2009 to be a rough year except for Mesaba.......

pilotlight

Well-Known Member
Looks like Mesaba will be the only regional airline for delta connection that will not be either furloughing or on the verge of furloughing. I myself am a pinnacle dude and I accept that times are tough right now and we are not going to hire or upgrade for a long time and we might even furlough. i just hope we can get a contract soon. As I look around though I see comair getting screwed, I see ASA maybe furloughing when they deserve something with the changes they have made in the last couple years, Shuttle and republic are just starting to recall furloughs, Compass is stagnant and so up in the air, skywest is not hiring, and mesa is going to get cut. Then there is Mesaba which is the golden child for now anyways. I have nothing against mesaba pilots but it would be nice to see the Comair and ASA guys get some good news. I just wonder how it is all going to end up.
 

ppragman

FLIPY FLAPS!
Looks like Mesaba will be the only regional airline for delta connection that will not be either furloughing or on the verge of furloughing. I myself am a pinnacle dude and I accept that times are tough right now and we are not going to hire or upgrade for a long time and we might even furlough. i just hope we can get a contract soon. As I look around though I see comair getting screwed, I see ASA maybe furloughing when they deserve something with the changes they have made in the last couple years, Shuttle and republic are just starting to recall furloughs, Compass is stagnant and so up in the air, skywest is not hiring, and mesa is going to get cut. Then there is Mesaba which is the golden child for now anyways. I have nothing against mesaba pilots but it would be nice to see the Comair and ASA guys get some good news. I just wonder how it is all going to end up.
Ehh, I don't think it will really be that bad, I tend to think that te economy with work its way back together by next summer, and things will start to make sense again. No sense worrying about an uncertain future in aviation, because you'd be worrying all the time.
 

LOGS

Well-Known Member
If fuel prices remain where they're at, I would expect expansion across the board.

=Jason-
 

ftyflyboy

Well-Known Member
Looks like Mesaba will be the only regional airline for delta connection that will not be either furloughing or on the verge of furloughing. I myself am a pinnacle dude and I accept that times are tough right now and we are not going to hire or upgrade for a long time and we might even furlough. i just hope we can get a contract soon. As I look around though I see comair getting screwed, I see ASA maybe furloughing when they deserve something with the changes they have made in the last couple years, Shuttle and republic are just starting to recall furloughs, Compass is stagnant and so up in the air, skywest is not hiring, and mesa is going to get cut. Then there is Mesaba which is the golden child for now anyways. I have nothing against mesaba pilots but it would be nice to see the Comair and ASA guys get some good news. I just wonder how it is all going to end up.
looks like a lump of coal for you, Mr. Happy
 

kellwolf

Piece of Trash
After nearly 3 years, the doom and gloom memos from management just don't have any effect on me. Simply put, if we downgrade, nothing I can do personally is gonna change it, so why stress over it? This company has a rep for saying one thing to scare everyone into thinking the sky is falling, then something the exact opposite happens. Examples:

Sign this contract or we're gonna lose our NWA flying to Mesaba! New ASA signed with NWA shortly afterwards.
We can't get any more flying unless you sign this deal! Shortly afterwards, flying announced with Delta.
We don't have the money for those kind of pay rates! Company buys Colgan, Q400s, CRJ-900s and loses millions in auction rate exchanges.

So, I'm taking a "wait and see" attitude on the whole memo thing that came out. If last week was any indication, the slightest hiccup in the system or another snow storm will wipe out a quarter's worth of profits if we downgrade thanks to canceled flights due to lack of CAs.

IMO, the company knows they're short on FOs, and instead of hiring more, they'd rather see if they can save some $$$ while "fixing" their FO problem at the same time.
 

SoCalAprch

Well-Known Member
No one is any safer than anyone else. If Delta decides to get rid of the Saabs at Mesaba that's half the seniority list right there... (not saying there is any truth to that but just what ifs...) While I see Mesaba having a good foot to stand on during the whole integration I don't think its any better off than Compass, Pinnacle, Shubuliqua, or ASA/SkyWest. Unfortunately Comair is too expensive for the product and well Freedom can't buy an on-time arrival. Also being wholly owned has it perks but it also has some obvious downsides. Since you are wholly owned Delta can cut back your flying whenever it pleases where as Shupubliqua and ASA/SkyWest have contracts in place that last several years and can't really be messed with outside of BK court. Look at what Delta has done to Comair in the past 6 months. If this were a private company they would have had to go through the contractual channels to cut that flying and it would have taken years to scale back the amount of flying that Delta took in a matter of weeks. Mesaba is going to be a powerful operator for Delta right now but once the seniority list starts to look as senior as Comair's it will be the same story there. Also don't they have a flowback or flowthrough program with NWA?
 

kellwolf

Piece of Trash
Who knows if the flowthrough/flowbacks are gonna stay intact at the "New Delta." Doug has a point when he brings up Delta's hiring practices, so I don't know. I also don't know the contractual language that goes along with it, so they may be forced into it. I flew with an FO that is in the pool for NWA the other night, and he said Delta won't even give a straight answer if those guys are in the hiring pool still or not. Poor guy was a CA on the 727 at Champion, was hired at NWA and now he's an FO at Pinnacle on ready reserve. I feel for him.

