the FAA’s database (which is under development and not yet operational). These records now must be maintained in this FAA database until the FAA receives notice of the pilot’s death. In other words, the new legislation appears to make all records "permanent" and preclude them from being expunged.
Please read the attached letter [FAA Letter], dated Feb. 4, 2011. The FAA just announced this end to the expungement policy. The change is effective immediately.
ALPA and others are working to revise the database requirements, which were part of the reaction to the Colgan crash.
 
Italianaviator said:
Sorry about that.

ast week, the FAA announced changes in its policies regarding enforcement records. Until recently, violations were expunged (removed) from a pilot’s FAA record after 5 years and Letters of Warning were expunged after 2 years. In addition, under the Pilot Record Improvement Act (PRIA), air carriers were required to perform background checks on pilots prior to hiring them. Air carriers would request information directly from the pilot applicant’s prior air carrier employers and from the FAA.
Congress passed the Airline Safety and Federal Aviation Administration Extension Act of 2010 late last year. This legislation requires the FAA to develop a database with all pilot training and enforcement records, licensing records, etc. Instead of seeking background information from the carriers directly and from the FAA, all information required under PRIA will now be maintained in the FAA’s database (which is under development and not yet operational). These records now must be maintained in this FAA database until the FAA receives notice of the pilot’s death. In other words, the new legislation appears to make all records "permanent" and preclude them from being expunged.
Please read the attached letter [FAA Letter], dated Feb. 4, 2011. The FAA just announced this end to the expungement policy. The change is effective immediately.
ALPA and others are working to revise the database requirements, which were part of the reaction to the Colgan crash.
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Loads of horse poopie!
 
Well one would hope that a person with one, maybe two marks on their record wouldn't be blackballed. But at the same time, there has to be something to keep the Marvin's of the world from being hired.
 
I am not seeing where this is a big issue. Small issues will be overlooked but if there is something on there that is a pretty bid deal it should be available for your employers to see.
 
JrsyGuy said:
I am not seeing where this is a big issue. Small issues will be overlooked but if there is something on there that is a pretty bid deal it should be available for your employers to see.
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True. Here's another question - if we were talking about truck drivers, would we feel the same way?
 
Murdoughnut said:
Well one would hope that a person with one, maybe two marks on their record wouldn't be blackballed. But at the same time, there has to be something to keep the Marvin's of the world from being hired.
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Marvin was not the problem. Marvin met standard as evidenced by him being sent back to the line after checks. The problem was the tng dept and those (company, tng dept and POI) who signed Marvin off as *proficient* and *competent*.
 
Murdoughnut said:
True. Here's another question - if we were talking about truck drivers, would we feel the same way?
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Sure, why not? If a truck driver had some DUI incident where he killed a family 9 years ago, that would be something I would be interested in knowing as an employer.
 
That's a good question. How was that guy passing checkrides and line checks?
 
Orange Anchor said:
Marvin was not the problem. Marvin met standard as evidenced by him being sent back to the line after checks. The problem was the tng dept and those (company, tng dept and POI) who signed Marvin off as *proficient* and *competent*.
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True - but I think the issue was that he likely would have never been hired had his past failures been known to the company.
 
Murdoughnut said:
True - but I think the issue was that he likely would have never been hired had his past failures been known to the company.
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Do we really know that or can that assertion be made? Regional hiring appears to run the gamut from tough to get into, all the way to open the floodgates, depending on the company....
 
This really doesn't bother me as a whole but the FAA needs to do a better job of policing how their own standards are being held up by their designees in the 61,135,141, and 121 worlds. As professionals, I feel we should not be intimidated by the scrutiny. Let's hope that through disclosure a clearer picture of what a "normal" record looks like emerges.
 
MikeD said:
Do we really know that or can that assertion be made? Regional hiring appears to run the gamut from tough to get into, all the way to open the floodgates, depending on the company....
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Lol, depending on the economy. Same with freight though too, remember when Amflight used to be taking guys with 1200hrs and a pulse if they could finishing fogging this partially fogged mirror? That was only a few years back...how soon we forget. Places that just a few years ago were tripping over themselves to hire a guy with 1000hrs are now only accepting resumes from people with over 2000hrs, and an internal rec. Its hilarious to me how this industry works. I could be wrong, but it appears that it has nothing at all to do with how good of a pilot you are, or even who you know (though both of those things help) its about a little luck, and a lot of good timing.
 
Murdoughnut said:
True - but I think the issue was that he likely would have never been hired had his past failures been known to the company.
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But he was hired and he did have sub-standard rides at Colgan. Yet the tng dept continued to sign him off. And a POI is aware of or should be aware of sub-standard performances.
 
ppragman said:
I could be wrong, but it appears that it has nothing at all to do with how good of a pilot you are, or even who you know (though both of those things help) its about a little luck, and a lot of good timing.
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That's the basic human condition.

Look at the "World" series in baseball. There's no "world" in the "world series", just two well-financed, firewalled, US-based monopolies battling it out. Those aren't the best baseball players from around the world, just the best (marketed? performing? not standing in line at Subway?) that the recruiter saw at the time.

It's all networking and attitude. Chuck Yeager and Bob Hoover might be awesome pilots, but no company in their right mind would put them in a crew environment.
 
OldTownPilot said:
That I would pay good money to see.
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Yup, "awesome" pilot does not translate into "awesome airline pilot" and vice versa.

60% flying, 40% cabin cat-fights, Jepp revisions, passenger problems and face-palming radio calls.
 
Doug Taylor said:
Yup, "awesome" pilot does not translate into "awesome airline pilot" and vice versa.

60% flying, 40% cabin cat-fights, Jepp revisions, passenger problems and face-palming radio calls.
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Well atleast you'll be able to refocus a small percentage of your efforts towards the cat fights after the Jepp revisions are nixed ;)

...or in the case of the 7ER a LARGE % of your efforts!!
 
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