A note to the new folks. This is a workplace.

[roundout]

The place to practice raw data is in the sim. Not with paying passengers in the back.

Our FOM requires us to be proficient with all levels of automation, including level none. Are you suggesting that hand flying a visual approach in VMC daylight conditions is in some way unsafe?

 

[mikecweb]

The place to practice raw data is in the sim. Not with paying passengers in the back.

I've yet to hear a complaint from the boxes.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Our FOM requires us to be proficient with all levels of automation, including level none. Are you suggesting that hand flying a visual approach in VMC daylight conditions is in some way unsafe?

I'm saying it's less safe, yes. But keep in mind that I also want to eliminate all human drivers and replace with mandatory autopilots, so my opinion of apes operating heavy machinery is decidedly negative.

 

[SteveC]

The place to practice raw data is in the sim. Not with paying passengers in the back.

Us "corpies" (TM: CC) would use empty legs.

 

[roundout]

I'm saying it's less safe, yes.

got any data to back that up?

operating a a plane with deferred autothrust is also less safe than when everything is operational, but it would be even less safe if the crew wasn’t proficient at flying without autothrust.

But keep in mind that I also want to eliminate all human drivers and replace with mandatory autopilots, so my opinion of apes operating heavy machinery is decidedly negative.

I agree, this day can’t come soon enough. When it does, I’ll be with you in line to buy a capable car.

 

[CoffeeIcePapers]

It’s an Airbus thing, you wouldn’t understand.
Seriously though, sometimes we turn off everything and hand fly.

No you don’t. It’s an airbus.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

got any data to back that up?

No, I’ll freely admit that it’s purely an opinion. It stands to reason, but I’m not aware of any data available for it.

operating a a plane with deferred autothrust is also less safe than when everything is operational, but it would be even less safe if the crew wasn’t proficient at flying without autothrust.

To which my answer would be, a plane shouldn’t be dispatched without autothrust.

 

[roundout]

No, I’ll freely admit that it’s purely an opinion. It stands to reason, but I’m not aware of any data available for it.

I like you

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

To which my answer would be, a plane shouldn’t be dispatched without autothrust.

This is why I'm not concerned about an automated future and job loss en mass. We can't even keep the escalators running at my base. They have been broken in the N gates and entry to the main terminal for about a week now. Sure we can have AI that's capable of flying people better than I can. However, maintaining the infrastructure to keep that ball rolling isn't a priority for our society. We can't even fix basic things. It's cheaper to keep overworked and under paid pilots in the cockpit to just fly airplanes with 3-5 MEL items on a constant basis with 10-20 deferred items in the cabin.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

This is why I'm not concerned about an automated future and job loss en mass. We can't even keep the escalators running at my base. They have been broken in the N gates and entry to the main terminal for about a week now. Sure we can have AI that's capable of flying people better than I can. However, maintaining the infrastructure to keep that ball rolling isn't a priority for our society. We can't even fix basic things. It's cheaper to keep overworked and under paid pilots in the cockpit to just fly airplanes with 3-5 MEL items on a constant basis with 10-20 deferred items in the cabin.

Eh, I think you underestimate the cost savings of getting rid of pilots.

 

[Hiboglossi]

Eh, I think you underestimate the cost savings of getting rid of pilots.

Especially since major airline pilots are quite well paid. I think the biggest obstacle to autonomous airliners will be regulatory. In fact, the FAA is slow enough that I could see automation of other people's jobs killing demand for air travel and rendering many pilots obsolete even before pilotless airliners do.

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

Eh, I think you underestimate the cost savings of getting rid of pilots.

An automated future isn't free either. I don't see the bean counters and board who ruin our society for quarterly numbers making a long term investment in an infrastructure that costs more than underpaying me.

 

[derg]

In the 350, everything is effectively an ILS approach (SLS, GLS, etc). The only question is if you can autoland or not.

 

[roundout]

This is why I'm not concerned about an automated future and job loss en mass. We can't even keep the escalators running at my base. They have been broken in the N gates and entry to the main terminal for about a week now. Sure we can have AI that's capable of flying people better than I can. However, maintaining the infrastructure to keep that ball rolling isn't a priority for our society. We can't even fix basic things. It's cheaper to keep overworked and under paid pilots in the cockpit to just fly airplanes with 3-5 MEL items on a constant basis with 10-20 deferred items in the cabin.

They can probably hire 5 escalator mechanics or 3 airplane mechanics with every Captain they eliminate, though the money comes from different places. But who flies the plane when the ground datalink to the drone control center is what's deferred? taps forehead

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

An automated future isn't free either. I don't see the bean counters and board who ruin our society for quarterly numbers making a long term investment in an infrastructure that costs more than underpaying me.

You should probably look at your company's P&L at some point and see just how much labor costs an airline. This isn't some theoretical long-term payoff investment. Once the technology is there, they'll be tripping over themselves to get it installed to get rid of you. Especially since underpaying you isn't really an option anymore with the pilot shortage. If 777 captains were making $200/hr again like they were after 9/11, maybe. But not today, brother.

 

[JordanD]

In the 350, everything is effectively an ILS approach (SLS, GLS, etc). The only question is if you can autoland or not.

Some places still haven’t taken LOC approaches out of their op specs. :-/

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

You should probably look at your company's P&L at some point and see just how much labor costs an airline. This isn't some theoretical long-term payoff investment. Once the technology is there, they'll be tripping over themselves to get it installed to get rid of you. Especially since underpaying you isn't really an option anymore with the pilot shortage. If 777 captains were making $200/hr again like they were after 9/11, maybe. But not today, brother.

I've been having this conversation with my engineer friends who worked at Uber since like 2011. I remember them sitting around a laughing at how they were going to replace me. I wasn't concerned then. I'm even less concerned now.

