Would you pay for your ATP?

AFdude411

AFdude411

New Member
Hey all. I'm like a few of you here looking to get on with a fractional. I have most of the qualifications that they're looking for .... except an ATP. I'm not going to be upgrading anytime soon. I've been at my airline 1.5 years and I will be lucky to have a job by the end of the year. What would you all do? Buy it to be more competitive or save the money?
 
When do you stop buying to become more competitive? ATP? Type rating? Type ratingS?
If you've got the time and the written done that is more than enough.
 
BajtheJino said:
If you've got the time and the written done that is more than enough.
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Sorry, but the written is not enough. To be considered at the top fractionals you must have the ATP as a minimum.

There are two choices. Stay at your present employer until upgrade and get the ATP, or go out any buy it one weekend.

AFdude411: I'd go out and get it ASAP.
 
I think all the Fractionals, FLOPS, CS, NJ, etc require an ATP. It is a bit of a bummer but paying the 1500 or so bucks at All ATPs or someplace else is a small price to pay to open a door for future employment.
 
BajtheJino said:
Well, why stop there? Why not just go ahead a buy the type while your at it.
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A type rating for something "small" like CE550 is right around 14000, that is a far cry from 1500 bucks for 3 days at All ATPs, it might even be less if you already have your written.
 
No way! When you get hired at wherever, they will send you to school to get a type rating. That is when you ahould get your ATP.

I agree with Jino here. $1500 is a lot to pay for the POSSIBILITY of a job, especially on a pilot's salary.
 
dc3flyer said:
No way! When you get hired at wherever, they will send you to school to get a type rating. That is when you ahould get your ATP.

I agree with Jino here. $1500 is a lot to pay for the POSSIBILITY of a job, especially on a pilot's salary.
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So a yes and a no? Haha. But when I get furloughed I will not be any more competitive for a job then any of the hundreds of guys who get canned with me. I think I'm going to do it.
I instructed at all ATP's too. Maybe I'll get a former employee discount. Ha.

I'm just trying to make a good decision. Thanks for all those who replied.
 
dc3flyer said:
No way! When you get hired at wherever, they will send you to school to get a type rating. That is when you ahould get your ATP.

I agree with Jino here. $1500 is a lot to pay for the POSSIBILITY of a job, especially on a pilot's salary.
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You are right the type ride and the ATP ride can be done at the same time, HOWEVER, not all companies send new hires for full PIC types just SIC types. The SIC type ride is not a full ATP ride. Many places are under contractural obligations to have both pilots be ATP rated (not necessarily type rated) thus the ATP requirement.

Keep in mind you can have a type rating in an airplane and hold a private or commercial rating. An ATP rating is a pilot rating, not training as a type rating is.

Now, in fairness I received my type rating on the company's dime BUT I was ready and willing to pay for my own if needed.
 
dc3flyer said:
No way!
$1500 is a lot to pay for the POSSIBILITY of a job, especially on a pilot's salary.
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Funny how so many guys here will shell out $5000 for a CRJ class that has zero meaning, but complain about spending $1500 on a License that you will legally hold forever.

Hmm: Spend $5000 on the possibility of a $20,000/yr job or spend $1500 on the possibility of a $70,000/yr job?

NetJets requires an ATP to be considered. To meet minimums then you HAVE to have an ATP before you apply. Every person that is hired receives a full PIC type rating. Even if you hold a Hawker type rating, you will still attend a full Hawker initial class. Most of the people we hire have an ATP and several type ratings and a few thousand PIC jet. HR will not bother with someone who doesn't have an ATP when then have 1000 apps who do.
 
NJA_Capt said:
Most of the people we hire have an ATP and several type ratings and a few thousand PIC jet. HR will not bother with someone who doesn't have an ATP when then have 1000 apps who do.
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Well, I wouldn't pay for a CRJ class or my own ATP. If my resume was in the stack with a guy that not only an ATP but also several type ratings and a few thousand hours jet PIC, then I think by me paying for my ATP in a seminole wouldn't really matter much anyway. I understand that the cert is the cert wether it is in a seminole or 747, but you know what I mean.

Just my own opinion.
 
well you could pay the 1500 bucks, get a different job quicker (most likely) and start making that money back sooner and end up ahead of where you'd be at if you were furloughed still looking for a job!
 
TDoc said:
well you could pay the 1500 bucks, get a different job quicker (most likely) and start making that money back sooner and end up ahead of where you'd be at if you were furloughed still looking for a job!
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Exactly what I'm thinking.
 
I would pay for my ATP ride no questions asked. I would certainly try to pull some strings though by either using a twin from someone I know who owns one and use a friend who is a MEI to save some dollars or go to a bargain basement weekend deal.

If I have the oppurtunity I will try to get on with a fractional/charter/part 91 outfit before I upgrade and if 1500 dollars will improve my chances of being looked at than consider it money well spent.

Ideally I will see whats out there and if I feel I have an in and will not need the ATP than i will save the money but as for places that require it as a pre-req or over 90 percent of their applicants have it then count me in. Id rather pay 1500 cash for an ATP for the chance as well as the challenge of a new rating than sit at home passed over for a job I want because of pride.
 
I bought my ATP at Sheble Aviation in Kingman, AZ back in 2005. It's probably the best thing I've done in my aviation career except for switching to logbook software (awesome).
I originally got the ATP because the company I worked at didn't give it to their pilots since they didn't have FAA approval. Then they would pay you back $1500 after you upgraded. I ended up leaving that company before upgrading though.
Having it allowed me to interview at a fractional and an LCC; I got hired by one of them and now fly an MD-80 with a pretty bright future. Meanwhile my other friends who didn't get their ATP are still at the regionals waiting for they day they are offered upgrade.

If you want to interview at any fractional, you must have it. If you want to interview at a major or LCC, all prefer it, some require it. You paid for all your other pilot ratings and certificates, why question this one? A type rating is different; it can only be used for one type of airplane. The ATP can be used to fly all types of airplanes at all companies.
 
Getting your ATP and paying for a type rating is comparing apples to oranges.

The ATP certificate is the "PhD" of flying and carries a lot more weight than a type rating on a certificate.

Last time I checked, fractionals and corporate gigs usually state in their minimum requirements "ATP". I've rarely encountered one that states a specific type rating required.
 
dc3flyer said:
No way! When you get hired at wherever, they will send you to school to get a type rating. That is when you ahould get your ATP.

I agree with Jino here. $1500 is a lot to pay for the POSSIBILITY of a job, especially on a pilot's salary.
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You have several professionals telling you that it's a good idea. Honestly, stop splurging out garbage about things you haven't a clue about it.

To the original poster, if you don't have your ATP, go get it. Several employers won't look at you if you don't have it.
 
I'm paying for mine right now. Costing me twenty five bucks per hr. for the instructor and about eighty five bucks per hr. to feed my fire breathing Apache.:)
 
ATP, type rating, and CRJ courses are all very different things IMO.

CRJ courses are a waste of money.

Type ratings should be paid for by the employer.

I like SteveC's comparison of paying for your commercial. If you need the ATP to get the interview, go get it!
 
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