Airvan GA10 Certified
- Thread starter RDoug
- Start date
Max gross takeoff weight under 5000 lbs, but it's a 10 pax plane? That seems quite low: if the average pax weighs 160 lbs and has 40 lbs of bags (not unreasonable) that means the plane plus fuel are roughly 2750 lbs. That's really lightweight. 450 horsepower is not a whole lot. No mention of useful load or max fuel, or FIKI. By contrast, the C-208 has a MGTOW of 9062 (with STC) and 675 HP (higher on the EX) and is FIKI approved. I wonder what the target market might be.
Also, the author says the GA8 is critically acclaimed, but that seems a stretch. I've not encountered any operators who sing its praises (and Grant doesn't count, as one of its principals is the Airvan distributor for Alaska).
Also, the author says the GA8 is critically acclaimed, but that seems a stretch. I've not encountered any operators who sing its praises (and Grant doesn't count, as one of its principals is the Airvan distributor for Alaska).
alaskadrifter
Landing gear operator
Meh
Roger Roger
I am le tired
Do remember that in other parts of the world where the bush people aren't fed on potato chips and coke the Caravan is considered a 14+ pax aircraft. The US is actually a tiny bit of the target market for these aircraft.
av8tr1
"Never tell me the odds!"
I've got a bit of time in the GA8 and really liked it. The cockpit was a bit cramped and the control wheel took some getting used to. Best way to describe was it felt like a plastic knock off of the 208. But I enjoyed flying it for the most part. For what it's used for up in Alaska it was pretty good. It's in no way a luxury ride but it works really well for the bush both frozen and jungle (much like many of the women I have dated). Also had a bit of time flying in CAP. It was a better platform for SAR than the 182s were. If they can increase the useful load, put some icing capabilities on it and keep it under a mil they might have a real competitor for the Van.
n57flyguy
Well-Known Member
I think the goal is the in between markets of the 208 and 206.
I liked the GA8 for the most part. Kind of quirky. Crosswinds were fun.
ppragman
No pasa nada.
What market is this though? The 207 market? The market for aircraft between 6 and 9 seats? The 206 (well an old 206) can carry around 1000 to 1200lbs legally, a Caravan carries about 2200 to 2600lbs legally? So this airplane is looking to carry 1600 to 1900lbs of stuff? Honestly, I really don't see a market for this in the US or Canada.
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
Depends on what the cost of the plane is. If its cheap enough, you could use it to replace something like a PA31 running for UPS.
n57flyguy
Well-Known Member
*I think*....thats what I was told when I was flying it but we had it set up for a completely different platform.
ppragman
No pasa nada.
Only if it is FIKI... that's actually a great way to make it work if the acquisition costs could be low enough, didn't think of that.
alaskadrifter
Landing gear operator
That and pt 135 limits capacity to 9 pax single pilot.
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
If the pilot crunch hits the freight carriers hard enough, I could see running these things 135 VFR in places like PHX, Texas, SoCal.
There are still plenty of Chieftains available for $250,000 or less, and even with a budget of $150,000 for avionics upgrades and gross weight STCs they will be much cheaper than a GA10. I haven't seen the GA10 price tag, but would be really, really surprised if it comes in anywhere close to $450,000.
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
Yet they'll have the dispatch reliability of a 1980's built piston twin.
SkyDogSilver
Chicken Kicker
I was doing mental gymnastics about this a few weeks ago, thinking about how long this market would have to continue and how tight the pilot pool would have to get for the industry to conduct a big, significant change in this regard.
I figure if it ever got that bad we'd see a return of the in-house cultivation of pilots, similar to what the Europe market does/did - sign a multi-year contract and they pay to train and slap the fresh green butt in the right seat flying the 91 legs until qualified for day VFR and then subsequently cut lose for full IFR rev flying. I'd think they'd do that before investing in a bunch of lower gross new freighters for twice the cost of a dirty older freighter with twice the payload. It's the American way - big, fast, and more than capable.
We all can agree, the market is cyclical. I think companies would do whatever they can to make do with the staff they got, waiting for the bottom to fall out, when they can be choosy and have their pick of the litter pilot-wise. Then they still have the aircraft to run big loads. Rather than buying up a fleet of these new GA10s, and then being stuck with twice the number of these AirVans doing piddily smaller loads; capped at a lower gross, with no wiggle room to expand. Just my opinion though...
Roger Roger
I am le tired
Why gamble on an unknown new aircraft built in Australia/India vs the established workhorse Caravan with the factory (and attendant parts and tech support) right there in Kansas? It'd have to be extremely cheap to buy and operate to make it attractive. Also they need to solve the durability issues they've had with the GA8.
Very true. Chieftains are maintenance hogs.