Alcohol rules

FlyChicaga said:
On days we were bored, we'd call in and play "pass the phone" to get released. "I was wondering if I could get released? Yes? Awesome! Hold on, another guy wants to talk to you..." There were a few times the entire crashpad would get released by noon, and then started the poker games.
Click to expand...



HA! HA! A-HA! HA!.....ouch....


I don't know of anyone that's been released early from reserve here. It's never even occurred to me to try. There's a clause in our contract that if you're on reserve and your last flight cancels, they can hold you for an extra hour. They use it, too for those "just in case" moments. I know guys that have called trying it only to have a flight dropped on them. I also know of guys that have called scheduling to find off if the day the put in to drop was approved only to get JMed, too. I've even see FAs sitting airport reserve calling scheduling to get released early b/c all the flights have left, and they STILL can't get released. THAT'S just wrong.

Folks, this is why when picking an airline, you need to look the intangibles. PCL is not staffed properly. Oh, they'll tell the shareholders in the meetings that staffing is good, but reality is they're begging people to pick up open time and calling people for JM and extensions left and right, especially on the CA side of things. XJT, on the other hand, is staffed. Possibly OVER staffed. Basically, that means you've got a shot at getting more "me" time if you commute and are in a crashpad or an extra day with the family if you live in base.
 
Just don't push it. I really don't see a problem having a beer at dinner if you are off of reserve and you are at home but having one or two beers and going out and getting hammered when you only have 12 hours before your reserve window starts are two completly different things. I personally will only have one or two beers if I gotta fly or be available the next day and Ill only get really faced if I have the next couple days off to recover. Its always worked for me. :panic:
 
SoCalAprch said:
From our union: The contract has a "14-hour duty limimtation" with some exceptions (CDOs, deadheads back to base, etc.). This is calculated completely independently of the Whitlow requirements. According to the contract (and applicable only to contract compliance), reserve is not duty, so it therefore does not count against the 14 hour limitation. ...
Click to expand...

You are correct. But here's a quote from one of the Chief pilots of our company

" You aren't on duty sitting at home watching Opera when your reserve starts! "

Which is true, you aren't on duty. BUT, for duty time limitations (and this is a contractual thing I believe) the beginning of your reserve time counts towards your duty day limitation. They can only fly you 4 hours past your end reserve time.

Duty starts when you show up to work.
 
Airdale said:
You are correct. But here's a quote from one of the Chief pilots of our company

" You aren't on duty sitting at home watching Opera when your reserve starts! "

Which is true, you aren't on duty. BUT, for duty time limitations (and this is a contractual thing I believe) the beginning of your reserve time counts towards your duty day limitation. They can only fly you 4 hours past your end reserve time.

Duty starts when you show up to work.
Click to expand...

You need to know this, otherwise one day you're going to accept an illegal flight assignment and your certificates will be suspended.

Your company has said sitting at home on reserve is not duty, and the FAA doesn't care if it's duty or not. The FAA however is proof positive certain that sitting at home on reserve is NOT rest. This is not a "contractual thing", it's an FAA thing. There is no such thing as a "duty day limitation" as far as the FAA is concerned.

It's all about lookback rest and the ability to find the required rest. So if your reserve time is 12 hours, then you cannot fly past 4 hours after the end of that reserve time because you will not be able to lookback and find the required reduced rest of 8 hours. That's where the commonly held misconception about the "16 hour duty limitation" comes from.

However - let us say that on Day 1 you fly a lot (8 hours) AND on Day 2 you are scheduled for a 1.5 hour flight first thing. To accept the 1.5 hour flight, given that you are scheduled for > 9 hours of flying in 24 hours you must receive at least reduced rest of 9 hours between Day 1 and Day 2. You receive that rest and no more (well technically you can have 10:59 or rest and it's still reduced rest because you didn't get the required rest). After the 1.5 hour flight you are on reserve.

When must you be done on Day 2? You must be finished *15* hours (and more you must be dutied off, not just not flying) after you dutied on, because you are required to get 12 hours of compensatory rest that must start no later than 24 hours after the start of your reduced rest. So if you're living and dieing by the 16 hour duty day and you accept an assignment into that 16th hour, well that's an illegal flight.

You need to know this stuff, because the company may not assign and YOU MAY NOT ACCEPT an illegal schedule. Don't dismiss FAA regulations as "a contractual thing" because if you do the FAA may dismiss you as "no longer a pilot".

And finally - who sits at home on reserve watching Opera???? :-)
 
CFIse said:
You need to know this, otherwise one day you're going to accept an illegal flight assignment and your certificates will be suspended.

Your company has said sitting at home on reserve is not duty, and the FAA doesn't care if it's duty or not. The FAA however is proof positive certain that sitting at home on reserve is NOT rest. This is not a "contractual thing", it's an FAA thing. There is no such thing as a "duty day limitation" as far as the FAA is concerned.
Click to expand...


I never said Reserve was rest. Its not rest, but its not duty either. Its nothing more then a formality. Reserve time counts toward your duty day because it is not rest.
 
kellwolf said:
I don't know of anyone that's been released early from reserve here.
Click to expand...

There was a time, many, many moons ago, when that wasn't the case. Back when I was a lowly probie at Pineapple, we used to get released early almost every day of reserve. I bid for the 12-day off ready reserve lines (something else that hasn't existed in years) and would usually get released about 2-3 hours early. Those were the days of friendly schedulers (except for Holly bin-laden), long layovers, and adequate staffing. I even went six weeks without flying a single flight. Didn't last for too long after I got hired, though. About a year later Phildo had managed to destroy the airline and the morale. Such a shame. It really could have been a decent place to work.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top