Fencer
Experimentalist
No. You will go bankrupt on gas alone. I flew 425 hours in the last 10 months and boy it hurts on average paycheck.
AIrplane ownership cost
- Thread starter Kingairer
- Start date
No. You will go bankrupt on gas alone. I flew 425 hours in the last 10 months and boy it hurts on average paycheck.
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
I've been thinking about buying a Challenger II experimental. Not the best looking, not the quickest, but for just having fun at 80MPH, it does well. Can put it on floats too.
jrh
Well-Known Member
Like all tough questions in aviation, "It depends."
For me, yes. I love the freedom of being able to do whatever I want with my plane, whenever I want. There is no FBO or club telling me the plane isn't available when I want it. I can (and have) taken it around the pattern at midnight just to relax and clear my mind. Nobody will ever tell me I can't land it on grass or on a private strip or in winds that are stronger than x knots. I love the peace of mind in knowing the plane has been maintained and flown exactly the way I want it to, because nobody else has a stake in it other than me. I can leave my headset in the plane and the seat is always adjusted just the way I like it.
I love taking friends up for rides. I love going to pancake breakfasts on Saturday mornings and being able to say, "Yeah, that's my 140 over there." Because seriously...if you show up at a pancake breakfast with a rental 172, you're not as cool as me. I mean...you're cool. But not as cool as me.
I have made many, many amazing memories. I've flown it coast to coast on more than one occasion. I've taken it on several camping trips, including a few trips to the Oshkosh air show. I've seen and done things that most non-airplane owner pilots only dream about.
Flying my plane, since it's from 1946, is like experiencing a part of history (although some may argue the same can be said for flying at my current airline!). It brings me back to the simple fact, I straight up LOVE flying, like in the same way I loved it as a 50 hour private pilot. It's simple and pure. It's the kind of flying that reminds me why I wanted to be a pilot when I was a kid.
Now, here's the kicker I try not to think about: I have no idea how much money I've dropped in to my plane over the years. Between the initial purchase, maintenance, gas, insurance, etc. I wouldn't be surprised if it were $40,000 or $50,000 I've spent.
I'm a young guy. I bought the plane when I was 23. If I'd taken the money I've spent on flying and put it into conservative investments, I could have turned it into $1,000,000 by the time I retire. Literally.
But then I ask myself, how has owning this plane shaped my life? Would I trade those experiences and memories for $1 million as an old man?
I don't think I would.
YMMV.
I really, really, really hate this response. You know why? Because it completely blows up my response (and my own internal arguments against ownership). You're exactly right; what you describe is exactly why I want my own plane and I hate you for making me think about it. I was pretty happy in my little "all I need is a flying club" bubble. We can't be friends.
EIR
It's 5 o'clock somewhere
Cherokee 180 - Definitely not a hangar queen (200hrs/yr)
Annuals: $800 + parts. (Average for the past 15 years: $1500)
Hangar: $240 + electric
Insurance: $600/yr
Brian29
Well-Known Member
Honest answer...... Yes but only because it is my fathers aircraft and he pays all the major bills and I get to fly a SR-22 G3 for less than $100/hr wet.
I can tell you that I see all the money that goes into ownership (from his 172 to his SR-20 to the SR-22), the headaches involved with MX, and everything else involved with ownership and I know he wouldn' have it any other way.
I can tell you that I see all the money that goes into ownership (from his 172 to his SR-20 to the SR-22), the headaches involved with MX, and everything else involved with ownership and I know he wouldn' have it any other way.
texas_pilot
Well-Known Member
Does making your plane available for rental (for training),
make it a tax deduction?
rframe
pǝʇɹǝʌuı
Sort of. I have a legitimate business setup and I can deduct some operational business expenses, but not everything is deductible. There is a lot of headache and liability involved in operating a rental. I do it because there are very few rental or instruction options in my area and I wanted to help keep general aviation alive, particularly for the 'average Joe', but I very often have to wrestle with whether I'll continue to do it.
Generally, it is not something that makes owning an airplane cheaper, unless you're leasing back to a big FBO or school that is keeping the airplane flying a LOT... and in that case you dont have access to your own airplane
Richman
JC’s Resident Curmudgeon
Costs can vary WILDLY depending on what part of the country you are in, and how anal retentive you are about your airplane.
