Video of Drug Smugglers Shot down

[TurdBird]

Perhaps you misunderstand "Due Process"...

Procedural due process is essentially based on the concept of "fundamental fairness". As construed by the courts, it includes an individual's right to be adequately notified of charges or proceedings, and the opportunity to be heard at these proceedings. --- From Wikipedia

Where in that video did either of those two stipulations occur?

I'm pretty sure he was notified of his charges as the bullets went ripping through his wings and he was heard by at least someone on the ground because that was a big explosion.

That's where I think Due Process played a role in this video.

 

[TurdBird]

I'm sure FiveO does his job completely within the law and in a professional manner - but I don't think it's unprofessional at all for him to suggest a more efficient way to do his job - he's only suggesting a method of dealing with the scum of the earth that better protects law abiding citizens.

If a person runs from the cops, that should be probable cause for assumption of guilt. Personally, I think all police cruisers should be designed for the purpose of knocking a fleeing vehicle off the road and/or disabling it. Too many people are injured or killed by worthless a-holes fleeing from the police. Some departments have polices of not pursuing suspect vehicles - I disagree. The only way to end the constant string of police chases that endanger innocent lives is to make sure each one of them ends violently for the criminal.

Perfect and exactly. Thank you.

 

[aeroman2]

I'm pretty sure he was notified of his charges as the bullets went ripping through his wings and he was heard by at least someone on the ground because that was a big explosion.

That's where I think Due Process played a role in this video.

yes, that is exactly where it played a roll, boo hoo, everone get over it, it is just another drug dealer that needs to be ripped from the earth. why dont you all take all this info you are using to defend the dead smugglers and put it to good use. go explain why it was bad to shoot down the plane that was carrying drugs to all the family members who lost there loved ones to addictive drugs. cry me a river. get over it, I am glad they died that way, you live by the sword, you die by the sword.

 

[darrenf]

Speaking of making stuff up, where did you get this from??

umm... I dont know... Oh yeah from watching the video. You see there is a part with a PLANE in it.

Crossing OUR border?? Where do we share a border with Columbia??

:yup: THEY ARE NOT IN THIS COUNTRY... That doesnt apply to them. You do understand that dont you?

Yes, I do understand that, and I do not think it is right to exploit that under our name. If you think it is OK to treat the rest of the world inhabitants as inferior to the U.S. then perhaps you should visit a church. Someone needs to set you straight on morality.

 

[Bumblebee]

What due process? Im sorry gentleman but you two are using terms for the sake of it. They arent even in our country and are in the process of invading our air space. They are subject to military law not civilian.

Listen I can respect the fact that you have an opposing opinion but please dont make stuff up just to win a debate. Episodes of Judge Judy shouldnt find their way in this conversation.

Please dont be offended, like I said healthy conversation is good - but this is about "An unauthorized plane attempting to cross our border". Nothing else. It doesnt matter whats inside. You cant make alternating laws based on whats inside - because NO ONE knows.

No offense taken Except for the low blow about Judge Judy. If our law enforcement is involved, wherever they are, then due process should be applied. What were our people doing down there helping shoot people down? If we are involved, we should hold ourselves to a higher standard than dictators do in other countries. I thought this was in Colombia. If you look at a globe, you will see that we don't share a border with Colombia. As far as crossing our border, that aircraft would have to refuel before it ever made it to the US.

 

[darrenf]

I'm pretty sure he was notified of his charges as the bullets went ripping through his wings and he was heard by at least someone on the ground because that was a big explosion.

That's where I think Due Process played a role in this video.

You know, I had zero reason to question your professionalism as some others have, until you posted this. This is appalling to me to know that you are carrying a firearm.

 

[Bumblebee]

Perfect and exactly. Thank you.

You should just run down people running on foot then as well, heck just shoot them!

 

[darrenf]

yes, that is exactly where it played a roll, boo hoo, everone get over it, it is just another drug dealer that needs to be ripped from the earth. why dont you all take all this info you are using to defend the dead smugglers and put it to good use. go explain why it was bad to shoot down the plane that was carrying drugs to all the family members who lost there loved ones to addictive drugs. cry me a river. get over it, I am glad they died that way, you live by the sword, you die by the sword.

Where are people defending drug smugglers?? If you re-read the posts you might find that what people are upset about is the downing of a civilian aircraft. Doesn't matter if it has suspected criminals in it, it is still a civilian aircraft. It is not penetrating a country, it is about to leave a country, that is where the problem with those actions lie.

 

[Bumblebee]

If a person runs from the cops, that should be probable cause for assumption of guilt. Personally, I think all police cruisers should be designed for the purpose of knocking a fleeing vehicle off the road and/or disabling it. Too many people are injured or killed by worthless a-holes fleeing from the police. Some departments have polices of not pursuing suspect vehicles - I disagree. The only way to end the constant string of police chases that endanger innocent lives is to make sure each one of them ends violently for the criminal.

I have a problem with making it end violently for the criminal . . . but I do agree it would be great for law enforcement to have a way to disable cars. Maybe with some way to ground the vehicle or disable its electrical system. It is not OK to use more force than is reasonable, I'm sure that 5-0 will agree to that.

 

[darrenf]

I have a problem with making it end violently for the criminal . . . but I do agree it would be great for law enforcement to have a way to disable cars. Maybe with some way to ground the vehicle or disable its electrical system. It is not OK to use more force than is reasonable, I'm sure that 5-0 will agree to that.

