"1337", Job Search Etiquette, Resumes and You

I am very happy that Doug has taken the time to write this. I am amazed by the amount of email that I get that just states, "hi read your post of an opening. Here is my resume." DELETE! Sometimes I don't even get that much. Just an email with an attachment.

If you don't have the self respect to properly write your own cover letter about YOU then I don't have the time or the inclination to read what your attachment is. Heck you may have been a shuttle commander, but I never got that far. If you can't spell then its amusement for me...but when you don't get a call...I doubt you will find it amusing.

At first I was thinking that I did not want to comment on this. That I may seem like a person being an ass or something. After some thought and talking to people I changed my mind. This is a tough economy and a tough environment. At this level there are no second chances on you should have known better. Measure twice...cut once. There is a reason why a draft folder exists. USE IT! Think about what you want to say and how you want me (the employer) to interpret it.

Good luck everyone with your careers. It is what you make of it!

Sorry for a few seconds of ranting.
 
I'd actually encourage everyone else to continue using poor grammar and etiquette. It will make it a lot easier for me when/if the opportunity to move on arises!
 
Clocks said:
On the one hand, its scary that a great employee could be getting tossed aside. On the other hand...your resume is more important to you than any work project will be. Your resume is a reflection of how you work, and in reality it's probably even BETTER than the work you will produce. If you didn't bother to read your resume through..."there" or "their" could mean you wont even get called by some employers.
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:yeahthat:

If someone is the slightest bit interested in the job they had better take the time to make the cover letter and resume (or CV) PERFECT. Have AT LEAST three other people, whose judgement you trust, proof read it before you send it, then put it aside for 24 hours, then proof read it again yourself.

If the first impression isn't a good one you won't get a shot at a second impression.
 
Worst comes to worse, I can't promise next day service, but if you even want to email them both to me at doug@jetcareers.com, I'll have a look at it.

I can't promise that you'll get instant feedback, but if no one else can look at it for you, I will.

Just mark it "urgent" or something and I'll try to move it up in the queue.

Let's get some jobs, people. They're out there, forget the naysayers.
 
Does one attach the cover letter to the front of the resume, (i.e. Page 1, letter, page 2, resume) or should I start sending it as the initial email and attach only the resume in a .doc?
 
Just remember, roughly 80%* of blank, attachment-only emails are viruses.



*no data or source whatsoever to back that up
 
i posted a thread on a different forum a couple of years ago advertising an opening we had. now granted, on forums i don't typically use capital letters, but in professional correspondence i certainly do. what was shocking, was how many people did not.

apparently, some people are equally opposed to paragraphs. same for spelling out entire words, which is a problem for me as i am not up to speed on teenage text abbreviations.

many who did spell out the entire words spelled them incorrectly, or used the wrong form of the word. maybe i'm anal, but when i read "too" instead of "to" or "two", or a "their" instead of "there" i can't help but think, "imbecile." don't just spell check, as spell check won't catch these type of mistakes.

check what document you attach to the email. while i understand if you can't find flying work you might start a small business, i don't need an ad for landscaping, which someone actually sent me with an email subject line of "resume." if that actually was his resume, i'm not sure the skills are applicable.
 
fsiflyer said:
At first I was thinking that I did not want to comment on this. That I may seem like a person being an ass or something. After some thought and talking to people I changed my mind. This is a tough economy and a tough environment. At this level there are no second chances on you should have known better.
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The whole 'tough economy' thing is one thing that really bugged my bro-in-law when he was doing interviews for an actual full time position that opened up about 2 months ago. Fewer than 1/3rd of the candidates had done a single tiny second of research about the company (it's a tech company, the website and blog are important to them, and have a ton of information).

Most couldn't even briefly summarize what they thought their responsibilities would be.

Yeah, for real, more than HALF the people who came in for an interview in this "tough economy" with "great depression" unemployment rates walked into real interviews not even having bothered to understand what the job was for beyond the job description.

It stuns me how casual people are about their interviews. Or more likely...they don't give a crap. They have X weeks until unemployment ends, or they're living at home, and it makes me wonder if the vast majority of the "good" people who get laid off are really hired up right away by people they know through networking.
 
My computer skills are a bit limited.

What is the best way to make / send an attachment? I have been using Microsoft Works Work Processor. Is that OK, or is there a better way? Sometimes the format seems to get a little scrambled up when I e mail a document.
 
