Airline Pilots Are Glorified Bus Drivers

[dasleben]

Not this again!

 

[g4downin]

Not this again!

LOL

 

[Firebird2XC]

Lots of pilots though...they feel this need to wax eloquent about how special soaring through the clouds really is, or quickly identify themselves as pilots, or other shows of importance. The constant need to assert that they are NOT simply bus drivers - they are significantly more. Where does that come from and why? This kind of reeks of insecurity in many ways. Do you think that it is this sense of insecurity that allow management to play the games they do and get many pilots to fly for peanuts? Or, do you think that managements ability to get pilots to fly for peanuts has caused the insecurity? Is there some form of ingrained insecurity that exists that first caused pilots to cave to management, and then has helped slowly erode the profession?

Excellent question! I think the answer for many is 'yes'. The canned stereotype of the profession leads to certain expectations of the life of a pilot. Expectations are just problems we create for our future selves. That said, those expectations exist and are quite common. A great many pilots, myself included, have often wrestled with the difference of our expectations and the realities of the job. Once I started trying to put those aside, it brought a certain kind of freedom and flexibility- when I stopped worrying about what this life was *not* and let it be what it *is*.. and then decided I could let it become whatever I wanted.. well. Management gets away with less every day. It's not always a perfect process, but nothing ever really is. On the upward swell, we are.

I'm insecure because I was bad at sports as a kid. Always picked last for dodgeball.

That said, I agree 100% with WacoFan. We're no better than anyone else. This is just a job.

The job makes us no better than anyone else. But possessing the skill set to do a job that requires very precise things is valuable. Not all pilots could drive a bus. Not all bus drivers could fly a plane. Apples and oranges, really.

WacoFan called me Dick Van Patten once, so I'm going to quote Wayne's World:

"Was it Kierkegaard, or, Dick Van Patten, who said, If you label me, you negate me?" Funny thing about labeling people- it implies a relative nature to the labeler. When we label others, we also label ourselves.

 

[Goonie]

It may be subjective, but it is pretty apparent if you know the difference. I have known people who do construction and I would consider professional as well.

Gotcha.

I misunderstood you. I thought you were implying that NO construction workers could be considered professionals.

 

[brent p h]

Let's say you were a bus driver, and you got what you considered to be decent pay, with decent benefits, and you felt that, overall, your job conditions were decent. The problem with your job would be???

Why did you think having your career being called "Glorified Bus Driver" was a "slap in the face"? What is wrong with being a bus driver?

If you think being a pilot is beneath you, then quit. All the more for me.

cliff
AMS

Good thread!!! Its scary that cab drivers / greyhound drivers earn more than pilots... a friend of mine became an ATC and got hired at SoCal Approach. He makes around $130,000 a year.
I agree that they should pay more then a full time job at Mcdonalds, but thats just the way it is.

 

[embraer07]

Is there a way, that every time somebody asks why pilots are paid so little they can automatically be redirected to any of 7700's posts in this thread?

If only surgeons viewed their profession as being no different than a butcher I'm sure we could all go under the knife for $19.99.

7700: Why couldn't you have become a doctor?

On the other hand, this gentleman sums it up real nice:

In a lot of ways pilots are closer to astronauts than anything else.

Actually..say.. When they were recruiting the first astronauts.. how many were pilots? How many were bus drivers?

Thank you, Firebird for injecting some logic into this thread.

 

[wrxpilot]

Is there a way, that every time somebody asks why pilots are paid so little they can automatically be redirected to any of 7700's posts in this thread?

If only surgeons viewed their profession as being no different than a butcher I'm sure we could all go under the knife for $19.99.

7700: Why couldn't you have become a doctor?

On the other hand, this gentleman sums it up real nice:



Thank you, Firebird for injecting some logic into this thread.

As 7700 moves on from flight instructing and starts to gain more experience as a professional pilot, he'll eventually understand there's a little more to it than "flipping switches and pushing buttons".

 

[wrxpilot]

Good thread!!! Its scary that cab drivers / greyhound drivers earn more than pilots... a friend of mine became an ATC and got hired at SoCal Approach. He makes around $130,000 a year.
I agree that they should pay more then a full time job at Mcdonalds, but thats just the way it is.

Nobody makes that much starting put in ATC. They pay their dues just like we do.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

You guys really think highly of yourselves. This job is really more about attention to detail than any superhuman knowledge or skill.

 

[jtrain609]

You guys really think highly of yourselves. This job is really more about attention to detail than any superhuman knowledge or skill.

I'm not sure what you're talking about. EVERY flight is a life and death struggle between us, superhuman god like creatures known as pilots, and our nemesis; nature.

Without US, people would DIE. DIE horrible deaths because they didn't have somebody as good as US up front!!!