They were supposed to replace Uber drivers ages ago and all they have managed to do is about 5/8 of F all. I'm completely unconcerned about automation because our society can't get out of it's own way to make any kind of progress at all. Sure, you could replace a captain and hire IT workers who were qualified to work outside in dangerous environments to maintain automation infrastructure for cheaper. The thing is that those workers don't exist. They aren't being trained. Because of inaction and more incompetence. No one can even think that far ahead. That is how pathetic our society is. They won't even be available for 20 years or more. If we started now and we aren't doing that. We aren't even beginning to see the impact that not sending our kids to school for a couple of years will have and all the sudden we have an army of tech workers that are not afraid to get their hands dirty?

Our society is pathetic. Look at the airplane I fly. It's an unmitigated complete POS. Like you'd have to try to make something that is that big of a nightmare for everyone involved. The passengers, FAs, pilots, ground crew. It's horrible for all of us and we'll be flying that monstrosity long after I retire due to inaction and incompetence on the grandest scale imaginable.

I can't even imagine how we got to this point. A relative helped design that airplane. He died in the early 2000s in his 90s. All of the sudden we are going to not need pilots anymore? LOL our society is barely capable of functioning. Some would argue it doesn't at all. Our society is trash that is growing with a cancer esq rapidity that will only result in more misery and broken dreams for those smart enough to imagine a better future. It will never happen.

"Born to late to explore the world. Born too soon to explore the stars. Born just in time to browse dank memes." That's our reality. Anything better than that is just mental masturbation. It doesn't exist.

 

[ozziecat35]

You were right. No question about it. And I'm changing the subject with surprising regularity. Thankfully I'm also a varsity level slam clicker.

Only problem is that it's the cultural norm here to buy probationary FOs meals and the beverage of their choice.

As Sheldon might say, it's a non-optional social convention.

I’m legit 50/50 with Cappys and that tradition here. I don’t assume, if they ask what I’m doing afterwards, I’ll give them my plans, but I also don’t offer it up. If it happens cool, but I just want to go to sleep half the time anyways.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

I've been having this conversation with my engineer friends who worked at Uber since like 2011. I remember them sitting around a laughing at how they were going to replace me. I wasn't concerned then. I'm even less concerned now.

They were supposed to replace Uber drivers ages ago and all they have managed to do is about 5/8 of F all. I'm completely unconcerned about automation because our society can't get out of it's own way to make any kind of progress at all. Sure, you could replace a captain and hire IT workers who were qualified to work outside in dangerous environments to maintain automation infrastructure for cheaper. The thing is that those workers don't exist. They aren't being trained. Because of inaction and more incompetence. No one can even think that far ahead. That is how pathetic our society is. They won't even be available for 20 years or more. If we started now and we aren't doing that. We aren't even beginning to see the impact that not sending our kids to school for a couple of years will have and all the sudden we have an army of tech workers that are not afraid to get their hands dirty?

Our society is pathetic. Look at the airplane I fly. It's an unmitigated complete POS. Like you'd have to try to make something that is that big of a nightmare for everyone involved. The passengers, FAs, pilots, ground crew. It's horrible for all of us and we'll be flying that monstrosity long after I retire due to inaction and incompetence on the grandest scale imaginable.

I can't even imagine how we got to this point. A relative helped design that airplane. He died in the early 2000s in his 90s. All of the sudden we are going to not need pilots anymore? LOL our society is barely capable of functioning. Some would argue it doesn't at all. Our society is trash that is growing with a cancer esq rapidity that will only result in more misery and broken dreams for those smart enough to imagine a better future. It will never happen.

"Born to late to explore the world. Born too soon to explore the stars. Born just in time to browse dank memes." That's our reality. Anything better than that is just mental masturbation. It doesn't exist.

Dude, shouldn’t you be on a ledge somewhere?

 

[Wardogg]

I've been having this conversation with my engineer friends who worked at Uber since like 2011. I remember them sitting around a laughing at how they were going to replace me. I wasn't concerned then. I'm even less concerned now.

They were supposed to replace Uber drivers ages ago and all they have managed to do is about 5/8 of F all. I'm completely unconcerned about automation because our society can't get out of it's own way to make any kind of progress at all. Sure, you could replace a captain and hire IT workers who were qualified to work outside in dangerous environments to maintain automation infrastructure for cheaper. The thing is that those workers don't exist. They aren't being trained. Because of inaction and more incompetence. No one can even think that far ahead. That is how pathetic our society is. They won't even be available for 20 years or more. If we started now and we aren't doing that. We aren't even beginning to see the impact that not sending our kids to school for a couple of years will have and all the sudden we have an army of tech workers that are not afraid to get their hands dirty?

Our society is pathetic. Look at the airplane I fly. It's an unmitigated complete POS. Like you'd have to try to make something that is that big of a nightmare for everyone involved. The passengers, FAs, pilots, ground crew. It's horrible for all of us and we'll be flying that monstrosity long after I retire due to inaction and incompetence on the grandest scale imaginable.

I can't even imagine how we got to this point. A relative helped design that airplane. He died in the early 2000s in his 90s. All of the sudden we are going to not need pilots anymore? LOL our society is barely capable of functioning. Some would argue it doesn't at all. Our society is trash that is growing with a cancer esq rapidity that will only result in more misery and broken dreams for those smart enough to imagine a better future. It will never happen.

"Born to late to explore the world. Born too soon to explore the stars. Born just in time to browse dank memes." That's our reality. Anything better than that is just mental masturbation. It doesn't exist.

My friend. Have you seen this video?

Our existence is so depressing. Humans are so insignificant in the grand scheme of the universe its a wonder we still exist at all.