I have some questions for those of you that do receive e-mailed resumes, and those who have a lot more job-hunting experience than I.

Can you provide an example of what you like to see in the body of those emails? Would writing a full-on cover letter in the email body be adequately impressive, or do you typically expect and prefer something a little bit less formal?

Also, if I have people who I know will give me outstanding recommendations, is it typically appropriate to include their information in the body of the email?

Final question: If I have emailed or dropped off a resume in person, how pushy should I be when following up with the employer?
 
Along these same lines, I happened to be in the office the other day when a young man (22-25) years old came in for a interview. It was pathetic. The guy stunk, had not combed his hair for a while and his pants were hanging low, and every other word was a cuss word. Not a good way to get a job.
 
t-cart said:
Along these same lines, I happened to be in the office the other day when a young man (22-25) years old came in for a interview. It was pathetic. The guy stunk, had not combed his hair for a while and his pants were hanging low, and every other word was a cuss word. Not a good way to get a job.
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It is if you're an aspiring rap artist! :p :D
 
Roger said:
I have some questions for those of you that do receive e-mailed resumes, and those who have a lot more job-hunting experience than I.

Can you provide an example of what you like to see in the body of those emails? Would writing a full-on cover letter in the email body be adequately impressive, or do you typically expect and prefer something a little bit less formal?

Also, if I have people who I know will give me outstanding recommendations, is it typically appropriate to include their information in the body of the email?

Final question: If I have emailed or dropped off a resume in person, how pushy should I be when following up with the employer?
Click to expand...

I asked my wife who is HR Director for a company to review this thread.

She agrees that people are not replying with cover letters and not paying attention to English! She said it's so bad that, when she advertised for an HR position, she got the same lack of attention!

1. Follow instructions. If it says "to apply, do X", do it.
2. If it's an email thing, send the cover letter as the body of the email and the resume as an attachment. Some organizations, believe it or not, can't accept Word documents. Make sure you have an rtf version.
3. If it's an electronic submission, and there is a place to cut and paste your cover letter, do it. My wife is amazed at how many don't bother.
4. The cover letter is your chance to sell yourself. If you don't want to stand out in these difficult times, don't bother!
5. Get the names of everyone you speak with and send them a thank you.
6. Remember that everyone is part of the interview process, including the person on the phone, the Receptionist, etc. My wife has a form that is completed by the Receptionists.

Good luck to all.
 
Roger said:
Can you provide an example of what you like to see in the body of those emails? Would writing a full-on cover letter in the email body be adequately impressive, or do you typically expect and prefer something a little bit less formal?
Click to expand...

I preferred to see a one or two paragraph introduction in the body of the email. Express an interest in the job and do it in a way that shows you actually know something about the company and position. Use another sentence or two to highlight yourself, then explain what is attached to the email ("I've enclosed a cover letter and resume for your consideration"). Keep it short, positive, and pertinent.

Also, if I have people who I know will give me outstanding recommendations, is it typically appropriate to include their information in the body of the email?
Click to expand...

I would only put names in the body of the email if that person is known by the one receiving the email. "Jim Jones suggested your company as one where I could make a meaningful contribution." Names of people that they don't personally know are worthless. When they want to call for references they will get the information out of your attachment(s).

Final question: If I have emailed or dropped off a resume in person, how pushy should I be when following up with the employer?
Click to expand...

1. Send a Thank You card within a couple of days. "Thank you for seeing me/accepting my resume. I look forward to following up with you soon."
2. Telephone a couple of days later. Keep the call brief and don't expect any answers from them, just express your interest in their company and in the job. Ask when you can follow up with them again, and if they are vague just say "Thank you, if it's OK with you I'll call you back in a couple of weeks."
3. Call again, and do it when you said that you would in #2. If they said "call me back next week", call them next Thursday. You want to be eager but not obnoxious.
4. If they haven't yet said "Thanks, but no thanks", "you're not what we're looking for" or something similar, then just routinely stay in contact. Make yourself a note to contact them once a month. Always keep it brief, don't pester them with questions about what's happening, and stay positive. Remember, THEY DON"T OWE YOU ANYTHING. Not even an explanation of what is happening with the job that you applied for.
 
All I know is that I weep for the future of grammar and punctuation in this country. Kids writing essays in TXT speak? Not learning cursive anymore (debateable, I guess, if it is really needed). Not learning their homophones? I used to have English class, Literature, Vocabulary, etc.
 
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