Ameriflight

Burrito said:
To answer the second question first, yes. Definitely. Empire's only got 5 or 6 ATRs and 30-something Cargovans, while Amflight's got 50-something 99s, 20-odd Pipers, I know there's 25 1900s and I think there's 10 or 12 (not sure how many are active vs parts ships) Bros. Amflight's a monster.

Regarding Wiggins, make no mistake in thinking it was sold out and split up. The company's management was actively hunting for a buyer, and couldn't get one sole taker for the whole pot (FBO/Airops [which itself is UPS and FedEx]). Auditors would come in, look at the hangars, go over to inspect the fuel trucks, come back a week later and watch the freight operation in action...It was nuts.

The advantage to Wiggins, though, was a well-loved fleet and guessing here a new maintenance base in the northeast since Buffalo's 400 miles away.

*ALSO, being employee-owned, most of the old dogs from Wiggins/Stead Aviation who'd been around for 800 years could now take the opportunity and retire with a handsome paycheck.
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Empire actually has 21 ATRs at last count; significantly more than 5 or 6. Some of them are used for pax operations in Hawaii.
 
Inverted said:
PIC multi turbine is never a waste. That time in the logbook is absolutely gold. What I meant was, that isn't the end all be all to getting hired at a legacy anymore.

TMC I think already dropped the 1,000TPIC requirement, if not they will need to.

The private jet sector is a great avenue from AMF. I consider myself pretty fortunate and successful in the private jet world and AMF helped for sure.

Nobody goes to a regional in hopes of flying a Beechjet or a Phenom for 135, but I would say 50% or more of those who go to AMF or freight feeders want to go 121. So the feeders have lost the demographic of coming there, to then go to the airlines. Sure you can go to Allegiant or Frontier but those are stepping stone jobs. Nobody is going from flight instructing to AMF, to Delta, hasn't happened, isn't happening, and probably won't happen. Looks like people are starting to understand that. Will that change? Sure it will, it will get to the way it was 25 years ago when you could go from flying a King Air to an 737 at SWA or UAL with no other relevant experience.

Getting hired is always a bit of luck but you had excellent qualifications to back it up. 135 TPIC is never a waste, it's a step below 121 TPIC but that's only if you want to go 121.
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You'd be suprised at how many AMFer's still think they have a chance of going directly to United, Delta, or even UPS from AMF.
 
A150K said:
You'd be suprised at how many AMFer's still think they have a chance of going directly to United, Delta, or even UPS from AMF.
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Dude I worked there, nothing like that surprises me lol. Nobody can produce a name that went from instructing, to AMF, to a legacy with no prior relevant experience.
 
A150K said:
You'd be suprised at how many AMFer's still think they have a chance of going directly to United, Delta, or even UPS from AMF.
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I am surprised, because the last third of first page of the senority list hasn't been here more than 3 years...

Those that have come here in that time know where we stand with legacies. Now if you're saying that there are those that think we're better pilots and deserve consideration, yes, that still exists and I don't disagree. :)
 
Inverted said:
Dude I worked there, nothing like that surprises me lol. Nobody can produce a name that went from instructing, to AMF, to a legacy with no prior relevant experience.
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Not to a legacy but I personally know one that went direct from Ameriflight to UPS and another that went from Ameriflight direct to Alaska. Both were about 8 years ago.
 
Inverted said:
Dude I worked there, nothing like that surprises me lol. Nobody can produce a name that went from instructing, to AMF, to a legacy with no prior relevant experience.
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There have been some. It was just before your time. It was around 2007. Alaska to a hand full of BFI guys all at once and a CVG based bro Captain went to UPS. One of the check airmen on the metro/brasilia got an interview at Southwest but didn't get it.

It might go back to being like that as the shortage continues. SWA just took one of the guys at my company and he had zero 121 time. Only 135 jet. So I won't say that it can't happen. Only that you're more likely to make it happen going the 121 route.
 
spbrian said:
Not to a legacy but I personally know one that went direct from Ameriflight to UPS and another that went from Ameriflight direct to Alaska. Both were about 8 years ago.
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You beat me to it. :)
I guess people think it's an old wives' tale since it was a while ago and there only a few there currently (if any) that was there around that time.
 
spbrian said:
Not to a legacy but I personally know one that went direct from Ameriflight to UPS and another that went from Ameriflight direct to Alaska. Both were about 8 years ago.
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Wasn't the chief pilots son? No prior military? There is always this underlying "in" that these guys had to get in. At least in the last decade or more.
 