But really, I think this job requires an interesting combo of hand eye coordination, attention to detail and the ability to solve spatial problems quickly/easily that many people don't have. I think many people can do most the things that this job requires ok most of the time, but to do it at a high level all of the time can be a tall order for many people.

 

[Bumblebee]

I'm not sure what you're talking about. EVERY flight is a life and death struggle between the superhuman god like creature known as bumblebee, and his nemesis; nature.





But really, I think this job requires an interesting combo of hand eye coordination, attention to detail and the ability to solve spatial problems quickly/easily that many people don't have. I think many people can do most the things that this job requires ok most of the time, but to do it at a high level all of the time can be a tall order for many people.

You sure do think highly of me John....appropriately.

 

[TWP]

How so?

He said being being a bus driver is a "job almost anyone can do".

So is being a pilot if you have the money or credit. Am I wrong?

Yes, you are wrong.

 

[wrxpilot]

You guys really think highly of yourselves. This job is really more about attention to detail than any superhuman knowledge or skill.

Are you saying that attention to detail is something that most people are endowed with? You must certainly have different interactions with the general public than I do.

 

[derg]

Sure it's life or death.

Classic example.

You're on a bus and the bus driver passes out. Out of 30 people, say at least 28* of them probably can mash the brakes and bring the bus to a semi-smooth stop.

You're on a 747-400 and the pilots disappear during the "rapture". Out of 450 people, well, chances are you're just doing to be running out of gas and making a nice MACH descent at .81 into the Mojave.


*Statistic pulled directly out of my butt.

 

[jynxyjoe]

Sure it's life or death.

Classic example.

You're on a bus and the bus driver passes out. Out of 30 people, say at least 28* of them probably can mash the brakes and bring the bus to a semi-smooth stop.

You're on a 747-400 and the pilots disappear during the "rapture". Out of 450 people, well, chances are you're just doing to be running out of gas and making a nice MACH descent at .81 into the Mojave.


*Statistic pulled directly out of my butt.

But but but but but the airplane flies itself and autopilot computer they work with atc together and you're fine.

 

[derg]

Ha! Yeeeeeeah!

I'm starting to have concerns about our mission... Dave...

 

[jynxyjoe]

Ha! Yeeeeeeah!

I'm starting to have concerns about our mission... Dave...

DPA 5000. Doesn't have the same ring as HAL but whatever.

 

[CoffeeIcePapers]

Sure it's life or death.

Classic example.

You're on a bus and the bus driver passes out. Out of 30 people, say at least 28* of them probably can mash the brakes and bring the bus to a semi-smooth stop.

You're on a 747-400 and the pilots disappear during the "rapture". Out of 450 people, well, chances are you're just doing to be running out of gas and making a nice MACH descent at .81 into the Mojave.


*Statistic pulled directly out of my butt.

According to Turbulence 3, as long as you have some MS Flight sim experience, it is a piece of cake.

 

[ChasenSFO]

A lot of people could never even earn their private, don't kid yourselves. And I never plan to drive anything for a living. I plan to fly stuff. Big difference. And if you have the attitude that flying is just a job and you're just like anyone else, no one is ever going to think you deserve to be paid much more than everyone else. Do you ever see an athlete go on the record saying playing in the NFL is just a job and they're really average people? Its all in the image and public perception. Ever seen footage of a 60/70s airline pilot walking around an airport terminal? You could tell from the way they strolled around how highly they thought of themselves. They thought they were badass, the public thought they were badass, they were paid accordingly. Pilots start talking about how easy newer airplanes are to fly, programs start saying you can be an airline pilot in 90 days, bitching about the career becomes public and widespread, and poof, the public image takes a huge hit.

As much as I think the majority of the flying public couldn't add 2 single digit numbers together, the fact is what they think directly reflects the profession. Talking about how "easy" flying is won't help. Flying is not easy. Scanning a boarding pass as a passenger boards a plane is easy. Maybe even monitoring auto-pilot for hours could be "easy". But flying a fully-loaded 172 at night in moderate turbulence over mountains, hauling freight thru a thunderstorm in a 40 year old turboprop that's falling apart, formation aerobatics inches off the wing of another airplane, fire bombing in a P-3, fighting an airplane that's suffered a structural failure, flying close air support under AA fire, or ditching an airliner aren't. All are different walks of flying, and they all take skill, balls, and aptitude. Most people could never do that stuff. Maybe you think your flying job is easy, but don't speak for everyone else by saying "flying" is easy. You're kidding yourself if you think otherwise.

 

[Bumblebee]

Maybe you think your flying job is easy, but don't speak for everyone else by saying "flying" is easy. You're kidding yourself if you think otherwise.

out of the mouth of babes....