AirTran/SWA Seniority Integration Deal

[jtrain609]

Hey JTrain, I don't know you, I don't care to know you but, I am not on a high horse. I worked hard to get where I am at. I didn't say everyone wanted to work at SWA. I would have gone to Fedex or UPS, those where the places I had my app in at. Back in the day SWA was where people went cuz they couldn't get on anywhere else. So before you go judging people maybe you should get to know them big guy.

Before I go judging people?

You're judging that every pilot at AirTran wanted to work at Southwest, and only went to AirTran because they couldn't get an interview, or be selected to work at Southwest. You're assuming that nobody worked hard to get to AirTran, or that it was quite possibly a goal of theirs for any number of reasons. AirTran pilots didn't choose to be bought by Southwest, it's something that has been shoved on them whether they liked it or not.

So, again, get over yourself.

 

[cole]

WHERE in my post did I judge any FL pilot? Please qoute me on that. I said I worked hard to get where I was. I can tell you there were alot more guys leaving FL for SWA and probably 0 that left SWA for FL. That again is a fact, that is all it is. I'm not getting personal here so I am done talking to you and about this. Back to lurking. Also the 10s of millions to over a billion dollar benefit, is straight from the our union. I did not run the numbers myself sorry. And no matter how this goes through, I will continue to have a good time at work and with my fellow coworkers and take care of my passengers as they are the ones who afford me to live my life and provide for my family.

 

[dasleben]

This is going to sound harsh, but: You guys ever wonder why the regional guys on JC are the most outspoken? Because you guys run everyone else off to the point nobody cares to contribute anymore.

I'd personally like to see a SWA pilot or two stick around... I have no vested interest in JC, but you know, seems like varied experience would be good for the community and such... Just sayin'.

 

[jtrain609]

This is going to sound harsh, but: You guys ever wonder why the regional guys on JC are the most outspoken? Because you guys run everyone else off to the point nobody cares to contribute anymore.

I'd personally like to see a SWA pilot or two stick around... I have no vested interest in JC, but you know, seems like varied experience would be good for the community and such... Just sayin'.

I'm not positive, but I think I remember this guy saying the same stuff on the pipe.

You should have seen that one. Whether it was cole here or somebody else with the same sentiment, the fireworks were amazing.

 

[dasleben]

I'm not positive, but I think I remember this guy saying the same stuff on the pipe.

You should have seen that one. Whether it was cole here or somebody else with the same sentiment, the fireworks were amazing.

I should check out the pipe...been a while.

 

[Screaming_Emu]

This is going to sound harsh, but: You guys ever wonder why the regional guys on JC are the most outspoken? Because you guys run everyone else off to the point nobody cares to contribute anymore.

I'd personally like to see a SWA pilot or two stick around... I have no vested interest in JC, but you know, seems like varied experience would be good for the community and such... Just sayin'.

I would like to see a few SWA pilots around too, provided they use paragraphs

 

[greaper007]

I would like to see a few SWA pilots around too, provided they use paragraphs

With the pay bump everyone at Airtran gets, I'm not sure why they care about seniority. I'd be happy to be bumped into an FO seat for Capt pay at AirTran. The only reason I ever wanted to upgrade was to one, get enough money to not have to use credit cards every month. And two, get enough time to get the hell out of Colgan. Beyond that I didn't really care about seniority.

Just a disclaimer my dad's a senior (four digit employee number) capt at SWA so I guess I'm a little biased.

 

[dasleben]

With the pay bump everyone at Airtran gets, I'm not sure why they care about seniority. I'd be happy to be bumped into an FO seat for Capt pay at AirTran. The only reason I ever wanted to upgrade was to one, get enough money to not have to use credit cards every month. And two, get enough time to get the hell out of Colgan. Beyond that I didn't really care about seniority.

Just a disclaimer my dad's a senior (four digit employee number) capt at SWA so I guess I'm a little biased.

What about the future earnings potential of being able to hold a captain's seat at SWA? A pay bump in the short term still doesn't offset the future earnings of an upgrade.

 

[jtrain609]

Hell, how about the ability to hold something other than airport reserve while working weekends for the next 15 years! Pay is only part of the equation.

 

[Gonzo]

What about the future earnings potential of being able to hold a captain's seat at SWA? A pay bump in the short term still doesn't offset the future earnings of an upgrade.

I think his point is, that is all about pay and QOL, and SWA FOs have are paid more then AT CAs and have a better QOL. So who cares what seat you are in if you are getting paid more and have a better QOL.

 

[BeRich]

I think his point is, that is all about pay and QOL, and SWA FOs have are paid more then AT CAs and have a better QOL. So who cares what seat you are in if you are getting paid more and have a better QOL.