I would hope so, but unless he forgot the sarcasm tag, the following makes me doubt that.

I'm pretty sure he was notified of his charges as the bullets went ripping through his wings and he was heard by at least someone on the ground because that was a big explosion.

That's where I think Due Process played a role in this video.

 

[TurdBird]

You know, I had zero reason to question your professionalism as some others have, until you posted this. This is appalling to me to know that you are carrying a firearm.

I'm sorry you have to feel that way.

I have a problem with making it end violently for the criminal . . . but I do agree it would be great for law enforcement to have a way to disable cars. Maybe with some way to ground the vehicle or disable its electrical system. It is not OK to use more force than is reasonable, I'm sure that 5-0 will agree to that.

Yes I do agree with you. But, in some situations there is no other option other than a violent outcome. For example in this one, had the plane made it past the border it would have been long gone. There was no one waiting from the bordering country to intercept it. He would have been free to go drop the load, destroy a few more peoples chances of recovering from addiction, make millions, and do it again next week.

I do feel that this was the proper use of force.

 

[darrenf]

I'm sorry you have to feel that way.



Yes I do agree with you. But, in some situations there is no other option other than a violent outcome. For example in this one, had the plane made it past the border it would have been long gone. There was no one waiting from the bordering country to intercept it. He would have been free to go drop the load, destroy a few more peoples chances of recovering from addiction, make millions, and do it again next week.

I do feel that this was the proper use of force.

I am curious, as a officer of the law, in which instances are you authorized to use deadly force? Can you list them, or are there too many to list here. And before some of you get uptight, yes I know this aircraft was in a foreign country!

 

[killbilly]

I'm sorry you have to feel that way.



Yes I do agree with you. But, in some situations there is no other option other than a violent outcome. For example in this one, had the plane made it past the border it would have been long gone. There was no one waiting from the bordering country to intercept it. He would have been free to go drop the load, destroy a few more peoples chances of recovering from addiction, make millions, and do it again next week.

I do feel that this was the proper use of force.

Force questions aside, I have a question about smuggling, and I imagine you have some expertise in this regard...

...the guys doing the nuts and bolts transporting...they're usually mules, right? Guys who make a few hundred bucks doing the bidding of the distribution side of the business, right?

I ask because I have heard/read stories about some people being extorted into these services - do this for us or we torture and kill your family. One story about that I heard was a pilot. This was well before I found JC.

I don't know how much truth there was to the story (I have some reason to question the truthfulness of the person who relayed it to me, despite the fact that he is a Federal LEO) but it was the first thing I thought of in this scenario.

Because we don't know the intent or circumstances surrounding the situation, I find it hard to automatically adopt a 'kill em' all' attitude. There is too much gray area for it to be a black and white issue, in my opinion.

 

[Murdoughnut]

Force questions aside, I have a question about smuggling, and I imagine you have some expertise in this regard...

...the guys doing the nuts and bolts transporting...they're usually mules, right? Guys who make a few hundred bucks doing the bidding of the distribution side of the business, right?

I ask because I have heard/read stories about some people being extorted into these services - do this for us or we torture and kill your family. One story about that I heard was a pilot. This was well before I found JC.

I don't know how much truth there was to the story (I have some reason to question the truthfulness of the person who relayed it to me, despite the fact that he is a Federal LEO) but it was the first thing I thought of in this scenario.

Because we don't know the intent or circumstances surrounding the situation, I find it hard to automatically adopt a 'kill em' all' attitude. There is too much gray area for it to be a black and white issue, in my opinion.

There's a really good movie about it (in Spanish) - Maria full of Grace or something like that. But in that film, she volunteered to be a mule to make money. Regardless, it's still an attack on U.S. citizens from a foreign enemy.

 

[darrenf]

Regardless, it's still an attack on U.S. citizens from a foreign enemy.

Can you explain that? Where does the U.S. share a border with Columbia??

 

[MikeBurbank]

I didnt know it was columbians - I thought the american sounding guy saying 4 miles was talking about the US border. If you know its Columbians then why do you keep bringing up the American Legal process?

 

[darrenf]

I didnt know it was columbians - I thought the american sounding guy saying 4 miles was talking about the US border. If you know its Columbians then why do you keep bringing up the American Legal process?

Mike, Re-read the thread, it's been answered.

 

[Murdoughnut]

Can you explain that? Where does the U.S. share a border with Columbia??

Easy - they're bringing the drugs into the U.S. No border needed. At least the Iraqis never came onto our soil and dispersed lethal toxins to our populace.

 

[darrenf]

Easy - they're bringing the drugs into the U.S. No border needed. At least the Iraqis never came onto our soil and dispersed lethal toxins to our populace.

They were not bringing drugs into the US, if they were then we could shoot them down when they approach our airspace. This is not the case here. Just because something we don't want here is moving in this direction doesn't mean it is coming here. I am not saying this wasn't going to eventually end up here. What I am saying is that killing someone that early in the progression is immoral. There can be other opportunities to stop and arrest should the political will be there. And like I posted early on in this thread, not all planes behaving this way are drug smugglers. And as others have posted, some people are not smuggling drugs by choice.

So because something is illegal here, it should not cross borders anywhere. Doesn't seem a bit arrogant to you??

 

[Bumblebee]

Easy - they're bringing the drugs into the U.S. No border needed. At least the Iraqis never came onto our soil and dispersed lethal toxins to our populace.

I agree, and we should not be there, either. Afganastan yes, Iraq, no.