Inverted said:
I hope you don't actually believe that lol.
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Well you know how I feel about the Metro. :)

However, I don't think any time is better than any other these days. 121, 135, military, jet, prop, piston, Metro, crew, single pilot, pax, boxes, ect... Meh, it's all the same.
 
UAL747400 said:
Well you know how I feel about the Metro. :)

However, I don't think any time is better than any other these days. 121, 135, military, jet, prop, piston, Metro, crew, single pilot, pax, boxes, ect... Meh, it's all the same.
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I have been called metro, that is my only experience with the Metro :p

Well I disagree with you that certain time isn't better than other, and so would the industry. AMF pilots are some of the best pilots in the world - at flying single pilot freight in ancient airplanes to crappy uncontrolled fields, at odd hours.

I think we can all agree that the foundational skills built at places like AMF are invaluable. Flying /A isn't easy, and it is a skill set for sure. But so is flying a completely automated, modern glass airplane in a multi-crew environment. Hell the plane I fly can't even be dispatched legally to fly green needle. 121 or 135 jet flying isn't harder, it is easier. Flying single pilot freight is harder any day of the week and that is an absolute fact. But it is different, and when it is different, HR gets to decide that 121 flying in an RJ is more relevant to flying a 737 in a 121 environment (I don't think anyone would disagree with that) but that means that a screen reader sitting in an office is going to hire those types of pilots. That isn't all companies but that is how lots of them are. Hell, Delta would rather hire a 2500 hour TT military pilot with C130 time than a 10,000 hour Bro pilot from AMF. Where is the logic in that!?

If there was truly a time when a Beech 99 drivers who previously flew a Seminole at a flight school, got hired at the top 3, then it will get back that way in come capacity at some point.
 
UAL747400 said:
I am surprised, because the last third of first page of the senority list hasn't been here more than 3 years...

Those that have come here in that time know where we stand with legacies. Now if you're saying that there are those that think we're better pilots and deserve consideration, yes, that still exists and I don't disagree. :)
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Though not many, there are actually still a few I see out there who believe they have a chance of going direct to the majors from here. One or two were in my new hire class 6 months ago.
 
A150K said:
Though not many, there are actually still a few I see out there who believe they have a chance of going direct to the majors from here. One or two were in my new hire class 6 months ago.
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I am not talking smack here so don't everyone jump all over me on this...

I think the reason they think that, is because there have been a few management types that have told them that. Saying that guys have left AMF to American, Delta or United isn't untrue, but it isn't the full story either. I know of 2 that were ex-military that came to AMF for currency, once they got it they were gone and I think the vast majority of those who have left AMF to a career airline job have had something prior to AMF that made them qualified. Unfortunately I think that has been used as a tool to get guys in, and keep them. I witnessed it when I was in indoc, as did many others.
 
Inverted said:
Wasn't the chief pilots son? No prior military? There is always this underlying "in" that these guys had to get in. At least in the last decade or more.
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Both had no prior experience in aviation outside of Ameriflight. The Alaska hire was a metro training captain and the UPS hire was just a straight metro captain.

Also in my 10 years I saw a couple go to Jet blue back when that was hard to accomplish, one went to Cathay.

Almost every single one of those people were at the company for 5 or more years.
 
Inverted said:
I am not talking smack here so don't everyone jump all over me on this...

I think the reason they think that, is because there have been a few management types that have told them that. Saying that guys have left AMF to American, Delta or United isn't untrue, but it isn't the full story either. I know of 2 that were ex-military that came to AMF for currency, once they got it they were gone and I think the vast majority of those who have left AMF to a career airline job have had something prior to AMF that made them qualified. Unfortunately I think that has been used as a tool to get guys in, and keep them. I witnessed it when I was in indoc, as did many others.
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Oh yeah, definitely. Some bought into it, but thankfully most were able to see through it.
 
spbrian said:
Both had no prior experience in aviation outside of Ameriflight. The Alaska hire was a metro training captain and the UPS hire was just a straight metro captain.

Also in my 10 years I saw a couple go to Jet blue back when that was hard to accomplish, one went to Cathay.

Almost every single one of those people were at the company for 5 or more years.
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No high up internal recs? Either way, that's great. But I think that is the pure exception, not the norm. Especially looking back 15 years.
 
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