If you're sitting reserve weekends and holidays for the next 10 years as ATN says would be the case....pay is increasing, but QOL sure isn't.

 

[Gonzo]

If you're sitting reserve weekends and holidays for the next 10 years as ATN says would be the case....pay is increasing, but QOL sure isn't.

From some of the ATN guys I have talked to, yes sitting RSV at SWA will give them a better QOL then they currently have at ATN as line holders.

 

[BobDDuck]

With the pay bump everyone at Airtran gets, I'm not sure why they care about seniority. I'd be happy to be bumped into an FO seat for Capt pay at AirTran.

I think his point is, that is all about pay and QOL, and SWA FOs have are paid more then AT CAs and have a better QOL. So who cares what seat you are in if you are getting paid more and have a better QOL.

It matters because all that pay and quality of life stuff is negotiable. Seniority is set for the rest of your career. What if, 5 years from now Southwest is on the ropes and asks for a 30% pay cut across the board. Now, some guy who could have been a captain is still an FO making just about what he'd been making prior to the merger when before he'd have been a captain. What if the company suddenly decides to change their business model and adds a heavy type to the fleet to do international. It sure would be nice to be able to bid that for the pay/QOL/whatever but you need seniority to do it.

Again... Pay bumps shouldn't matter in an SLI.

From some of the ATN guys I have talked to, yes sitting RSV at SWA will give them a better QOL then they currently have at ATN as line holders.

See, I've heard the exact opposite. Apparently the dream schedules SWA guys have are built on the backs of reserves (who are well compensated for their misery).

 

[GaTechKid]

Having to work weekends and holiday is a huge blow to QOL for many people. We're talking about one LCC merging with another LCC, not Southwest purchasing SkyWest. The SLI deal is a complete windfall for Southwest pilots and I would vote no on it.

 

[WacoFan]

How is fair defined though, when it comes to one carrier acquiring another?

Having to work weekends and holiday is a huge blow to QOL for many people. We're talking about one LCC merging with another LCC, not Southwest purchasing SkyWest. The SLI deal is a complete windfall for Southwest pilots and I would vote no on it.

Yeah...but the one LLC is the most successful airline in the US, and the other LCC isn't. And, SWA is buying Air Tran.

 

[cole]

This is going to sound harsh, but: You guys ever wonder why the regional guys on JC are the most outspoken? Because you guys run everyone else off to the point nobody cares to contribute anymore.

I'd personally like to see a SWA pilot or two stick around... I have no vested interest in JC, but you know, seems like varied experience would be good for the community and such... Just sayin'.

This is a reason I don't like to post much. I am not one to be getting in a pissing match on a forum. I use to use this place to learn info about the industry and airlines when I was new, not come and start some arguments and throwing accusations out with people that have no dog in the fight. I learned a long time ago, people have their opinions and that is their right.

If anyone has questions that I could help with please send me a message.

Also SWA does not have airport ready reserve, please if you are going to spout off, have some facts. When we are correctly staffed, reserve guys can make the most money out of anyone, if they aren't getting used and live in base. Sorry about the use of paragraphs, my wife is the English major, I am just a dumb, that's why I became a pilot.

 

[MikeD]

This is a reason I don't like to post much. I am not one to be getting in a pissing match on a forum. I use to use this place to learn info about the industry and airlines when I was new, not come and start some arguments and throwing accusations out with people that have no dog in the fight. I learned a long time ago, people have their opinions and that is their right.

If anyone has questions that I could help with please send me a message.

Also SWA does not have airport ready reserve, please if you are going to spout off, have some facts. When we are correctly staffed, reserve guys can make the most money out of anyone, if they aren't getting used and live in base. Sorry about the use of paragraphs, my wife is the English major, I am just a dumb, that's why I became a pilot.

Good info.

As usual, there are 3 sides to every story: One side, the other side, and the truth.

Hearing all sides is good.

 

[MikeD]

Yeah...but the one LLC is the most successful airline in the US, and the other LCC isn't. And, SWA is buying Air Tran.

Thats the thing. Calling for fair and equity would seem to me to have different meanings depending on which side of the fence one finds themself in this whole equation of who is the purchaser and who is purchasee.

 

[Guy]

WHERE in my post did I judge any FL pilot? Please qoute me on that.

I was wondering the same thing and I never did see an answer to your question. Maybe he is working on getting over his own self and then he'll answer.

 

[pullup]

I'm still not seeing the unfairness here. Sure it sounds like upgrades will be a ways off but give this thing a year to shake out and it should start coming down.