For instance, if you are in Cal, South Florida, or near NYC, your cost for a hangar will be in orbit, if you can find one at all. In SoFL, for instance, if you want a hangar that's anywhere near civilization (about an hour), a simple hangar that won't fall down if you pee against the side of it is going to run you north of $600/mo. The alternative is to tie it down outside, in what is probably the absolute worst envrionment for aircraft in the US.
I tried to save some money on this, and went with a shade port. Every time I went out to futz with the bird, it was covered with crap (sometimes literally). The deterioration I saw on the airplane just in those few months just wasn't worth it. Now if you live somewhere else where the weather is nicer, don't necessarily need a hangar, but then again, hangars are probably cheap where you don't really need them.
MX is the other wild variable. If you are proactive, source your own parts, do owner assisted annuals, and are otherwise an engaged owner, your MX bill will be considerably less than someone who throws the keys to the FBO when a light bulb needs to be changed, and chances are your airplane will be in much better shape.
Insurance and fuel are relative constants. When I bought my airplane, I planned on $5/gal fuel, and it's kinda sorta hovered around that (yea, it's a little high right now).
When you first get into your airplane, you need to have a strong capital reserve, because crap always comes up. Minimum of $10k or %10 of the purchase price, whichever higher.
Richman
For instance, if you are in Cal, South Florida, or near NYC, your cost for a hangar will be in orbit, if you can find one at all. In SoFL, for instance, if you want a hangar that's anywhere near civilization (about an hour), a simple hangar that won't fall down if you pee against the side of it is going to run you north of $600/mo. The alternative is to tie it down outside, in what is probably the absolute worst envrionment for aircraft in the US.
I tried to save some money on this, and went with a shade port. Every time I went out to futz with the bird, it was covered with crap (sometimes literally). The deterioration I saw on the airplane just in those few months just wasn't worth it. Now if you live somewhere else where the weather is nicer, don't necessarily need a hangar, but then again, hangars are probably cheap where you don't really need them.
MX is the other wild variable. If you are proactive, source your own parts, do owner assisted annuals, and are otherwise an engaged owner, your MX bill will be considerably less than someone who throws the keys to the FBO when a light bulb needs to be changed, and chances are your airplane will be in much better shape.
Insurance and fuel are relative constants. When I bought my airplane, I planned on $5/gal fuel, and it's kinda sorta hovered around that (yea, it's a little high right now).
When you first get into your airplane, you need to have a strong capital reserve, because crap always comes up. Minimum of $10k or %10 of the purchase price, whichever higher.
Richman
Bernoulli Fan
Controller
What taxes are those exactly?
exneophyte
Well-Known Member
Not an owner, but I'd guess it depends on the plane.
rframe
pǝʇɹǝʌuı
5 hours per month? Yes for a light single that'd be about right. But remember, it's very easy to have $2,000-5,000 of unexpected maintenance pop up, especially in the first couple years of owning. Crack a cylinder or muffler, loose a gyro, vacuum pumps are only good for about 500 hours, mags will probably get overhauled at 500, radio starts acting weird and needs some bench work, various AD's on different airframes, etc etc... you really need to budget for the unexpected, its going to happen.
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
Property tax, I'd imagine.
Kingairer
'Tiger Team' Member
Thanks for all the help....
I wanted to pass this website I found in my search to, an insurance estimator https://www.aopaia.com/quik_insurance.cfm
I wanted to pass this website I found in my search to, an insurance estimator https://www.aopaia.com/quik_insurance.cfm
Inverted25
Well-Known Member
keep this in mind when deciding what plane you want and what you want in it. The more bells and whistles the more mx it will probably need over time. If you just want something to get in the air you can't go wrong with something like a colt or tripacer
drunkenbeagle
Gang Member
200-300hours/year is probably more realistic.
There are a lot of fixed costs that add up. I spend a lot of time in the hanger these days, trust me.
And it is nice being able to take the plane that best fits the trip you want to take. 300m cross county for 5 pax? Turbo 206 @ 250/hour is perfect. $100 hamburger? Nice to be able to take a 152...