Contract carriers need to hold their management accountable. IMO, I don't really trust ours. If it meant leverage on the pilot contract, it wouldn't surprise me one bit for PT to "renegotiate" our deal with Delta to bring down our flying. Contractually, we can't go below the number of airframes we have now, but that can be re-negotiated. Although, doing so might finally make the board of directors sit up and take notice that maybe the management at PCL needs an overhaul.
 

WalterSobchak

Well-Known Member
Looks like Mesaba will be the only regional airline for delta connection that will not be either furloughing or on the verge of furloughing. I myself am a pinnacle dude and I accept that times are tough right now and we are not going to hire or upgrade for a long time and we might even furlough. i just hope we can get a contract soon. As I look around though I see comair getting screwed, I see ASA maybe furloughing when they deserve something with the changes they have made in the last couple years, Shuttle and republic are just starting to recall furloughs, Compass is stagnant and so up in the air, skywest is not hiring, and mesa is going to get cut. Then there is Mesaba which is the golden child for now anyways. I have nothing against mesaba pilots but it would be nice to see the Comair and ASA guys get some good news. I just wonder how it is all going to end up.
You must have not been in the industry when Mesaba was taking a beating because a company called Express I sold their soul to get shiny 50 seaters.
 

surreal1221

Well-Known Member
Nuh-uh!

Stop lieing guys!

Everything will be perfect!

We'll be hiring people with 250TT FOREVER. CRJ TRANSITION COURSES ARE MAKING A COMEBACK. STOP BEING SO NEGATIVE. SHEESH!

We're suppose to be uplifting not depressing, DUH!?
 

SoCalAprch

Well-Known Member
Who knows if the flowthrough/flowbacks are gonna stay intact at the "New Delta." Doug has a point when he brings up Delta's hiring practices, so I don't know. I also don't know the contractual language that goes along with it, so they may be forced into it. I flew with an FO that is in the pool for NWA the other night, and he said Delta won't even give a straight answer if those guys are in the hiring pool still or not. Poor guy was a CA on the 727 at Champion, was hired at NWA and now he's an FO at Pinnacle on ready reserve. I feel for him.

Contract carriers need to hold their management accountable. IMO, I don't really trust ours. If it meant leverage on the pilot contract, it wouldn't surprise me one bit for PT to "renegotiate" our deal with Delta to bring down our flying. Contractually, we can't go below the number of airframes we have now, but that can be re-negotiated. Although, doing so might finally make the board of directors sit up and take notice that maybe the management at PCL needs an overhaul.
From my small experience with mergers and acquisitions companies usually don't get involved in these to create more jobs. I have a feeling that if the "New Delta" decides it wants to trim some fat off the seniority list then the flowback/flowthrough program will stay in effect and we will see some of the junior Delta/NWA guys and gals flowing back to Mesaba. If Delta decides that they are properly staffed and won't need to furlough then I can see management/union axing the deal.
 

SeanD

Well-Known Member
Im curious as to why DL would keep more than one regional carrier under contract at all? Surely they will have the aircraft capacity to fly the small routes right?. Does anyone know where they are plugging in the DC9s or are they staying on NWA territory?
 

ppragman

FLIPY FLAPS!
Im curious as to why DL would keep more than one regional carrier under contract at all? Surely they will have the aircraft capacity to fly the small routes right?. Does anyone know where they are plugging in the DC9s or are they staying on NWA territory?
Competition. If they can have the two carriers competing with each other, costs associated with the contracts for the same routes will go down for delta.
 

Lowlevel

Heehee.. Member
Im curious as to why DL would keep more than one regional carrier under contract at all? Surely they will have the aircraft capacity to fly the small routes right?. Does anyone know where they are plugging in the DC9s or are they staying on NWA territory?
Not too sure where they are all going, but I just listed my sister on a flight:
ORD-CVG-PHL, both legs were on DC9's. So, yes, the 9's are running Delta (Comair) routes.
 

Cruise

Well-Known Member
Competition. If they can have the two carriers competing with each other, costs associated with the contracts for the same routes will go down for delta.
All the more reason to make the ALPA FFD policy (in the works) a reality, sooner than later. The 'competition' you speak of is nothing more than a race to the bottom of the industry. This 'competition' does nothing but bring our profession down and pad the mgmt types' pockets.

It's deplorable! :(
 
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